Sharpening jig for short chisels

[Eamonn]

I am looking for a sharpening jig that will allow me to sharpen my chisel and plane blades regardless of its's length.

ie... What jig clamps the chisel the lowest down? Normally once a chisel get down to a certain shortness, most jigs can't clamp it with putting a steep angle on it.

It would seem my options are, one with a wheel that rolls on the stone... or a jig that rolls either side of the stone. I plane to set up my on wood bench marts/stops for fast allocation of the required angle.


What are peoples experience of the 2 different types

https://www.woodsmith.com/article/10-precision-honing-guides/

 

[user 43593]

I am looking for a sharpening jig that will allow me to sharpen my chisel and plane blades regardless of its's length.

The jig is always going to be an influence on the length of blade you can sharpen. I am ok with sharpening freehand on ceramic water stones but I often cheat and use the Axminster Professional Honing and Bevel Guide, which is simplicity to use and gives great results. My Pfeil chisel blades use K510 steel, which is hardened to Rockwell 60. My Veritas plane blades are made using PMV-11. Both sets of tool blades need much less sharpening and the blades take and keep much better edges for far longer.

 

[TRITON]

Eclipse honing guide possibly ?

Just the fact that thats the one Lie Nielsen copied for their honing guide probably says all you need to know.

 

[kwigly]

Stanley 200 honing guide.
With the wheel riding on the bench, and the stone in a raised bed

 

[Derek Cohen (Perth Oz)]

I am looking for a sharpening jig that will allow me to sharpen my chisel and plane blades regardless of its's length.

ie... What jig clamps the chisel the lowest down? Normally once a chisel get down to a certain shortness, most jigs can't clamp it with putting a steep angle on it.

It would seem my options are, one with a wheel that rolls on the stone... or a jig that rolls either side of the stone. I plane to set up my on wood bench marts/stops for fast allocation of the required angle.


What are peoples experience of the 2 different types

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View attachment 171776

https://www.woodsmith.com/article/10-precision-honing-guides/

Hi Eamonn

I would avoid both these jigs as they are flawed.

The Kell is finicky to set up and then is awkward to control.

The Alisam is designed for diamond plates of the exact same height and width, and would be a problem on stones which vary in thickness.

Side clamping jigs, such as the Eclipse and LN, are best suited for blades with an even thickness and which are parallel. This is an issue if you use vintage tapered blades or Japanese blades.

Your best bet for a universal jig is the top-clamping Veritas Mk l (cheaper and more basic) or Mk ll (has a great deal of range, along with a side clamping accessory).

Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[jcassidy]

Modern cheap Eclipse ones, the one with the thick blue paint and the roller, aren't really worth the hassle, it's surprisingly finnicky to get it on straight at the distance your want. I only use it when I've let a chisel get really, really blunt. Maybe it's just me.

 

[budgie98]

Hi Eamonn

I would avoid both these jigs as they are flawed.

The Kell is finicky to set up and then is awkward to control.

The Alisam is designed for diamond plates of the exact same height and width, and would be a problem on stones which vary in thickness.

Side clamping jigs, such as the Eclipse and LN, are best suited for blades with an even thickness and which are parallel. This is an issue if you use vintage tapered blades or Japanese blades.

Your best bet for a universal jig is the top-clamping Veritas Mk l (cheaper and more basic) or Mk ll (has a great deal of range, along with a side clamping accessory).

Regards from Perth

Derek

Japanese blades? In a jig? Why?

 

[bilboburgler]

there seem to be basically two types of hone, one where the jig rides on the diamonds and you hone along the length of the chisel and one where the chisel sits in a jig and the diamonds hone across the end of the chisel. The second one will always allow you to make shorter chisels. However, chisels are cheap and hones can be expensive.

Focusing on the first type you can pay from £10 to £200 for this type. They all struggle with narrow chisels and the cheaper ones tend to be a bit tricky to get level. The very cheap ones often need a file or two to get flat, or you sometimes even have to support off the rails rather than the monkey metal castings. The YoHold with clamping on the side and top at £20 are good value the idea has been around since the 40s but is new to market after the Canadians came up with a £200 perfect solution.

Side honing like FASTTRACK Chisel Sharpener - MK2 - MPOWER Tools UK will give you access to shorter chisels. £70 is a lot and you can get a plastic version of this more like £40.

Then you can look at the £250+ range of sharpening machines which are a great way to spend £250+

 

[Derek Cohen (Perth Oz)]

Japanese blades? In a jig? Why?

I sharpen everything freehand except BU plane blades. All my Japanese chisels are honed flat on the bevel in the traditional manner. But the OP asked for a jig to sharpen all types of blades, so one might assume that this could include Japanese blades. Why not? Some do. Their blades are shorter. However the thick lands are not suited to a side-clamp style guide.

Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[Eamonn]

Hi Eamonn

I would avoid both these jigs as they are flawed.

The Kell is finicky to set up and then is awkward to control.

The Alisam is designed for diamond plates of the exact same height and width, and would be a problem on stones which vary in thickness.

Side clamping jigs, such as the Eclipse and LN, are best suited for blades with an even thickness and which are parallel. This is an issue if you use vintage tapered blades or Japanese blades.

Your best bet for a universal jig is the top-clamping Veritas Mk l (cheaper and more basic) or Mk ll (has a great deal of range, along with a side clamping accessory).

Regards from Perth

Derek

Thanks all for your thoughts...

In all honesty, I am thinking of going fully to diamond stones. Diamond stones for my Tormek wheel and diamond stones for my hand sharpening.

The Tormek will be used for turning, carving/rounded chisels... and grinding down my hand chisels, before putting the final edge on with a hand jig. I'm thinking of getting a 400grit, 800 and a 1200 grit diamond stone/plate.

I love my 400 grit and 1200 grit water stones... but I think it's the time to try new things. How are folks finding the diamond stones/plates and what jigs are they using.

 

[Hornbeam]

I dont think changing sharpening medium will really make any significant difference to your sharpness. Water stones can be a bit messy and need occasional flattening but they will give you a fantastic sharpness. Do you go any finer than 1200g? I tend to use 1200 for general purpose but 6000g for higher quality work or wher esharpness is absolutely critical
I would suggest cutting a plywood wedge at 30 degrees and practice hand sharpening using the wedge as an angle guide

 

[Derek Cohen (Perth Oz)]

Perhaps you should state what type of blades, even brands, you plan to sharpen. I really think the Alisam is a poor design (= gimmick for beginners) as it relies on the table for flatness and the media to be exactly the same height all around and between all media. Also doamond stones are fine for starting but insufficient for polishing, unless you strop like a demon!

Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[steve355]

Can’t you get a little piece of wood, cut to the angle, take a nibble off the end and use that? Running over the stone askew will work.

I went through a period of using my finger running on the stone to get approx the right angle. Creates mucky hands, but produces a reasonably accurate edge.

 

[mathias]

I use the Kell with big wheels on Atoma diamond stones and a last touch with scary sharp at different angles. I do not agree that it is difficult to setup at all once you have the angles you want and make a stop block to repeat them.

Though one need to be careful when sharpening wide plane blades, 5 1/2 planes and up as the Atoma plates could be a little wider.

Perhaps I should add that I find it easier to use it the other way around, with the edge near me and the wheels behind the edge.

Added: I only do woodwork a few times a year with almost no professional training and would therefore never even consider do sharpening by hand only

 

[mathias]

two (bad) photos to show

 

[Derek Cohen (Perth Oz)]

Mathias, I have this one as well. It is difficult to hold when honing, and there is the constant risk that the blade will move position.

It is too narrow for plane blades. If it could be used on plane blades (there is a larger version), the widely set wheels will make cambering extremely difficult if not impossible.

Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[mathias]

Thea reasons I choose this are that it seemed to be good in general, very good at narrow (see photo and could take the N°80 scarper blade (photo @35°)

 

[mathias]

Mathias, I have this one as well. It is difficult to hold when honing, and there is the constant risk that the blade will move position.

It is too narrow for plane blades. If it could be used on plane blades (there is a larger version), the widely set wheels will make cambering extremely difficult if not impossible.

Regards from Perth

Derek

I do not agree the way I use it. One has to pay attention with blades from 5 1/2 and up (>60mm) to stay on the Atoma (75mm wide). I do not camber more then I can achieve with thumb pressure and knock of corner freehand

For scrub plane camber I alternate thumb pressure and a raiser under one wheel at a time. Not very regular curve but i is a scrub....

 

[pe2dave]

Thanks all for your thoughts...

In all honesty, I am thinking of going fully to diamond stones. Diamond stones for my Tormek wheel and diamond stones for my hand sharpening.

The Tormek will be used for turning, carving/rounded chisels... and grinding down my hand chisels, before putting the final edge on with a hand jig. I'm thinking of getting a 400grit, 800 and a 1200 grit diamond stone/plate.

I love my 400 grit and 1200 grit water stones... but I think it's the time to try new things. How are folks finding the diamond stones/plates and what jigs are they using.

Off the Tormek you should be able to use a strop to get the finer edge / finish on the tools. Not sure a jig will improve that - it's the stone that does the work?
Piece of 4x2 and a tube of Autosol should provide a good finish and edge.

 

[BearTricks]

I have the Veritas MK2 and the basic Axminster one but I am very tempted by a whetstone grinder.

The manual jigs work well but I find it’s a lot of faff before you get to using your tools.