Spiers Wooden Infill smoothing planes

[Benchwayze]

Hi folks,

I am looking for a Spiers wooden-infill smoother. I would prefer the adjustable type, if there was ever one made, but would accept an older 'manually tuned' type!

Does anyone have any ideas on what I should consider a good price for these planes? I expect it depends on condition, but a ball-park figure might help me decide to go down the Lie Nielsen route instead!

Cheers folks.
Thanks in anticipation
John.

 

[Paul Chapman]

Pennyfarthing Tools have a Norris A1 infill on their website at the moment for £495. OK, it's not a smoother, but might serve to give you an idea of prices for this type of plane http://www.pennyfarthingtools.co.uk/new-woodwork.htm

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[dunbarhamlin]

Seem to be available between £300 & £500. Don't think I've seen one with an adjuster.

Similar Norris smoothers (with adjuster) come in from a little less on up.

New Norris style smoothers can be had from around £400 (eg Ray Iles A5 £395 from CHT)

 

[Harbo]

Depends on the condition, age, type etc.

Spiers & Norris on the Bay go for £180 to £600.
There was a Spiers on there the other day which did not reach its reserve price - bids up to £200 rejected.
PFT had a couple of Norris A5's going for £300 & £395.

Ray Iles does a new version at about £395 - he also sells old ones at fair prices. He is also bringing out his version of the A1 later this year - about £800 I think he said?

Rod

 

[Benchwayze]

Thanks folks.

I will do some surfing then...
But I think I might have to wait until next year!
John :lol:

 

[Benchwayze]

Well:
SWIMBO caught sight of the planes I was looking at. (Salivating over!)
So, as I haven't a clue about dovetailing metal, I can't make one and I probably couldn't even put together a kit!

It looks like I shall, after all, be re-fettling my existing Stanleys and Records, as close to Nielsen standards as possible. I suppose I might have had to do some lapping with a Spiers anyway.



Thanks friends
John

 

[Smudger]

There's one on eBay at £320 at the moment - hope no-one else is bidding on it. Looks lovely.

 

[Benchwayze]

Thanks Smudger.
I have been watching this... since this morning. Five bids though and I bet someone is sniping it too!

If it stays below £450.00 I will be surprised and might even get it.
Thanks again.
John

 

[Smudger]

Good luck!

 

[Scrit]

I am looking for a Spiers wooden-infill smoother. I would prefer the adjustable type, if there was ever one made, but would accept an older 'manually tuned' type!

Spiers never made an infill with an adjuster. There were a few "Plane-o-Ayr" models turned out with what appears to be a prototype adjuster mechanism (the "Plane-o-Ayr" models were low cost all-cast items produced around WWI) and in their later years they did make copies of the Stanley Bailey designs, but they were very poor quality reproductions and are best avoided.

Pennyfarthing Tools have a Norris A1 infill on their website at the moment for £495. l

At that price (and without looking) it's got to be a post-war one with the rolled steel channel section metalwork and beech infill. They're not a patch on the pre-WWII ones, but for a pre-war rosewood infill A1 panel plane in good nick you'd be in the region od £800 to £1,500. Believe me the pre-war ones were streets better than the post war ones.

Edit: Just took a look, it's a 17-1/2in post-war minus most of it's finish and therefore not a brilliant plane.

As someone has mentioned Ray Iles does a very creditable reproduction of the A5 smoother. I've tried a sample and it is every bit as good in use as a good pre-war example (and there a lot with sloppy adjusters - to be avoided as a user) but to be frank I'd suggest saving your pennies and springing for either a Veritas bevel-up smoother or possibly a Lie-Nielsen #4-1/2 smoother with the York pitch frog. Tried both, really like the BU so it'son my list...... As modern planes go either are an easy match for the Norris - it just depends if you want to look at it or use it

Scrit

 

[Benchwayze]

Thanks smudger....

And Scrit...
I am a user I hope. Which is why I would probably buy a 'knocked-about' plane if it was in working order.

I still like the Stanleys and Records, and believe they can be tuned (or adjusted) to perform probably as well as a LN or Vertias, if you get hold of an earlier casting. Then again, having seen and handled some of Jim Kingshott's shop-made planes.... They are nice to look at and they do work!

Thanks for all the info gents.
Obliged
John

 

[Scrit]

John

There is one other minor annoyance when using a Norris adjuster - the act of tightening the lever cap changes the blade adjustment slightly. This is not a one-off problem. It is a well-documented "fault" with the design which is often overlooked

Scrit

 

[woodbloke]

John

There is one other minor annoyance when using a Norris adjuster - the act of tightening the lever cap changes the blade adjustment slightly. This is not a one-off problem. It is a well-documented "fault" with the design which is often overlooked

Scrit

Scrit is quite correct here. As a user of an A1 Norris (same as in PFT) the lever cap doesn't need to be over-tightened. If it is, the the blade adjustment is altered. More alarmingly, if the adjuster screw thread is used when the cap is very tight, damage can be done to the thread. This I think is one of the problems about buying a Norris unseen of fleaBay....you don't know if a previous user has damaged the thread beyond repair by overzealous use of the cap iron bolt. In use the bolt must always be slackened off before any adjustment is made to the blade setting - Rob

 

[pedder]

I am looking for a Spiers wooden-infill smoother. I would prefer the adjustable type, if there was ever one made, but would accept an older 'manually tuned' type!

Pennyfarthing Tools have a Norris A1 infill on their website at the moment for £495. l

At that price (and without looking) it's got to be a post-war one with the rolled steel channel section metalwork and beech infill.
...
As someone has mentioned Ray Iles does a very creditable reproduction of the A5 smoother. ...

Scrit

Last weekend i tried Norris type planes

from Gerd Fritsche

I don't know much about planes and working with them, but i love these planes.

For a "cheep" example look at US-ebay

Cheers Pedder

 

[matthewwh]

I bought a shabby but workable Norris A5 body a couple of years back for about £100. I stripped the woodwork back just enough to bring forth the grain but not enough to lose the worn appearance and then protected it with several coats of amber shellac. The chassis took a while to clean up too but it was sound and not too heavily pitted underneath. (they are a genuine pain to lap.)

With a replacement iron and chipbreaker that Darryl Hutchinson kindly made for me, and one of Ray's beautifully engineered replacement adjusters it's certainly turned out to be a very servicable piece of kit and leaves a superb finish.

As mentioned previously, they can be a bit of a fiddle to set up, especially learning to set the depth of cut accurately. If you enjoy the historical aspect and appreciate the workmanship that went into producing these tools in the first instance there is a great deal of pleasure to be had from them, although I must admit, it tends not to be the first plane I reach for.

 

[Wiley Horne]

Just a thought....I have adjustable and adjusterless infills, and the adjusterless are a very quick set up, especially if you put just a bit of camber on the blade. Also, you might consider unhandled--the unhandled ones have a nifty action, especially in situations where you want close control, with your hands right over the work. Good hunting!

Wiley

 

[Benchwayze]

Thanks to one and all for all the advice. I am still looking, and I daresay patience will be its own reward. On the other hand, I might just find one.

In the meantime, I am going to look through Krenov's 'T.F.A.O.Cabmkng.' again, and have a go with some maple I have handy, to make a smoother, with a Ratcliffe (Or was that Radclife?) blade from an old coffin smoother that had a cracked body. Maybe 'The Handplane Book' will arrive tomorrow though, and slow me down...

Wooden smoothers? A total departure for me as I usually go for steel bodied planes.

Thanks again folks.

John

 

[Harbo]

For those that did not follow the bidding on Ebay ? - it went for £1221!!

Rod