Sharpening for beginners

[curlycomber]

Hi,

I am still new to all this but loving it.

I have in the past bought a variety of "sharpening jigs", Stanley for instance and haven't had a huge amount real success, probably I don't know what I am doing. I did see on this forum a system from Axminster called Vertitas (maybe).

Is this a better way of doing the job. In the past I either have had a problem getting the angle correct or getting the blade to stay square in the jig.

The one I think I saw was more expensive that the Stanley and look more comprehensive.

Any advice would be gratefully received.

 

[bugbear]

Hi,

I am still new to all this but loving it.

I have in the past bought a variety of "sharpening jigs", Stanley for instance and haven't had a huge amount real success, probably I don't know what I am doing. I did see on this forum a system from Axminster called Vertitas (maybe).

...

Any advice would be gratefully received.

Assuming you're sharpening "normal" blades i.e. bench plane blades and chisels in the width range 1/4" - 1", I would recommend using the simple Eclipse (style) jig.

http://www.axminster.co.uk/product-Axmi ... -21261.htm

In conjunction with a very-simple-to-make projection block:

I suspect you may be trying to get the jig to excercise all the control of the tool. What you need to do is to "pretend" to sharpen freehand, but let the jig "guide you". It's no good hoping that the jig will excercise complete control over you. You're much bigger and stronger than the jig

BugBear

 

[curlycomber]

Thanks for the swift reply. I have exactly that honing guide. So it must be me.

How does the very-simple-to-make projection block work, I am sure it should be obvious

 

[Dave Bamber]

I don't know if this is any help to you, but I'm a pretty much complete WW beginner and have read a *lot* of guides on how to sharpen irons as well as tried a few honing guides (including making my own as someone elsewhere recommended).

Nothing really got me a result I was happy with until I read this site: http://www.antiquetools.com/sharp/

In it, the chap suggests ditching the honing guide altogether. Hmm, I thought, I guess it won't *cost* anything to try it that way. So, I took my previously unexciting faithfull-brand LA block plane iron to first some el-cheapo £10 diamond sharpening stones with oil, then some 1500 grit sandpaper on glass using the techniques that chap suggests and 'feeling' the bevel, low and behold, this thing now shaves full-length end grain from hardwood pretty much effortlessly. Believe me, it changed the way I felt about sharpening doing it that way - I actually wanted to get all my chisels and irons out and give them a good going over...

I would guess the honing guide might be useful if you really wanted a specific angle, but I'm more insterested in results than numbers.

 

[curlycomber]

Many thanks for that I will read that and any other info. Being new means an avalanche of info.

 

[bugbear]

Thanks for the swift reply. I have exactly that honing guide. So it must be me.

How does the very-simple-to-make projection block work, I am sure it should be obvious

The projection distances for 25 and 30 degrees are marked on the honing guide (or in the instructions).

While this distance can be measured with a ruler, it's a bit fiddly.

It could be measured with a combination square, set to the correct distance, but that's extravagent.

The wooden jig simply embodies the correct distances, measured from the "heel" (bottom of the illustration) to the stop-blocks.

There is a little lip UNDER the jig, to hold it in place on a worktop (like a bench hook).

So, to use: place the jig on a worktop, and loosely insert the tool in the honing guide. Push the honing guide to the heel of the jig. Push the tool forward in the honing guide until it touches the stop-block and tighten the screw on the honing guide.

This ensures not only that the projection is more or less right (giving the desired angle), but (more importantly) that the projection si the same every time, to very good accuracy.

BugBear

 

[curlycomber]

Thank you Bugbear,

I understand now, many thanks for that. Now I know what part of my weekend will be spent doing.

 

[frugal]

In it, the chap suggests ditching the honing guide altogether. Hmm, I thought, I guess it won't *cost* anything to try it that way. So, I took my previously unexciting faithfull-brand LA block plane iron to first some el-cheapo £10 diamond sharpening stones with oil, then some 1500 grit sandpaper on glass using the techniques that chap suggests and 'feeling' the bevel, low and behold, this thing now shaves full-length end grain from hardwood pretty much effortlessly.

I have tried this in the past, but I find that without a guide I can not keep the angle of the blade consistant through the stroke along the stone so I end up with a curved face rather than a nice flat one.

 

[Dave Bamber]

I have tried this in the past, but I find that without a guide I can not keep the angle of the blade consistant through the stroke along the stone so I end up with a curved face rather than a nice flat one.

There's a definate 'knack' to doing it that way, which that chap kindly shows on the link above.

It becomes less of a science and more of a tactile feedback dexterity thing I guess which feeds well from my experience as a guitarist. Horses for courses, of course. Obviously guides do work as there are lots of them made and sold, I just didn't get the results I wanted from them, and seemed to get instant great results from that technique mentioned above.

Whatever works I guess...

 

[bugbear]

I don't know if this is any help to you, but I'm a pretty much complete WW beginner and have read a *lot* of guides on how to sharpen irons as well as tried a few honing guides (including making my own as someone elsewhere recommended).

Nothing really got me a result I was happy with until I read this site: http://www.antiquetools.com/sharp/

In it, the chap suggests ditching the honing guide altogether.

Almost any freehand technique will work nicely on a freshly ground (i.e. flat and low) primary bevel.

But in all of them I've seen, there's a massive tendancy for the bevel to become steeper and rounder with time. One is also precluded from the labour saving benefits of double bevelling.

BugBear

 

[Oryxdesign]

I think really it all amounts to personal preference but just to add my two pennyth... I've got a veritas honing guage, it gives me good repeatability and it's nice to get a very flat accurate bevel. I do use it sometimes to hone my micro bevel but not always. I would say it's a good starting point for a beginner to get achievable results and shalows learning curve.

 

[Joel Moskowitz]

Almost any freehand technique will work nicely on a freshly ground (i.e. flat and low) primary bevel.

But in all of them I've seen, there's a massive tendancy for the bevel to become steeper and rounder with time. One is also precluded from the labour saving benefits of double bevelling.

BugBear

- I have chisels that have never been reground in 20 years. THe flat is just maintained with no problem. THat said since it only takes a minute or so to restore a hollow grind it's not something I agonize about when it needs to be done. (you are right that if I don't pay attention when honing the bevel can become steeper and rounded).
I don't think there are any real labor saving benefits of double beveling because the time it takes to wipe out the old wire edge and re-establish a wire edge with a medium india or a 1k water stone is seconds and most of the time is spent chasing the burr which would be the same if honing a primary or secondary bevel.

 

[dunbarhamlin]

Almost any freehand technique [...] one is also precluded from the labour saving benefits of double bevelling.

Not sure I see this.

Touching up frequently obviates the labour saving value of a secondary bezel, as regrinding is never required - provided technique is good enough (I'm getting there, with bezel remaining flatter and flatter - naturally easier with a thick blade)

But nothing prevents honing a microbezel freehand. If a blade's being awkward (OK, read, "If I've fluffed it,") I do do this - just means at some point I'm going to have to regrind (for which I do use a jig so I can sit and do it on autopilot)

Cheers
Steve

 

[guyos]

What do you think of this sharpening box?

I came across it while surfing the net, never seen it before.

The system looks good to me, I am using a Veritas guide and waterstones but I understand that they will wear quickly.

With this system, you use any part or corner of the stone, the video is impressive.

It isn't available in the UK, but I think that I could make up a fixed angle jig that uses the method.

http://www.blumtoolco.com/

I have made up the jig and tested it on an old dog of a chisel that I had given to me and used mainly like a cold chisel it iwas really rough.

With very little work, it turned back into a reasonable wood chisel .

The jig was so easy to make.

guyos

 

[newt]

How do you stop the jig wearing on the top surface?

 

[Harbo]

I have to agree with newt - I would think you would have to put some replaceable tape on the top to prevent wear?

A similar system but without that problem is the Edge Pro

http://www.edgeproinc.com/

I have had the Apex system for many years now and it is really excellent for sharpening kitchen knives etc. but it wont handle irons - but the Pro system will.

Rod

 

[gidon]

How do you stop the jig wearing on the top surface?

Yes - is UHMW plastic tougher than diamonds!!

I have some in my shed - will have to try it ...

Cheers

Gidon