Trade qualifications

[Anonymous]

Had a debate with another maker today about advertising as a cabinetmaker, whats peoples opinion on what person warrents the title cabinetmaker, i.e. trade qualifications, time served or just the quality of the product you make.

 

[Colin C]

Hi Senior

I would say just the quality of the product you make as it shows with some of the people on here could hold they heads high and call them selfs cabinet makers.

They dont have the other two

 

[Anonymous]

I am not aware that you actually need any formal qualifications to call yourself a 'cabinetmaker'.

What about 'carpenter'? Do you have to be time-served to call yourself this or is it just an overall term for anyone who makes their living working with wood?

Norm is a 'Master Carpenter'. Turns out that this term means absolutely nothing at all in America and is just what he chooses to call himself.

The term 'cabinetmaker' does, I think, suggest to the public at large a craftsman of skill producing high quality work. I am more than happy to try to live up to that expectation.

I don't know about your formal qualifications, Senior, but from looking at the photos of your work there is no doubt that you can call yourself a cabinetmaker!

Duncan (Woodwork A-level)
The Cabinet Makers Ltd

 

[Paul Chapman]

Given that anyone could call themselves a cabinetmaker, the only thing that really counts is the quality of the product they make. If I was going to employ a cabinetmaker to make something for me, I would want to see examples of what he could do.

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[cant-weld-wood]

i agree with paul chapman on this one quailty is wot counts.
i work in the car trade as a mechanic have now papers to say that i can do the job just good referances from people.
i have worked along side people with good qualifications from there exams but when it comes down to using the spanner they might as well use a block of butter on a hot exhaust.

 

[woodbloke]

I think its the quality of the product that you can produce together with the time taken to do it. Given enough time and a little practice, most reasonably proficient people could turn out a cracking job......its doing in it the hours, under pressure that counts - Rob

 

[Paul Chapman]

together with the time taken to do it.

Good point, Rob. I reckon if some of us hobby woodworkers (well, me at any rate ) tried to do it for a living, we'd probably starve :shock: :lol:

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[The Restorer]

Hi folks,

The term cabinetmaker is an historic one dating back to the days of the trade guilds. Trade guilds were all powerful and could control who made what and what they could call themselves. They also controlled materials, prices and standards. The standards were enforced by viewers and searchers who had the power of entry and inspection to any workshop. For an in depth view egt yourself a copy of victor chinnery's "Oak Furniture the british tradition".

Joiners and carpenters were the original wood trades along with turners and carvers . Riots and street fights between gangs of apprentices were quite common to protect the rights of the trades. :shock:

The carpenters were the first established trade being responsible mainly for timber frame house building with hutchmakers making the boarded furniture mainly held together with nails and iron bands. The joiners were mainly responsible for the internal frame and panel work. Joiners later became responsible for internal furniture basically using mortise and tenon joinery.

The age of the cabinetmaker came much later with the influx of makers from what is now Holland. They introduced the dovetail and veneering (amongst other things). Their furniture was much more sophisticated, higher classed, with shaped legs and a lighter appearance.

So going back to the original question; if your work is in building wooden houses then you are a carpenter.

If you make internal fittings for houses such as staircases, windows and doors, as well as internal furniture using mortises and tenons, then you are a joiner. If you make furniture in a crude manner, butt joining timbers to each other using nails and no real joints, then you are a hutchmaker.

If, however you make your furniture using a variety of joints including dovetails and you can veneer and your furniture is of a sophisticated, light and classy nature then you can call yourself a cabinetmaker.

Of course if you can do all of this and repair the work of others carrying out various hand finishes including french polishing. Then you, my friend, are top of the tree and can call yourself a furniture restorer :wink:

Hope this helps

Stephen
Conservator and Restorer of Antique Furniture.
Designer and Maker of Fine Furniture.
:wink: :wink:

 

[ProShop]

Thanks for the detailed informative post Steve,
I didn't know the bit about the hutchmaker, so I've learned something interesting

 

[Anonymous]

I guess I come in somewhere between a hutchmaker and a cabinetmaker then! :lol:

Seriously though, while I am sure that the historical demarcations upon which you base your definitions are correct, I sense a degree of subjectivity here.

Just because the original Dutch cabinetmakers used veneering, hand cut dovetails, elaborate legs, and French Polish surely does not necesserily mean that other techniques and design features put one outside of the definition of a cabinet maker 300 years later.

Time moves on. If Chippendale, Hepplewhite, or Sheraton had had a Leigh jig and router available, I am sure that they would have found a use for it. The same is probably true of veneered MDF and AC lacquers! They used the most up-to-date methods and materials available to them.

I am proud to call myself a cabinetmaker, even though I make very little reproduction furniture, and use few hand tools, even though I am fairly proficient in their use.

The important thing today, as it was hundreds of years ago, is to produce distintive work of a high quality in the shortest possible time. That way a profit is possible.

Don't forget that Chippendale was on the verge of bankruptcy for most of his career!

Brad

 

[Anonymous]

I agree with you all, quality of work is the main factor.

Steve, I'm happy with cabinetmaker, furniture restorer hasn't quite got the same ring to it :lol:

 

[Waka]

Darn, I don't fall into any of those categories.

 

[Scrums]

I just call myself a woodworker, let the people see what I can do and take it from there. I did one term of woodwork at school and made a pencil box.

All my qualifications are as a toolmaker, which while the materials are different the thoroughness and discipline taught during my apprenticeship has proved invaluable.

Chris.

 

[wrightclan]

I guess I come in somewhere between a hutchmaker and a cabinetmaker then! :lol:

Seriously though, while I am sure that the historical demarcations upon which you base your definitions are correct, I sense a degree of subjectivity here.

Just because the original Dutch cabinetmakers used veneering, hand cut dovetails, elaborate legs, and French Polish surely does not necesserily mean that other techniques and design features put one outside of the definition of a cabinet maker 300 years later.

Time moves on. If Chippendale, Hepplewhite, or Sheraton had had a Leigh jig and router available, I am sure that they would have found a use for it. The same is probably true of veneered MDF and AC lacquers! They used the most up-to-date methods and materials available to them.

I am proud to call myself a cabinetmaker, even though I make very little reproduction furniture, and use few hand tools, even though I am fairly proficient in their use.

The important thing today, as it was hundreds of years ago, is to produce distintive work of a high quality in the shortest possible time. That way a profit is possible.

Don't forget that Chippendale was on the verge of bankruptcy for most of his career!

Brad

Well said. =D>

BTW, I never referred to myself as a cabinetmaker until customers started calling me that.

I wouldn't fit the traditional definition. But then again, I fit it better than any of the other traditional woodworking titles.

Brad

 

[Anonymous]

Thanks Brad

Brad :lol:

 

[Anonymous]

The important thing today, as it was hundreds of years ago, is to produce distintive work of a high quality in the shortest possible time. That way a profit is possible.

Don't forget that Chippendale was on the verge of bankruptcy for most of his career!

Brad

At the end of the day this is exactly what it comes down to, I love doing this work but if there was no financial gain I would do it as a hobby and seek another career.

 

[Anonymous]

I guess I come in somewhere between a hutchmaker and a cabinetmaker then! :lol:

Seriously though, while I am sure that the historical demarcations upon which you base your definitions are correct, I sense a degree of subjectivity here.

Just because the original Dutch cabinetmakers used veneering, hand cut dovetails, elaborate legs, and French Polish surely does not necesserily mean that other techniques and design features put one outside of the definition of a cabinet maker 300 years later.

Time moves on. If Chippendale, Hepplewhite, or Sheraton had had a Leigh jig and router available, I am sure that they would have found a use for it. The same is probably true of veneered MDF and AC lacquers! They used the most up-to-date methods and materials available to them.

I am proud to call myself a cabinetmaker, even though I make very little reproduction furniture, and use few hand tools, even though I am fairly proficient in their use.

The important thing today, as it was hundreds of years ago, is to produce distintive work of a high quality in the shortest possible time. That way a profit is possible.

Don't forget that Chippendale was on the verge of bankruptcy for most of his career!

Brad

Great post , Brad.

I could have written every word myself!

Duncan

 

[wrightclan]

Had a debate with another maker today about advertising as a cabinetmaker, whats peoples opinion on what person warrents the title cabinetmaker, i.e. trade qualifications, time served or just the quality of the product you make.

Out of curiosity, what did the person in question have to say on the subject?

Brad

 

[wrightclan]

Thanks Brad

Brad :lol:

No Problem Brad

Brad :lol:

Hey we could really build up our post count here! :shock:

 

[Shultzy]

I must be a "hutchmaker" as our rabbit has a lovely one bedroom detached residence. :lol: