tyzack tenon saw

[neilyweely]

picked up a tenon saw at auction today, which cost a fiver!!

Lovely handle, blade is like a butter knife!! It is blunt, and the blade has a bend in it. Not a serious one, but noticeable

any advice on sharpening, sorting this saw please. I have an eclipse set for the saw, but again I don't quite get it.

please, any help will be greatly appreciated. Am considering sending it in to get it sorted, but if i could do it I would prefer it a lot

thanks folks

P,s does anyone know a good saw sharpening service/shop in my area?
Bedford area, or northants. Ta.

 

[bugbear]

picked up a tenon saw at auction today, which cost a fiver!!

Lovely handle, blade is like a butter knife!! It is blunt, and the blade has a bend in it. Not a serious one, but noticeable

any advice on sharpening, sorting this saw please.

http://www.geocities.com/plybench/saw_sharpen.html

However, I will say that getting the equipment and skill to do a good job, especially on a poor condition saw, is a long road.

BugBear

 

[neilyweely]

Bugbear
cheers mate

thats kinda what I thought.

there is a saw co jus down the road from me, guess I should take it there.

This is one blunt saw, some of the teeth have worn down to nothing. How much do you think I ought to be lookin at, bearing in mind it cost me a fiver i didn't plan on paying vast sums for sharpening it?

Must admit though, I like the look of it quite a bit so probly will pay to get it done.

 

[bugbear]

Bugbear
cheers mate

thats kinda what I thought.

there is a saw co jus down the road from me, guess I should take it there.

This is one blunt saw, some of the teeth have worn down to nothing. How much do you think I ought to be lookin at, bearing in mind it cost me a fiver i didn't plan on paying vast sums for sharpening it?

A "severe" sharpen and set is going to be at least a tenner, I think. I'm, not too aware of commercial rates, since I taught myself.

I'm afraid that's the viewpoint that killed traditional (soft) saws. How much you would be prepared to pay if someone had given you the saw - more or less than now you've paid a fiver for it?

Ultimately, if you want the rewards of a trad saw (looks nice, comfy handle, cuts well when sharpened, can be sharpened to suit the task) you have to pay the price, either in cash or effort.

Hardpoint saws are a shortcut, and widely (and perfectly legitimately) adopted because of it.

BugBear

 

[neilyweely]

hey bugbear

I went to the local saw shop today, who are quite a good supplier and repairer of saws and router bits. they said they cannot do anything with it, that its a lovely old saw but that it is such a skilled and time consuming job that no-one wants to do it, they were very good about it, and offered to shape it for me, but that I would have to sharpen it myself.

This saw is FLAT, all the teeth have worn to nothing and it is obviously quite useless as it is. I am in Bedford, does ANYONE know anyone who can HELP!!!!!

Otherwise I will have a crack , but will probly wreck it.

I need help here.

 

[paulm]

Have a look here Neil, lots of interesting stuff, and down near the bottom is a link to a pretty comprehensive article on sharpening.

http://www.vintagesaws.com/cgi-bin/fram ... brary.html

I used it to rehab my old man's greatly abused tenon saw and was a lot easier and more rewarding than I thought, although I did do it rip for cutting tenon cheeks which is a lot easier than crosscut admitedly.

I would give it a go, it's already useless and you have to start somewhere, not much chance of making it any worse !!!

Cheers, Paul.

 

[neilyweely]

ok chisel

notice you have answered my pleas for help before, thanks a lot my friend. If there is anything I can do........

within reason

Cheers mate, have copied all that text and saved it in a word doc, so will peruse at leisure later on...

Many thanks

 

[bugbear]

...I did do it rip for cutting tenon cheeks which is a lot easier than crosscut admitedly.

Yes - just to emphasize, IMHO a "quite fine" cross cut saw is about the hardest job of all.

Somewhere around a 14tpi tenon (shoulder) cutting saw.

BugBear

 

[neilyweely]

bugbear


ok, so today I bought a triangular file, 2 in fact, and read the text you sent me,

must admit I still don't fancy it mate, if i could find a pro to do the job for me I would pay for it, so.....

Any ideas at all?

 

[Paul Chapman]

Any ideas at all?

Why not get some rubbish saws that you don't mind spoiling and practice on those till you get the hang of it. Better than spoiling a potentially good saw, I would have thought.

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[Rich]

Hi Neil, try Bedford saws, the chap often posts on here and he sounds very helpful.
Rich.

 

[neilyweely]

paul

You are, of course, quite right. trouble is I have been lookin for som old saws for a while now, and the first I found was this old tyzack brass back tenon. Will it work on a hardpoint?

Rich

Hello buddy, Bedford Saw is exactly where I went in the first place. Nice guys, all of them, but they are the ones who said it just wasn't worth them doing. They have the saw at the mo though, and are shaping the teeth for me ( i hope )
Thanks for the idea though, any other ideas????

Cheers all.

 

[bugbear]

paul

You are, of course, quite right. trouble is I have been lookin for som old saws for a while now, and the first I found was this old tyzack brass back tenon. Will it work on a hardpoint?

Rich

Hello buddy, Bedford Saw is exactly where I went in the first place. Nice guys, all of them, but they are the ones who said it just wasn't worth them doing. They have the saw at the mo though, and are shaping the teeth for me ( i hope )
Thanks for the idea though, any other ideas????

Cheers all.

OK. If you want to sharpen this saw, you need to learn to sharpen saws (doh!).

You will need some equipment:

* saw vice
* ordinary file
* saw jointer
* triangular files
* saw set


A metal saw vice (in this country) is rare and/or expensive.

If you have a large, deep throated metalwork vice, you might get by with that.

However, good saw vices can be made:

http://www.cornishworkshop.co.uk/wwsawvice.html

http://dlaker.googlepages.com/Dscn4688s.jpg

(Alf subsequently lucked into a Diston D3 vise...)



You can get by (rather well) without a saw jointer, and in any case, a wooden block will serve. When topping and/or jointing the teeth, joint hold the file square across - that's the only purpose of a saw jointer, holding the file square.

Triangular file - easy to get.

For cross cut saws I strongly recommend my rake control gadget - I never had any success before I made it.

http://www.geocities.com/plybench/shop_ ... le_pointer

Saw set - Eclipse 77, 1-2 quid at any car boot.

For the rest, my page has some info, and many links; Follow and read.

Twice.

http://www.geocities.com/plybench/saw_sharpen.html

Then go to a car boot, and buy a panel or hand saw. Should cost a quid. Look for a comfy handle; you never know, you might get a good saw.

Larger saws have larger teeth, which are more labour, but less concentration. Practice on this, before trying your nice Tyzack.

Bets of luck, and if you have any questions that aren't answered in my page, and the pages it links to - ask away!

BugBear

 

[neilyweely]

ok mate,
I have an old rip saw at my dads, I'll try out on that.

Bugbear, thanks a lot for taking the time to help a novice saw sharpener out. If you are ever coming out this way (Bedford) drop me a line and we'll talk saws and chisels!!!

Thanks again!
Neil

 

[Harbo]

Following a previous thread I am having another go at recutting my old Tyzac at 14TPI using a pair of hacksaw blades as a template.
Initial cuts only so far with a small hacksaw.

I have been reading Chris Schwarz's article on Western Backsaws in the Spring Woodworking mag. Historically, the Dovetail and Tenon saws were filed for rip cut - the Carcase and Sash saws were filed cross cut.

Rip is definitely easier than Xcut so perhaps I will stick to that with this one?

Here's my take on the Brent Beach jig:

The file has to be adjusted to be parallel to the dowel guide rod.

Rod - sorry about large pics - I thought I had solved that?

 

[Paul Chapman]

That looks interesting, Rod. Let's know how it turns out.

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[neilyweely]

harbo, paul et al

I had tried using a paper template to guide me on the saw blade, and never thought of using another saw blade, I guess it would work better.
Bedford Saw Co have the saw at the moment, I am confident they will shape it up nicely, and then i have to sharpen it.
So i will try your method with another blade, assuming it works ok.
Let me know how you get on Harbo, I need all the help I can get!!!

cheers all.

neil

 

[bugbear]

harbo, paul et al

I had tried using a paper template to guide me on the saw blade, and never thought of using another saw blade, I guess it would work better.

Not if you want an unusual pitch and/or spacing; I find paper templates work well, since you just file "through" them.

Once the teeth positions are marked, the paper comes off anyway.

BugBear

 

[BedfordSaw]

Hi Guys,

Thanks for the comments.

It's a problem that we have to live with now. We used to sharpen so many hand/tenon saws, that we have repetitive strain in our arms and joints.

For this reason, we cannot train anyone to do this job as they too would end up with this condition too.

Also finding good quality files is becoming really hard!

There was never a good enough machine made to sharpen hand saws, but we do however have an old machine that re-cuts the teeth.

We have 'neilyweely's' saw in our shop at the moment, and hopefully we can do something with it although it is in really bad shape!

 

[bugbear]

Hi Guys,

Thanks for the comments.

It's a problem that we have to live with now. We used to sharpen so many hand/tenon saws, that we have repetitive strain in our arms and joints.

For this reason, we cannot train anyone to do this job as they too would end up with this condition too.

Also finding good quality files is becoming really hard!

Yes; I think sharpening (or more generally "looking after") old saws has to be done for love - there's no money it.

BugBear