Ts 200 vs Kity 419

[smparry]

Thinking of upgrading from my trusty Triton 2000. Trawling the internet, it looks like I can get a second hand Kity 419 with all the kit for about the same price as a new Axminster TS 200. Not sure which way to go. Would appreciate some input.

 

[jasonB]

Have a read of this posted a couple of days ago

https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/kity ... hlight=419

Jason

 

[big soft moose]

yep thats my thread and i'd say kity everytime - assuming of course you get a good one which hasnt been mullered by its previous owners.

Its not that the axi is a bad saw per se - we have one at work and with a certain ammount of fettling it produces perfectly acceptable results (see also the thread entitled "fettling a ts200" by wizer ) but the 419 is a different class.

The principle points in my experience ( and i have the 419 at home but the ts200 at work so i'm able to give direct comparison) where the 419 stands out are

a) The TS200 has a cast iron table (and sliding table) wheras the 419 has an alloy which looks and performs like cast iron but doesnt rust

b) The right hand table in the axi is one big sheet of steel and you have to level to the main table is with sets of washers which is a pig to get right (on our one there werent enough washers so we had to make more), on the 419 it is two peices of steel which are exactly the right size. - having two peices also makes it easier to insert a router table if you want to go that route.

c) on the TS200 the sliding table rail is held on with square bolts which are quite fiddly to get right so you wouldnt want to be dismounting it on a regular basis - on my 419 the fixing has handles which can be quickly undone ( I asume this is a standard feature tho wouldnt swear to it as it could be something that ed added)

d) The TS200 has a seperate handle for blade tilt which sticks out the side making it difficult to fit into a cabinet, the 419 has a double function handle for height and tilt on the front.

e) Although both are induction motor saws and thus quieter than the cheap brush motored ones the 419 is quieter still than the Ts200

f) The general standard of engineering and finish on the 419 is higher (e.g the blade and the fence are bang on parralel without fettling - on our axi we had tom undo the mounting bolts and nudge it arround.)

g) The blade supplied with the ts200 leaves a lot to be desired - while the blade that came with the 419 (ie the original which ed also gave me) is better but still not brilliant - with either saw i'd recomend an aftermarket blade

The only proviso i'd make to these points is that kity have relatively recently moved production from france to the far east and quality may have suffered as a result - mine is 8 years old and is french but i dont know what the cut off timerscale is.

also which ever one you get you probably ought to do the below table dust extraction mod - see toms thread for details - as the as standard below table dust extraction isnt great on either model - on my 419 ed had already done it , while we have just done it on the ts200 and it makles a big difference

 

[smparry]

Thanks for some excellent advice. I was leaning towards the Kity and you've answered all my questions. Thanks for taking the time.

Cheers

Mark

 

[RogerS]

I prefer a cast iron table because then I can use Magswitches. I find these very good when ripping etc. and personally think that they help safety.

I have a Kity spindle moulder and thought that the top was cast iron. Then I found, to my disappointment, that it was cast aluminium and so my Magswitches fell off .

 

[big soft moose]

I prefer a cast iron table because then I can use Magswitches. I find these very good when ripping etc. and personally think that they help safety.

I have a Kity spindle moulder and thought that the top was cast iron. Then I found, to my disappointment, that it was cast aluminium and so my Magswitches fell off .

When i say "alloy" on the 419 it is a cast steel alloy and is still magnetic and to all intents and purposes works just like a cast iron table - just with the added benefit that you dont get surface rust

 

[woodbloke]

I've been using a French made K419 now for around 10 years and in all that time it's never let me down, nor have I had to adjust it. I've done the mod to the extraction system which makes a huge difference and have fitted a zero tol insert plate.

The aluminium tables have caused no bother at all either. One of the issues with the cheaper TS200 is that the tables may not be flat and true (worth checking)...not so on the K419 with it's al table's which are spot on.

I've now sold mine to a forum member who's collecting it this Saturday - Rob

 

[big soft moose]

I've been using a French made K419 now for around 10 years and in all that time it's never let me down, nor have I had to adjust it. I've done the mod to the extraction system which makes a huge difference and have fitted a zero tol insert plate.

The aluminium tables have caused no bother at all either. One of the issues with the cheaper TS200 is that the tables may not be flat and true (worth checking)...not so on the K419 with it's al table's which are spot on.

I've now sold mine to a forum member who's collecting it this Saturday - Rob

wait a minuite rob are you saying that your main table is ali - mine (which was eds) appears to be attractive to magnets which is why i assumed it was alloy steel ?

 

[woodbloke]

I've been using a French made K419 now for around 10 years and in all that time it's never let me down, nor have I had to adjust it. I've done the mod to the extraction system which makes a huge difference and have fitted a zero tol insert plate.

The aluminium tables have caused no bother at all either. One of the issues with the cheaper TS200 is that the tables may not be flat and true (worth checking)...not so on the K419 with it's al table's which are spot on.

I've now sold mine to a forum member who's collecting it this Saturday - Rob

wait a minuite rob are you saying that your main table is ali - mine (which was eds) appears to be attractive to magnets which is why i assumed it was alloy steel ?

Yep...aluminium, still good though, nothing wrong with it in any way, 'cept it's susceptible to the odd ding - Rob

 

[Mr Ed]

I've been using a French made K419 now for around 10 years and in all that time it's never let me down, nor have I had to adjust it. I've done the mod to the extraction system which makes a huge difference and have fitted a zero tol insert plate.

The aluminium tables have caused no bother at all either. One of the issues with the cheaper TS200 is that the tables may not be flat and true (worth checking)...not so on the K419 with it's al table's which are spot on.

I've now sold mine to a forum member who's collecting it this Saturday - Rob

wait a minuite rob are you saying that your main table is ali - mine (which was eds) appears to be attractive to magnets which is why i assumed it was alloy steel ?

I always assumed it was non-magnetic although I don't think I ever actually checked.

Ed

 

[big soft moose]

ive checked and its sort of semi magnetic - ie magnets will stick to it but only in places - i would guess that it is aluminium but the magnets are sticking to the steel mounting brackets under the ali - doh

makes no difference to me anyway as i dont use magswitches.

one thing i would stress for the potential buyers like the OP is that this table is a thick lump of cast aluminium - which is virtually identical to the cast iron top on the ts200 (except flatter) - we are not talking about the cheap pressed aluminium tables you get on budget saws

 

[greggy]

i have a kity 419 for the last 5 years, i love it. its well made, solid,reliable and most of all its accurate to boot.

 

[would not]

I'm collecting my Kity this weekend and have done a search for Toms extraction mod thread, does anyone know were it's hiding?

 

[woodbloke]

I'm collecting my Kity this weekend and have done a search for Toms extraction mod thread, does anyone know were it's hiding?

Credit to Bean here for the first member to do the extraction mod on the K419. I saw what he did on his saw and was impressed...it really does improve the extraction, which is total pants without it - Rob

 

[MickCheese]

Well I am very pleased you all like the Kity 419 as I am collecting one this weekend as well.

I have the small Kity Planer thicknesser, the 439, and I am very pleased with it, very quiet for something that spins so fast.

Mick

 

[Karl]

I've now sold mine to a forum member who's collecting it this Saturday - Rob

Hey Rob - when's the new saw arriving then ? And what are you getting?

 

[woodbloke]

I've now sold mine to a forum member who's collecting it this Saturday - Rob

Hey Rob - when's the new saw arriving then ? And what are you getting?

Hi Karl - I've cut all the material I need for the jobs that'll keep me going for the rest of this year, so I decided to let the saw go early as there was some interest in it after Ed sold his.
Current thinking is pointing me towards the Jet JTS 600, mainly 'cos of possible weight restrictions on my suspended floor and also one of size. I'll be finishing work next year shortly after Christmas, so there'll be a sizable order going into Ax :wink: for replacement of all the 'shop kit (so it'll be up for grabs later on)...once I've strengthened the floor - Rob

 

[big soft moose]

I'm collecting my Kity this weekend and have done a search for Toms extraction mod thread, does anyone know were it's hiding?

its called fettling a ts200 and is in general woodworking - one thing i would note is its not necessary to go to the extent that tom did with replacing the side panels and such.

basically you take the side panels off for access - take the blade off and the gullet - and then you can unbolt the dust collector that sits under the blade - this includes the mount for the riving knife so you need to make a spacer so this can be refitted.

you then put the sides back on and seal up all the holes with duct tape - and build a wooden hopper to sit below the saw and connect to a 4" dia DE pipe - and seal the hopper to the saw with more duct tape - and thats it - simples ( one point to note is that if you want to tilt the blade you have to take the tape off tilt it then put it back on)

If its you that is buying robs 419 you will probably find that he has already done the mod

If the mood takes you you can also pop out one of the panels from the right hand wing and replace it with an offcut of kitchen worktop with a router plate let in - et voila a router table ! (though note that if you do this you will need to buy a full length fence as the standard rip fence isnt long enough to use with a router)

 

[MickCheese]

If its you that is buying robs 419 you will probably find that he has already done the mod

No it's me and I cannot wait.

Mick

 

[would not]

Got my saw, it's had a set of wheels put on it which it makes it handy for trundling around the workshop.
It does require a little alignment, most things seem to be slightly out of alignment but everything seems adjustable.
The first thing I did was to get the blade in line with the T-slot.
I think I will take it all apart to do the extraction mod before fettling all the tables, slides and fences.