Saw blade... deflection?

[brucew]

I've been using a track saw the last couple years for DIY work and recently changed to Freud blades (165mm, 1.7mm kerf) because they are so widely recommended. Yet, when I take an edge off of thick oak, the blade starts to struggle halfway along and drifts outward even though my saw track is still in place. I checked & tightened the saws track-fitting knobs but still have that problem.

Could it be that the Freud blades are too thin and the blade is deflecting? If I move to the middle of the cut and plunge straight down, it stays on line. If I use my cheaper 2.6mm kerf blade, it cuts straight.

 

[Myfordman]

Check that your blade is precisely parallel to the guide slot in the sole plate of the saw.

 

[Hornbeam]

When you say you are taking the edge of a thick oak board, Are you actually cutting a strip of or cutting a thickness less than the full kerf of the blade?

 

[Inspector]

May I ask the tooth count on the blades you are using? My cheap saw came with a 48 tooth blade which is fine for MDF and plywood but lousy for ripping hardwood. I recently bought a 16 tooth Freud blade that is 2.5mm just for ripping hardwood. Works much better. If you are using a high tooth count blade to rip hardwood that may be your issue.

Pete

 

[Sideways]

I suspect part of the problem is trying to plane less than a full kerf width with the blade and that the Freud blades are overrated. They aren't anywhere near as good as an original Festool blade for example. Freud = a triumph of marketing red paint over substance.

 

[Ollie78]

I suspect part of the problem is trying to plane less than a full kerf width with the blade and that the Freud blades are overrated. They aren't anywhere near as good as an original Festool blade for example. Freud = a triumph of marketing red paint over substance.

I think they are slightly better than the budget Trend ones I normally get in packs of 3 on ebay but agree not as nice as the Festool ones.
However, they are half the price of the Festool so not terrible and more commonly found than the Festool originals, at least near me.

As to the original problem it could be just going too fast, pushing the saw faster than the kerf clears can give you grief. When trimming slim or uneven edges off I try to go really slow and careful.

Ollie

 

[brucew]

When you say you are taking the edge of a thick oak board, Are you actually cutting a strip of or cutting a thickness less than the full kerf of the blade?

A few cuts with thickness less than the full kerf of the blade. Did not work on a Freud but seemed to work without problems on a cheap Parkside blade. But even a crosscut through the centre of the board struggled and veered off line... though I can't be sure that the track didn't slide when the blade struggled on that particular one. For the others I used a rail clamp.

 

[brucew]

May I ask the tooth count on the blades you are using? My cheap saw came with a 48 tooth blade which is fine for MDF and plywood but lousy for ripping hardwood. I recently bought a 16 tooth Freud blade that is 2.5mm just for ripping hardwood. Works much better. If you are using a high tooth count blade to rip hardwood that may be your issue.

Pete

These were all across the grain of a 40mm thick board, so not going very fast, and using a 40 tooth blade.

 

[brucew]

I think they are slightly better than the budget Trend ones I normally get in packs of 3 on ebay but agree not as nice as the Festool ones.
However, they are half the price of the Festool so not terrible and more commonly found than the Festool originals, at least near me.

As to the original problem it could be just going too fast, pushing the saw faster than the kerf clears can give you grief. When trimming slim or uneven edges off I try to go really slow and careful.

Ollie

I suspect part of the problem is trying to plane less than a full kerf width with the blade and that the Freud blades are overrated. They aren't anywhere near as good as an original Festool blade for example. Freud = a triumph of marketing red paint over substance.

Been wondering about whether Freud blades are overrated. Other good blades besides Festool which are insanely dear? Ollie , are you saying you've found Trend pretty decent?

 

[Inspector]

These were all across the grain of a 40mm thick board, so not going very fast, and using a 40 tooth blade.

Okay. When you wrote "Yet, when I take an edge off of thick oak," my mind went to ripping. I never think of the end of a board as an edge. Probably just me though.

Pete

 

[brucew]

Okay. When you wrote "Yet, when I take an edge off of thick oak," my mind went to ripping. I never think of the end of a board as an edge. Probably just me though.

Pete

Em, I can understand that. Unintentional misdirection. Only one cut of the day was a rip -- with a crosscut blade -- and veered off line, without bogging down! Go figure.

 

[clogs]

go get it resharpened......and try again.....
even a new blade works better with a regrind.....

as for makes of blade...unless they are imported I just have to buy what available....
Honestly I've had no probs at all.....
BUT befrore use they all go to the grinders.....we have an amazing chap here to do it.....just wish he'd work a bit faster....
So 2 blades of every type I use has to be stocked....

 

[Sideways]

https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/threads/table-and-mitre-saw-blade-quality.138352/

 

[Ollie78]

Been wondering about whether Freud blades are overrated. Other good blades besides Festool which are insanely dear? Ollie , are you saying you've found Trend pretty decent?

Yes the Trend ones are fine. I get 3 for less than the price of a single Festool. The 18 tooth ones are perfect for general use on hardwoods and not bad on sheet materials.

Ollie

 

[paulm]

These were all across the grain of a 40mm thick board, so not going very fast, and using a 40 tooth blade.

Likely that the 40 tooth blade in 40mm oak is the problem, too many teeth for the thickness of material, exacerbated by trying to do partial kerf cuts, a thicker blade would help too of course.

I've always found the Freud blades good, as long as you use the right blade for the task as with any brand.

 

[Jacob]

A few cuts with thickness less than the full kerf of the blade. ....

You can hit the same prob with other blades and planers too. If you are just paring the edge then any deflection will be out rather than in, and accumulate, whereas in a full kerf deflection will be towards either side and tend to be self correcting. A heavier blade with a wider set would be better.

 

[Spectric]

that the Freud blades are overrated

Did try one some while back to see what all the fuss is about, nothing special really and so I use the Makita blades that work fine.

Also the thiner blades are aimed at the cordless saws to help battery life. Makita do the 1.6mm blades for corded and 1 mm blades for the cordless.

 

[peter-harrison]

One thing you could check is if there's any resin buildup on the teeth. This can cause the blade to wander.

 

[brucew]

I'll do some measurements and further testing on some comparable offcuts at the next weekend. Thanks for all the things to consider and look for.

 

[johnnyb]

is that the wrong size blade? 1.7mm kerf will be for cordless saws. tracksaw blades are normally 2.2mm. I've found freud blades are OK unfortuneatly the tracksaw blades are negative rake. them trend ones are good and cheap.