Table saw vibration?

[gidon]

I have a Scheppach TS2000 saw with a Trend combi blade (recently resharpened). I find when cutting thinner material (~1/2") and particuarly when cutting thin strips off this, I get a scary amount of vibration.
I have the saw as stable as I can get it - but I always wonder if it's caused by the rather large table insert clearance for the blade? I have unsuccesfully tried making a zero clearence insert but it's tricky on the TS2000 and ended up with something I was scared to actually use!

Really bad last night when I was trying to trim 1/2" strips of 1/2" rounded beading made on the router table.

Any suggestions (including get a new saw ) welcome.

Cheers

Gidon

 

[Adam]

Is it all the time when running - or only when actually cutting stock?

Have you tried cleaning the blade? E.g. get rid of the resin?

Alternatively, have you tried taking the blade out, and wiping round the collars just to check you haven't for some grit/sawdust in there when you put it on?

Have you checked to see their isn't any stuff on the drive belt (resin/sawdust etc)?

Adam

 

[devonwoody]

If you have another blade you can throw in (even if Blunt) that could indicate which way to look.

 

[gidon]

Thanks chaps. It's not the table saw that's (visibly) vibrating - it's the stock as it's being fed through. I have tried another blade (same) and it is better with this Trend blade now it's being sharpened - but it's still very obvious and to be honest quite unnerving!
Cheers
Gidon

 

[LyNx]

i think the problem could be the size of the timber your cutting. Test a larger piece and see what happens.

I was ripping down 10mm strips and this was vibrating alot, i just cramped on a small hold down to the fence and this helped alot.

I quick way for a temp zero clearance is to get a board of 12mm MDF and just run it half into the blade and clamp still.

Andy

 

[Anonymous]

Hi Gidon,

Try dropping the blade down just enough to allow the bottom of the gullet to come through the surface. This will give the teeth a longer slicing angle rather than a high chopping angle which can help reduce chatter.
Also, on your Scheppach fence, the section is perfect for clamping a feather board to, which I would say is pretty essential on thinner stock.
Ideally, you would be better off running it through the bandsaw as the blade is always forcing the stock downwards, so chatter is practically eliminated.

Andy

 

[gidon]

Andy (Lynx) - this is on long stock - 2m lengths in fact. That's a good idea on the make-shift zero tolerance insert thanks - think I saw a similiar idea in PW recently and forgot about it ...

Try dropping the blade down just enough to allow the bottom of the gullet to come through the surface. This will give the teeth a longer slicing angle rather than a high chopping angle which can help reduce chatter.

Thanks Andy. This is a problem on my saw with the guard attached - because of the way the guard is fixed on you need the guard a lot higher than necessary for the wood to clear it. Unless you raise the riving knife - but then I can't wind the blade down to use the bench as a work surface and I can't do grooving cuts either. Catch 22.

I think the feather boards are the way to go - will give that a go next. Perhaps raising the riving knife as well to decrease the blade height too :?. The bandsaw (well mine anyway) wouldn't give me a finished cut so would then need some hand work - and a way of clamping 2m lengths of 1/2" beading :-k.

I guess cast iron saws would cope better with this sort of operation?

Cheers

Gidon

 

[Neil]

Any suggestions (including get a new saw ) welcome.

I guess cast iron saws would cope better with this sort of operation?

Something tells me you're looking for an excuse to upgrade? :lol:

Well, the Festool would do this very nicely. :twisted: One other thought - do you have the roundover edge against the fence, so you have to have the fence very close to the blade? If so, how about having the bulk of your stock against the fence instead and the rounded over piece you are taking off as the 'waste' if you see what I mean? :-k

Cheers,
Neil

 

[Alf]

The bandsaw (well mine anyway) wouldn't give me a finished cut so would then need some hand work - and a way of clamping 2m lengths of 1/2" beading :-k.

I think probably a sticking board of some sort. An explanation here.

Cheers, Alf

 

[Chris Knight]

Gidon,

Thinner stock is a problem, especially if you are using a thin blade as both can vibrate and you get wonderful harmonics etc.

Things that can help:-
1. Zero clearance insert does help but as you say it is difficult to rig up on the TS 2000. You can try cutting on the top of thin hardboard and using the latter as a sacrificial zero clearance insert.

2. Damping vibrations using the thickest blade you can find or putting something heavy on the thin stock - eg another lump of wood - all the better if you can cut through this too, other wise just have it close enough to the blade not to frighten you

3. Get GRR-Ripper or preferably two, they are excellent http://www.microjig.com/

 

[Anonymous]

Get GRR-Ripper or preferably two, they are excellent

Hi Chris,
These concern me slightly...
You have to have the guards off to use them, and if you are feeding stock directly over, using the Grr-ripper as a tunnel guard, once it's clear of the blade, your forearm can be perilously close to impending doom.
Just my personal opinion you understand...

 

[gidon]

Neil - I would upgrade in a flash if my workshed wasn't at the back of the garden and up steps and all sorts. I just wouldn't be able to get a cast iron saw up there . Festool - one day maybe ... I did rip an 8" wide board for the moulding using my cordless circular saw - worked pretty well. I am doing what you suggest already - my saw likes the thin bit being in between the fence and blade even less!

Alf - thanks for that pointer.

Chris - thanks for the suggestions - I have seen those GRR Rippers but like Andy they worry me a bit too. Maybe for short non-ripping cuts but for longer cuts you'd have to have two I guess and some clever hand swapping?

Thanks all - I thought it was just my table saw but it appears not.

Cheers

Gidon

 

[Chris Knight]

Andy, Gidon,

It's true you need the guard off to use the GRR-Ripper and I don't wish to encourage people to do anything they feel is unsafe. It is just that without the GRR-Ripper, for certain cuts I resort to other methods I won't mention that feel vastly less safe..

 

[Ian Dalziel]

Gidon,
somethings to check......on your thin blade check that the hole where it fixes to the saw is round.......sometimes with vibration it can make it eccentric and throw the blade off balance.....
not sure what the bore is on these saws but also dont use a blade with adapter washers as these also through it out eventually
eg 16mm bore saw with a 30mm adapter ring....these are now supposed to be banned
also with a thinner blade the washers setup might not be thick enough to actually hold the blade tight enough to the backing washer. hence when you use a thicker blade its better

can you run this saw without a blade and can you put a dial indicater on the shaft. also check for build ups of sawdust around the backs of the blade support washers.

Ian