jimi43
Established Member
AndyT":1dbzz2z4 said:
Yes...sorry..that gizmo minus the large bit with the handle but set up as it should go...hence my reference. Sorry should have been more specific.
Jimi
the gizmo competition
- Thread starter condeesteso
- Start date
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Yes...sorry..that gizmo minus the large bit with the handle but set up as it should go...hence my reference. Sorry should have been more specific.
Jimi
condeesteso
Established Member
Thanks BB, indeed 'tis that I need (I use the term need loosely here). Excellent tech photography!! I'll measure thread anyway as it is same as handle obviously. Backsun.
bugbear
Established Member
condeesteso":221vasx2 said:
Yeah - that one ain't "Art", it's quite a different thing. If you work out the pixel resolution (via the ruler) you can measure stuff quite happily off it.
BugBear
condeesteso
Established Member
Thanks Tom K by the way. Very close that, but BB has the real thing. Checked thread but only have metric thread gauges and it comes out 1.25 (which equates to an M8 I believe, but of course it's not that). O/D is 0.374" (pretty well bang on 3/8ths). So BBs 3/8 BSF seems right - I don't mean it was ever in any doubt 
I remember having an issue with a missing side handle on an MF handdrill (Scouse got me one) and MF seemed to have used 2 different threads at different times but from memory they were British threads. I have forgotten if that was quite normal then (around 1900 say) as I think UNC and UNF came along a lot later?
I'll save a bit of bother here Andy, and find a 3/8 BSF and try it... that Jim'll have one.
Meanwhile, here it is:
It actually works, rather well too. I haven't touched the blades at all so they are not quite the same height (either way mounted) - this thing has potential :shock:
Now then, continuing the theme of this thread, complete the following sentence using not more than ten words:
" I need to cut some leather washers because..."
It's New Year's Eve. Got something better to do? Thought not :lol: :lol:
I remember having an issue with a missing side handle on an MF handdrill (Scouse got me one) and MF seemed to have used 2 different threads at different times but from memory they were British threads. I have forgotten if that was quite normal then (around 1900 say) as I think UNC and UNF came along a lot later?
I'll save a bit of bother here Andy, and find a 3/8 BSF and try it... that Jim'll have one.
Meanwhile, here it is:
It actually works, rather well too. I haven't touched the blades at all so they are not quite the same height (either way mounted) - this thing has potential :shock:
Now then, continuing the theme of this thread, complete the following sentence using not more than ten words:
" I need to cut some leather washers because..."
It's New Year's Eve. Got something better to do? Thought not :lol: :lol:
Attachments
Just a quick thought on the design - I think the blades need to be different heights so the inner cut completes with some support from the surrounding leather, then the outer cut completes.
I'll make the threaded part to BB's measurements.
I'll make the threaded part to BB's measurements.
jimi43
Established Member
I probably have some 3/8 BSF bolts taps and dies around the drawers somewhere as you correctly summised Douglas!
We'll look on Friday
Cheers and Happy New Year to you from Wallace and Leather Grommet!!!
Jimi
We'll look on Friday
Cheers and Happy New Year to you from Wallace and Leather Grommet!!!
Jimi
condeesteso
Established Member
Very smart Prof!! - indeed the inner would need to be completed first (ideally only just perhaps).
Not the taps/dies Jim, just an old 3/8 bsf bolt so I can check it fits. Bound to have one.
There's humour in here somewhere - I must be crackers playing around with this thing (We forgot the crackers....) Over to Jim.
Not the taps/dies Jim, just an old 3/8 bsf bolt so I can check it fits. Bound to have one.
There's humour in here somewhere - I must be crackers playing around with this thing (We forgot the crackers....) Over to Jim.
Tony Spear
Established Member
condeesteso said:Now then, continuing the theme of this thread, complete the following sentence using not more than ten words:
" I need to cut some leather washers because..."
My cow's getting a bit grubby in this weather!
It's New Year's Eve. Got something better to do? Thought not :lol: :lol:[/quote]
condeesteso
Established Member
Funny you mention that Tom. It had genuinely crossed my mind there may be a place for them between front knob/boss and front jaw - thinner (maybe 1.5mm) hard leather. It would cushion the small axial play (end float) required to make the front face so it can rack, which is a key feature of twin-screws (just like B&D Workmates as BB pointed out years ago).
If I ever make just one more I may look at that.
Meanwhile Tony... =D> :lol: Very good I like that.
Happy New Year to all.
If I ever make just one more I may look at that.
Meanwhile Tony... =D> :lol: Very good I like that.
Happy New Year to all.
Well, the combination of a day off, foul wind and rain outside, a new set of lathe cutting tools
that came as a Christmas present, plus Douglas's need for a replacement part for his Alford Vice all seemed to come at the right time as an excuse to go and play in the basement with my 1880s Barnes treadle powered lathe. So that's what I have done today.
A long period of happy pottering included much that I did not photograph. I reckon that over 80% of time on my lathe is not actually turning; it's swapping over from one way of holding the work to another or changing tools. I did quite a bit of the work for this job between centres with a lathe dog on the work and a catch bolt on the faceplate, but I don't seem to have taken any pictures of that.
Here the change wheels are in place to give 20 TPI - the big wheel is the one with a couple of cracks in, but it seems to be perfectly strong enough without being mended:
and here is the thread starting to be cut
This picture shows the start of the neck between the threaded part and the tapered part
The thread is protected by wrapping a little bit of lead flashing around it, but the grip is on the bigger round part.
Having cut in and reduced the diameter a bit I needed to round off the ends so swapped to a HSS bit, ground round
To make the square tapered end I thought it would help to make a round taper first. I had measured the angle as being 9°. I could have done this by offsetting the tailstock but I chose the other way - angling the compound slide - as I had not done either method yet.
Here you can see that the part that holds the tool has been slid round to 4.5° short of a right angle, so advancing the cutter by use of the double handle at the left pulls the cutter along at 4.5° to the axis, which makes the taper:
To square off flats on the taper, I didn't use any sort of cunning milling attachment, I just locked rotation up by engaging the back gears and filed horizontally. I then rotated 90°, locked up and filed again
Having done all four, I cleaned them up a bit in the vice (an excellent Record Imp, just right for a job like this)
And so, here's the result, which will be in the post to you tomorrow, Douglas:
It's a bit frustrating that I can't check it for fit, especially as I found out afterwards that the tip had chipped in the cutting:
so the finish was not as good as it could be. If it does not fit, I hope it's close enough for one of Jim's dies to tame it.
So there it is; thanks again Douglas for providing the excuse. (And it does occur to me that a whole lot of leather washers squeezed up together make a brilliant handle, as on Estwing hammers and suchlike; the ability to cut a graded series might inspire a new line of Coates Tools, perhaps?)
that came as a Christmas present, plus Douglas's need for a replacement part for his Alford Vice all seemed to come at the right time as an excuse to go and play in the basement with my 1880s Barnes treadle powered lathe. So that's what I have done today.
A long period of happy pottering included much that I did not photograph. I reckon that over 80% of time on my lathe is not actually turning; it's swapping over from one way of holding the work to another or changing tools. I did quite a bit of the work for this job between centres with a lathe dog on the work and a catch bolt on the faceplate, but I don't seem to have taken any pictures of that.
Here the change wheels are in place to give 20 TPI - the big wheel is the one with a couple of cracks in, but it seems to be perfectly strong enough without being mended:
and here is the thread starting to be cut
This picture shows the start of the neck between the threaded part and the tapered part
The thread is protected by wrapping a little bit of lead flashing around it, but the grip is on the bigger round part.
Having cut in and reduced the diameter a bit I needed to round off the ends so swapped to a HSS bit, ground round
To make the square tapered end I thought it would help to make a round taper first. I had measured the angle as being 9°. I could have done this by offsetting the tailstock but I chose the other way - angling the compound slide - as I had not done either method yet.
Here you can see that the part that holds the tool has been slid round to 4.5° short of a right angle, so advancing the cutter by use of the double handle at the left pulls the cutter along at 4.5° to the axis, which makes the taper:
To square off flats on the taper, I didn't use any sort of cunning milling attachment, I just locked rotation up by engaging the back gears and filed horizontally. I then rotated 90°, locked up and filed again
Having done all four, I cleaned them up a bit in the vice (an excellent Record Imp, just right for a job like this)
And so, here's the result, which will be in the post to you tomorrow, Douglas:
It's a bit frustrating that I can't check it for fit, especially as I found out afterwards that the tip had chipped in the cutting:
so the finish was not as good as it could be. If it does not fit, I hope it's close enough for one of Jim's dies to tame it.
So there it is; thanks again Douglas for providing the excuse. (And it does occur to me that a whole lot of leather washers squeezed up together make a brilliant handle, as on Estwing hammers and suchlike; the ability to cut a graded series might inspire a new line of Coates Tools, perhaps?)
jimi43
Established Member
That's a wonderful example of old fashioned turning in steel there Prof!!
Really impressive!
Pity you chipped the tip...you can get individual ones to replace it on Fleabay though or you can whittle one out of some tool steel stock
Cheers mate
Jimi
Really impressive!
Pity you chipped the tip...you can get individual ones to replace it on Fleabay though or you can whittle one out of some tool steel stock
Cheers mate
Jimi
rileytoolworks
Established Member
Excellent. You've made me want to go out and turn something now!
Adam.
Adam.
condeesteso
Established Member
Wow, Andy!! Excellent work, very well reported at every stage too. Embarrassing as I am nowhere near making the brass mallet promised, better get a wiggle on (as they say).
Soon as it arrives I will check fit and post a pic, if the thread needed a tweak it could only be very slight, looks brilliant to me.
The leather washer idea is really good, and I have a fair amount of that thick hide around... I shall have a ponder.
Very many thanks Andy - winning the 'competition' has cost you a good few hours and a tool tip. Congratulations
Soon as it arrives I will check fit and post a pic, if the thread needed a tweak it could only be very slight, looks brilliant to me.
The leather washer idea is really good, and I have a fair amount of that thick hide around... I shall have a ponder.
Very many thanks Andy - winning the 'competition' has cost you a good few hours and a tool tip. Congratulations
Thanks all. I bought a couple of Trend diamond hones in a CHT sale which soon removed the chip. Perhaps I should have stuck to the HSS.
I do feel privileged having an indoor workshop that stays usable all year round. It's much more inviting than a walk in the rain to a cold shed would be!
I do feel privileged having an indoor workshop that stays usable all year round. It's much more inviting than a walk in the rain to a cold shed would be!
rileytoolworks
Established Member
AndyT":ibobew7k said:
That must be nice Andy.
After I made my last post (feeling inspired by your efforts today), I went out to the shed to start reassembling my lathe after moving workshops over the Christmas break.
Got soaked going to the shed, got there then needed the toilet, went back inside, back out to the shed, opened the drawer with some new lathe goodies in and spent the best part of 2 hours 'playing' with those.
Froze my buttocks off, got soaked coming back in.
Still, it was a 15' walk as opposed to a 13 mile drive to my previous workshop.
Thanks for the inspiration to go outside!
Adam. (who still hasn't warmed up).
Corneel
Established Member
It looks like that thread is indeed in need of some extra attention from the die. It doesn't look deep enough. I had some trouble cutting threads on the lathe too, last spring. I had to look it up again. Did you advance the bit a bit in the x-direction for every advance in the y direction? I'll have to look it up again, but I seem to remember that you must advance the double amount in the y direction for any advance in the x direction. Your bit probably failed because of that.
Nice to see the old lathe in action AndyT
I find that I'm so used to looking at Whitworth and Metric Coarse threads that BSF and UNF threads look deceptively shallow. In any case, some people recommend cleaning up a screwcut thread with a die wherever possible in order to form the crest radius. I've probably got the wrong end of the stick, but it's not necessary to advance the cutting tool on both axes. The recommended method is to advance the topslide at half the thread angle so that only one face of the tool has to do any cutting. However that is not always possible as sometimes (like on my ML4) the topslide cannot be rotated that far. Another method is to advance and retract the tool lengthways, again so that only one face of the tool is cutting, but then the finishing cuts have to be made using both faces of the tool to get the correct shape. This second method is only recommended for large, coarse threads.
Corneel":u4rwpwrp said:
I find that I'm so used to looking at Whitworth and Metric Coarse threads that BSF and UNF threads look deceptively shallow. In any case, some people recommend cleaning up a screwcut thread with a die wherever possible in order to form the crest radius. I've probably got the wrong end of the stick, but it's not necessary to advance the cutting tool on both axes. The recommended method is to advance the topslide at half the thread angle so that only one face of the tool has to do any cutting. However that is not always possible as sometimes (like on my ML4) the topslide cannot be rotated that far. Another method is to advance and retract the tool lengthways, again so that only one face of the tool is cutting, but then the finishing cuts have to be made using both faces of the tool to get the correct shape. This second method is only recommended for large, coarse threads.
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