tormek t3 not sharpening square

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jajoinery

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hi guys iv had a tormek t3 for 12 months now, very good machine,
ideal for my needs, but ive found lately its not grinding square,
even on a block plane iron or 25mm chisel its seems to grinding the ends off the square,
any help or advice on how to rectify this?
also what is the best bevel edge chisel? i do all types of carpentry and joinery
so something all round is what im after, i have red handled bahco chisels just now,
are narex any good?
 
Thanks for the reply carl, any idea how it can be re-trued? am i correct in thinking you need that stone grader?
and thanks for links, will take a look now
 
I would go for the Tormek TT 50 diamond truing tool. This will re surface the stone and true it up leaving it cutting faster and parallel to the bar. We have a video on our website Wood Worker Workshop showing it in use, just search on TT 50 and click the video link. You may have had a grading stone when you bought your T3 but this changes the grit cutting rate and re flattens the stone a little.

As for chisels we stock Narex and WoodRiver for general woodworking or Ashley Iles or Veritas for finer work. The Narex and WoodRiver I would put on par whist the AI are better and the Veritas excellent.

Any questions give us a call.

Cheers Peter
 
You may also want to check that the tool rest/bar is properly installed. I know that on my T3 it can sometimes not be at an exact right angle to the cutting face of the stone.
Mine is only threaded on one of the legs which has the knurled stop nut on it. Push this all the way in to it's hole and see if you can deflect the bar at all - it should move about 2 or 3 mm. You need to establish the correct alignment before tightening down the bar fully.
Hope this makes sense - I'm writing this without the machine in front of me so I may be using wrong terminology. Let me know if you need a fuller explanation.
Like the other guys said you definitely need a Truing tool for your Tormek as well if you want to get the best results from it.
 
Another very common problem with non square grinds is that the tool is not referenced properly in the SE76 square edge jig

Even with a trued stone and perfectly aligned jig one still needs to pay attention to finger pressure being even across the edge. The Recommended approach is to keep offering a square to the progressing grind to check for square and if out apply finger pressure on the long point til square

Also regrade the stone with the sp 650 rough side frequently as it quickly stops cutting when doing large surface area tools like plane irons
 
I always mark a line with fine marker using an engineers square and grind to that.

Rod
 
Yup...the diamond truing thingy is vital...and it ain't cheap as with all things Tormek...but the wheel is revitalised as well as true after a few passes.

You can make one yourself...I did one out of scrap Corian and an old cheap coarse diamond thingy...

DSC_0160.JPG


...and it work quite well...

DSC_0153.JPG


....as you can see...

DSC_0152.JPG


But then the Tormek ate the plate after two or three truing sessions and I bit the bullet and spent a whole voucher on the real thing.

For the effort needed to make one of these...I would recommend just buying one....you will need it.

Jimi
 
Best b/e chisel for cabinetmaking benchwork is the Ashley Iles, but it's not a 'site' chisel. Best for site work probably Marples unbreakable plastic handled jobby.

The Tormek is a super machine, but the soft, friable wheels do wear very quickly. There are two possible approaches, both with pros and cons.

The first is to dress the wheel as stated above. You end up with a true surface, but the act of trueing takes off quite a bit of abrasive, which accelerates wheel wear, and Tormek replacement wheels are not cheap. Don't forget to move the job side-to-side to even out wear on the wheel during grinding, too.

The second approach is to become more freehand in your grinding technique. Just offer the edge to the wheel, keep it moving sideways, and bias grinding to where the wheel is least worn. Check progress of the partially-ground edge frequently with a small square and bevel angle gauge (mine is a piece of cardboard with notches at different bevel angles cut in the edges) until you have what you need. The advantages of this approach are speed (no jigs to set up) and slower wheel wear (all wear happens during grinding, none is lost during trueing). The downside is that you need to develop a bit of 'feel' for grinding to get a really straight edge, though for most chisels and cambered plane irons, you don't really need edges ground dead true anyway. (I've been using this freehand approach for years, and don't have any problems getting tool edges as straight and square as I need them.)

The two approaches could be combined by using freehand methods for most grinding, and trueing the wheel up before using a jigged set-up for anything that absolutely has to be straight and dead square (rebate plane irons, perhaps?).
 
Thank you all for the very helpful replies, very much appreciated, i think i have sussed the tormek problem,
although I think will purchase the tt50 an re-face the stone , its certainly cheaper than a new wheel
 
jajoinery":jdpy2jff said:
Thank you all for the very helpful replies, very much appreciated, i think i have sussed the tormek problem,
although I think will purchase the tt50 an re-face the stone , its certainly cheaper than a new wheel

It totally transforms a worn and out of true wheel instantly and for that alone..it's worth it.

I just think that Tormek take the urine with their pricing but hey ho...they are good.

Jimi
 
Do check the bar for level as suggested, but I assume if you have been using it happily in the past so you have found your way around the techniques. The TT 50 should only be used to take a skim of the wheel so you should keep the wheel for some time before changing it if it is looked after.
 
I'll give one final tip to speed up the truing AND reawakening the wheel cutting action WITHOUT doing a full on TT-50 true and that's use a diamond T-dresser.

Diamond T-dressers are available for about £8 from Axy et al. You wind the usb up till its about 1mm from the wheel in the wheel turning away from you position. Hold the dresser (diamond facing the wheel of course) dead flat on the usb and carefully advance till its abrading the wheel. Hold very strongly downwards or the upwardly moving wheel will attempt to lift it. This is a very very quick way of both truing and bringing back the cutting action of the wheel. The referencing off the usb keeps the wheel parallel and the lack of jigging speeds the process up. You control how much wheel you remove by time taken and pressure in pushing.

It works extremely well and I tend to do it first job so it doesn't mess up an already set usb distance in the middle of a grind.
 
Random, is the beastie you're referring to?
Diamond tool.jpg

Presumably the aim is to anchor the tool between the guide bar and the wheel?
Not too sure if I understood your method correctly.....
 

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That's the one, though my handle is shorter and stubbier but basically the same.

Method: Definitely not to jam the dresser between guide bar and wheel, rather rest (and hold down) the dresser on the guide bar while in contact with the wheel. The guide bar is so close to the wheel it acts like a platform upon which the dresser is referenced. As long as you're applying finger pressure both down (to avoid the wheel lifting the dresser) and inwards towards the wheel then it will dress the stone and not be shifted by the wheel.

I then simply eyeball the dresser and the guide bar and you can easily see if its parallel to the bar. Push into the wheel and that parallelism will be transferred to the wheel as it removes a thin layer of the ceramic binder and exposes fresh (sharp) abrasive.

It is then wise to refresh the water bath because a lot of ceramic ends up in it which then gets redistributed round the wheel, helping to reduce the efficiency of the cutting.
 
Cheers Random.That makes perfect sense now.
Unfortunately I need a bit longer than I used to to figure things out these days!!
Drinking beer all afternoon whilst lying in the sun and perusing tool catalogues is probably the reason!!
 
Random Orbital Bob":1twzomho said:
I'll give one final tip to speed up the truing AND reawakening the wheel cutting action WITHOUT doing a full on TT-50 true and that's use a diamond T-dresser.

Diamond T-dressers are available for about £8 from Axy et al. You wind the usb up till its about 1mm from the wheel in the wheel turning away from you position. Hold the dresser (diamond facing the wheel of course) dead flat on the usb and carefully advance till its abrading the wheel. Hold very strongly downwards or the upwardly moving wheel will attempt to lift it. This is a very very quick way of both truing and bringing back the cutting action of the wheel. The referencing off the usb keeps the wheel parallel and the lack of jigging speeds the process up. You control how much wheel you remove by time taken and pressure in pushing.

It works extremely well and I tend to do it first job so it doesn't mess up an already set usb distance in the middle of a grind.

Is one of these suitable for use freehand on a bog standard cheapo grinder?
 
Random Orbital Bob":2h2xpv2k said:
I'll give one final tip to speed up the truing AND reawakening the wheel cutting action WITHOUT doing a full on TT-50 true and that's use a diamond T-dresser.

Diamond T-dressers are available for about £8 from Axy et al. You wind the usb up till its about 1mm from the wheel in the wheel turning away from you position. Hold the dresser (diamond facing the wheel of course) dead flat on the usb and carefully advance till its abrading the wheel. Hold very strongly downwards or the upwardly moving wheel will attempt to lift it. This is a very very quick way of both truing and bringing back the cutting action of the wheel. The referencing off the usb keeps the wheel parallel and the lack of jigging speeds the process up. You control how much wheel you remove by time taken and pressure in pushing.

It works extremely well and I tend to do it first job so it doesn't mess up an already set usb distance in the middle of a grind.

I have one of these as well as the Tormek dresser. Please note that the diamond T-bar is NOT a substitute for the T dresser. Used freehand, it is fine for the occasional cleaning of the T stone. However, since it follows the curves of the stone, it will soon exaggerate these and create an out-of-round wheel. All dressers need to be anchored, which is when they "turn" the wheel - like a lathe does. Unanchored, they do not create a round, more of an oval.

DTR, the T-dresser is perfect for a high speed grinder. I use one on my 8".

Regards from Perth

Derek
 
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