Ultex vs Trend Diamond stones

[transatlantic]

I recently purchased a 300g 3x8" Ultex Diamond sharpening stone, hoping to remove a lot of material in a hurry.

The results have been quite disappointing though. Not only does it not remove material very quickly, but also produces quite a reflective surface? Not what Id expect? Which leads me to think its not quite as course as stated?

Buy cheap by twice?


Has anyone had experience comparing the Tren stones to the Ultex stones?

 

[custard]

I did a little review of Ultex a few years ago,

https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/threads/ultex-diamond-stones.100153/
Maybe not the highest quality diamond stones, but the price is only a small fraction of some others.

 

[Droogs]

I have Ultex plates a 300/600 and a 1000/1200 and have never found them to be any problem. I have had them for a while and do only use the 300 when refurbishing or repairing a really bade blade/iron. Never notice it being slow to remove material but as with all the grits on the Ultex, once I get a reflective almost mirror surface when using them, I know it is time to step up to the next one (how I always thought they worked). On doing so, I do notice a marked difference in the feel of the stroke. I have a Trend 8" and never really got on with it as I feel the jump in grits is way to big 300 turn it over and its 1K and nothing inbetween. For me I like to go to the grit I want for the particular job and that is not by such a big jump.

When I want a finer edge for pairing etc then I switch to my 3K/8K waterstone

hth

 

[Chisteve]

I have ultex diamond plates 300 600 and 1000, I had been using oil stones and not tried any other diamond plates but found them good just need to keep clean was using window cleaner this tended to rust the plates now using cheap lidl kitchen cleaner that seems to work out better and keeps the plates cleaner and works better

I use the plates after using wet stone grinder on mainly rough plane blades and carving chisels to hone then finally a fine oil stone and then buffing on bench grinder

Hope that helps

 

[transatlantic]

Hmm. Maybe I am expecting too much from the 300 stones then. I guess I was expecting them to cut several times quicker than the 1000, but it feels much less than that.

 

[DBT85]

I honestly can't remember the grits on my 3 but I never found an issue.

When in use there were definitely marks on the blade where the coarser stone wasn't as fine as the higher ones.

Do you have any other diamond plates or was this your first? How much material are you trying to remove here?

 

[transatlantic]

I honestly can't remember the grits on my 3 but I never found an issue.

When in use there were definitely marks on the blade where the coarser stone wasn't as fine as the higher ones.

Do you have any other diamond plates or was this your first? How much material are you trying to remove here?

Well - it's obviously quite a difficult thing to describe/measure. All I can say is that I don't notice much of a difference in the amount of material removed when compared to the 1000 grit. Both by looking at the surface generated, as well as the amount of material in the "swarf".

 

[Ttrees]

I reckon if you use a honing guide then you ought to have a bench grinder, or a lap with sandpaper or both even if you are nervous about bluing the steel.
I was experiencing the same issues and was looking for a faster cutting hone, until I got used to sharpening by hand, now my 400grit ebay hone is plenty fast.

Your rough hone will be sufficient, if you spend more time on it, aswell as on the grinding and less time on the bevel of your fine grit hone, but more time on the flat.
Keep that micro bevel tiny, if its approaching 1mm then grind back again.

Tom

 

[DBT85]

Well - it's obviously quite a difficult thing to describe/measure. All I can say is that I don't notice much of a difference in the amount of material removed when compared to the 1000 grit. Both by looking at the surface generated, as well as the amount of material in the "swarf".

Do you have a 300/1000 plate or one of each? If so are they both Ultex?

If you can, try snapping a photo of the area you've been working on after a go on the 300 and then again on the 1000, though personally I have one in the middle. The 1000 I have doesn;t requie long on a strop with green compound to get a mirror finish.

 

[transatlantic]

I missed one important point. This is the back chisels.

 

[DBT85]

I missed one important point. This is the back chisels.

As in the back of the chisel? Do you have a hump or a hollow? Humps are a pain to remove.

 

[Ttrees]

Ed65, hope he's doing well, haven't seen him around, used to think well enough of the Ali express hones, If I recall they went as low as 150 grit?

I bonded two of my similar ebay DMD hones to some black granite
(the shiny slightly convex side of the granite)
The hones were not new and had grime on them beforehand, got a scrape and used some of Lidl's fast acting epoxy and clamped them up.
They work well and no sign of the bond giving up.

Tom

 

[transatlantic]

As in the back of the chisel? Do you have a hump or a hollow? Humps are a pain to remove.

Yeah, sorry, the back of the chisel.

It's a hollow

 

[DBT85]

Yeah, sorry, the back of the chisel.

It's a hollow

Are you trying to get the entire back flat? With a hollow just get the first bit of the back flat.

 

[transatlantic]

It's a hollow that extends to the cutting edge.

Anyway - thats besides the point of this thread.

 

[Ttrees]

If you're still wondering if there is a difference in either of the 300 grits,
it might be worth seeing if they are mono-crystalline or poly-crystalline hones.
I doubt either would compare to ed65's suggestion of a rougher grit.
https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/threads/your-cheapest-honing-setup-buying-new-only.102548/
Alternatively, of you have a glass or counter lap, you could buy some fancy abrasive paper from the likes of homebase for tool steel, but at about 15 quid a roll expensive.
Regular rolls in something like 100 grit sold by the meter will work but messy and slower,
I'm still to mean to buy that fancy stuff, either way I'd cut the strips down half the width, so you can overhang the chisel off of the abrasive edge on a skew, without rounding the corners.
You can introduce the front when you want.

 

[Bm101]

I bought a couple of the trend stones when they got talked about on here as going cheap Trans.
They were advertised as single side and were glued into plastic cases. A couple of them came out of the cases and they were double sided stones. I don't know the grade but a couple got well used. A couple got given away to male relatives poking about in the shed... 'Ooohhh What are these?' *Sigh*
Alright but a little rough and not 'perfectly' flat (easy there Tom Trees!) Some users at the time were disgruntled as they got a couple that were really not flat.
*This might just have been that bunch. mind*
I believe the advice at the time was to check them for flat before unwrapping.
I bought the ultex later on sale (I have 4 grades) after reading Custard's thread comparing them to his expensive ones. And if it helps, I never went back to the trend, different class, although the trend were great at a really low level grit for hogging off steel if you like buying rusty old irons or chisels etc.
I since bought a used sorby on here so the last trend is consigned to a carnage box on a shelf somewhere...
Hence the ultex 300 doesn't get a huge amount of a challenge. I do use it though if I have been too lazy to sharpen properly and left it a little too long. It's enough then, to raise a wire.
TBF Without the Sorby the trend would still get the occasional use. As it is, occasional regrinds go on the machine, then onto the ultex to finish (and a wipe on the strop etc).

 

[Ttrees]

Aye Bm101, I do think the Ultex look good value when that perodic half price sale is on..
I haven't seen anyone try to flatten those by bending them..
The thin hones take a bit of bending and don't shear off diamonds, so I wonder if it would be the same with the bonded nickel plate.
Tom

 

[Droogs]

I think they are excellent value. I have had mine for around 5 years and they are still going strong. Not had much use this years mind you as can't get into the workshop. I have 2 plates that cover course 300, medium 600, fine 1k and extra fine 1200. If a keener edge is needed before stropping then I have a 3k/8k waterstone. I just use window cleaner from lidl

 

[powertools]

I think that ITS have re branded the Ultex stones as Vaunt. I have got 1 of each and can only say that I am very pleased with them both. If I have got something that is rusty and in poor shape I also have a set of 3 diamond stones that are about £6 that are very cause and I use them first to remove the worst of it before I move on to the ITS stones.
Just to add I think at the moment ITS have a special offer on the Vaunt single sided stones,