the dust Tardis

[Adam9453]

Well I seemed to think (like I'm sure others do too) that my dust extraction equipment have Tardis style collection bags.
Unfortunately this weekend I realised my error in the most irritating series of events;

1: Firstly, while removing the crown guard from the tablesaw to lower the blade completely beneath the table, I dropped the threaded lever into the table saw! An ominous soft thud indicated there might be 'some' dust built up in the base....
Well I removed the cover and an avalanche of mdf dust hit me, after a few choice words I began sifting through the pile of sawdust to find the threaded lever. After a lot of hunting, aha, I found it. Spent the next 30mins bagging up the dust (2 rubble sacks full!) and cleaned out the tablesaw thoroughly. Ok first one down.

2: I was using the planer thicknesser today (first time in anger) to machine up some 250x50x1000mm lumps of solid oak. Well I was happily machining away, p/t chomping through the material wonderfully, then I notice a lot of chips building up on the thicknessing bed... Well I switched the machine off and checked if the hose was blocked to the chip extractor. Nope seemed fine. Suddenly I noticed the extractor bag looked set to burst. I opened it and the Tardis function had clearly failed, it was so full I'm amazed it was sucking at all!! Didn't have a spare bag so had to empty the collection bag into two rubble backs.

Just a recap, that's now 4 rubble bag fills of dust I've cleared out...

3. Finished the jobs for today and noticed some gritty dirt under the timber rack so thought I'll just Hoover that up before I lock up, yep you know where this is going...
I grabbed the Hoover and had to lift it over a cable, felt strangely heavy so I thought I bet I need to change the back. So I just popped the catches and bang I'm confronted with a solid mass of mdf dust, caked around the filter, completely hiding the bag (which had obviously split) and generally all over me (again!!).
I had to use my hands to scoop out the dust so I could get the bag out. Got it all out, filter cleaned, reassembled and then spent 30mins hoovering all the mess up I'd made, plus the original small bit of dirt!!

So that's 5 rubble bags full of dust and a very filthy, moderately irritated me lol
Don't be like me, empty your dust extractors before you end up with horrific messes

 

[yetloh]

And what's worse, you will have ingested a whole load of the stuff that your extraction gear is intended to protecte you against.

Jim

 

[Adam9453]

Fortunately I'm pretty religious about wearing a dust mask so I was still protected. Just confused where all the suction had gone lol

 

[sunnybob]

I've bolted my cyclone to an almost opaque but partly see through plastic box for the dust collection. I can see the level of dust inside just by glancing at the box. Just as well, because I'm also a "dont fix it till its broke" kind of man.

 

[wallace]

My chip collector is in a lean too next to my workshop. I didn't notice any loss in suction but I checked it recently and not only was the bag full but also the filter bag on the top was full to the brim.

 

[Adam9453]

I'm glad its not just me that assumes its fine until you happen to check it!!
I'm just really glad that I realised both the extractor and the vac were full before either machine overheated, caught fire or just plain broke.
I'm still not happy with the level of suction from the extractor so I now am working on building a much more powerful 2 stage unit with cyclone separation.
Just need to replace the 3 phase motor with a single phase motor on the impeller unit i've scrounged, order the fine filter cartridge unit from axminster that conveniently will fit the scrounged impeller unit, make some kind of frame type structure to support it all and then connect it all up. I'd be disappointed if the new system doesn't try and suck me into oblivion :twisted:

 

[yetloh]

I have one of the US Oneida Air cyclone extractor systems ( bought from the UK importer before he sadly went bust - started up just as the recession began) and it is excellent but it does have an opaque collection drum. Luckily it has never overfilled but I have seen chips just coming up into the clear flexble connecting pipe. I do prefer the rigid drum though, because I can seperate it from the machine and remove it without creating a cloud of dust.

Jim

 

[Adam9453]

It's interesting you mention the rigid drum, I've bought a 200 litre oil drum which I plan to use to collect under the cyclone. I am thinking that I might cut some viewing windows in it and seal them with clear Perspex as it would be good to easily be able to monitor how full it is.
Otherwise it would be an awful faff of removing the lid to check it!
Oil drum is blooming big though so I'm concerned where it's gonna fit in the workshop!

 

[wallace]

I used a big plastic barrel the size of a oil drum and found it really cumbersome when trying to empty it especially if it was full of sawdust and not planer shavings, it had a massive thein baffle on top and 6" ducting. it used a lot of real estate up as well.

 

[Adam9453]

Yeah that's my concern as well. I am considering making a smaller rectangular collection box from clear Perspex instead as then I can make it fit the space better and keep it a manageable size, including putting castors on the bottom.
I'm still trying to design a decent lid setup that will seal well and yet be quick and easy to open to empty the collector.
It'll have the large plastic cyclone on top which is light but still needs supporting while I empty the collector.
Thinking that maybe suspend the cyclone and collector lid from springs so it hangs just slightly higher than the collection box. Then to close the lid onto the collection box you would pull it down using some kind of simple ratchet or luggage style catches. It would mean the springs would be under tension when the lid is closed but if the travel of the lid was minimal then the tension could be minimal too.
Any thoughts?

 

[MattRoberts]

I'd argue that by having a bigger container like a drum, it's heavy and awkward to empty, meaning you're more reluctant to do it frequently.

I use one of these https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/aw/d/B0093C ... +container (there are larger versions available too. They're perfect because the lid is strong enough to attach my cyclone without the need for a piece of wood to strengthen it, and it has a quick release metal ring to seal it. It's dead easy to open it and empty.

 

[yetloh]

That looks like a good option. My Oneida drum has one of those quick release metal bands and it works very well. But I can see the attraction of a square perspex container made to fit the available space. I'm sure it would not be too difficult to arrange a rubber seal and over-centre toggle clasps to pull the lid down onto the seal. Even better would be a separate solid lid to close th box while it is moved around and taken to wherever you dispose of thee contents - the green waste place at the local tip in my case.

Jim

 

[Adam9453]

It's interesting you linked to that one Matt, I very nearly bought that exact one from Amazon but thinking it would be too small I went for the big metal oil drum from Amazon. When it arrived I suddenly thought, bugger that's a bit big!!
I'm leaning towards the clear Perspex box.
I think the lid for keeping the dust in while carrying is a very good idea.
I also think I'll put an openable base on it so all the dust just drops out the bottom into a bag of waste container.
I've found turning a dust filled box upside down to empty it can result in some filthy incidences.
I was inspired by how the dyson hoovers collection tank work for emptying.
I'm thinking either a hinged base or a slide out panel like a blast gate

 

[MattRoberts]

I think you might need a cylindrical container guys - an effective cyclone system spins the air in both the cyclone and the container, in order to maintain a clean air stream in the centre and up through the central port.

I've not tested a rectangular container though, so it might work ok

 

[Adam9453]

Ah that's a good point Matt, I hadn't considered that. Perhaps I could add a cylindrical tube area underneath the cyclone and on top of the collection box to allow it to swirl then drop through and down into the collection box at the bottom.
I was thinking that using blast gates might be a nice way of closing off the collection box when you need to remove it to empty it.

 

[MattRoberts]

I could be wrong, but I think the entire thing needs to be cylindrical all the way through.

There's another thread about dust collection where a user posted a pic of his full blue container. If you look at the dust in it, you'll see it's conical - implying the air flowing in the container is also spinning to create the vortex

 

[MattRoberts]

Also, if the cyclone is doing its job, you shouldn't need to use a blast gate

 

[Woodmatt]

I am going to go for the 30L bin as suggested by Matt for a couple of reasons 1) when full it is not to heavy to move and 2) it is the right size to take a "Blue bag" provided by my council for the Recycling waste.That way I can take of the lid off and tie the bag before removing from the bin, that way there will be minimal dust escaping into the atmosphere when changing.

 

[whiskywill]

I was think that using blast gays .

Is that allowed? :shock:

 

[Adam9453]

I was think that using blast gays .

Is that allowed? :shock:

Edited, thanks