Removing chuck from ML10 Lathe

[stewart]

Hi all
I've got my metal lathe in place now and am familiarising myself with it - sadly no manual - I'm having a problem removing the chuck as I can't find a way to stop the spindle spinning while I try to unscrew the chuck. Is there something I'm missing? A hidden locking lever? Or is it a case of holding the drive pulley securely and trying a bit more force?

 

[OLD]

I remember from school that they inserted the key and then hit it to loosen the chuck it worked for my metal work teacher.

 

[dickm]

The common Myfords don't have any mechanism locking the chuck in place, but it's possible (though I think unlikely) that others have this facility.
The first suggestion is to lock the spindle completely by engaging the back gear (assuming you know what that is - ask again if it's a problem) but NOT releasing the lock on the main gear. Then you can put more force on the chuck. Possibly use a strap wrench on the chuck, to give a bit more leverage, or if you are careful, put the key in the chuck and give it a sharp tap on the end of the key to "shock" the chuck free. (OK, Old, you beat me too it!)
If that fails, then the standard trick is to get a metal bar about 10mm square, hold it across the centre of the face of the chuck, and tighten the chuck jaws on to it. This will give more leverage, but there IS the risk of distorting the jaws. A sharp tap on the end of the bar may also help.
Beyond that, oh dear.....
Next time, you may want to put a thin paper washer between the back of the chuck and the register on the spindle nose.

 

[Digit]

Beyond the that Dick you take desperate measures. I assume that the M10 will run in reverse, if so you stand a block of wood on the bed at the back of the chuck, rest one one chuck jaw onto it and quickly turn it late on then off in reverse!
Like I said, desperate measures.

Roy.

 

[dickm]

Beyond the that Dick you take desperate measures. I assume that the M10 will run in reverse, if so you stand a block of wood on the bed at the back of the chuck, rest one one chuck jaw onto it and quickly turn it late on then off in reverse!

..... and the chuck either comes free, or you sweep the teeth of the reverse gear off the floor

 

[stewart]

Thanks for the speedy replies!
So, brute force but controlled then...
Dick I'm a total newbie with lathes so your talk of back gear and the main gear is beyond me at the moment! Is it easy to explain or should I wait for the manual I bought on ebay to arrive?

 

[9fingers]

Stewart,
Backgear on the ML10 is a pair of gears on a stud mounted behind the main spindle. These might have been removed and in with other accessories or at worst lost.
When you find it mesh it deeply with the small gear onto the bull wheel - the big one to the left of the chuck and the other two gears will mesh too.
This will lock the spindle.
Then open the chuck jaws and use a length of wood between the jaws and flat against the face of the chuck. Use this as a lever to unscrew the chuck.

Using the key and hitting it as others have suggested can lead to rapid removal of gear teeth. When you get it off, clear the register surfaces and lightly oil and get in the habit of loosening the chuck after each job.

hth

Bob

Suggest you join http://groups.yahoo.com/group/MyMyford/

where you can find files to download free such as manuals. The group is mainly dedicated to ML3/ML4 and ML7 but there are some references to ML10

 

[stewart]

Hi Bob
Thanks for the tip about the Yahoo Group - have submitted a request to join.
Here's a picture of the main gear and three other gears that can be moved by adjusting a lever which you can see part of to the right of the picture. Are these the gears you mean? If so, I think they need adjusting to be able to lock the main gear:

 

[9fingers]

No those are the tumbler reversing gears, made of tufnol and VERY fragile. Never ever move these when the lathe is running. You use these for fine feed and screwcutting only

Look for a forked lug at the back of the lathe near the chuck. there should be a stubby shaft bolted there with a pair of gears one much larger than the other. As i said before these could have been removed or lost. you will see this in the manual. My ML7RB uses a different system so I can't show you a picture of that.

If you can't find the backgear then cut a softwood wedge and jam it between the bullwheel (about 60 teeth just behind the chuck) and the headstock at the back, then use the rest of my method from my earlier post.

HTh

Bob

if you like take a pic from 180 degrees to your last one, from behind the lathe and i can tell you if the gear is there.

 

[stewart]

Hi again, Bob
Here are a couple of pictures from the other side of the lathe - are these the back gears?

 

[9fingers]

Hi Stewart,

Yes the gears are there! Loosen the hex nut to the right of the chuck in your first photo of the last mail and move the gears deeply into mesh. You might need to rotate the chuck to find a point where both gear pairs mesh well. Tighten the nut and do not power up the machine and the spindle will now be locked rigid.
Now remove the chuck using steady effort rather than jerking if at all possible. remember all the leverage you are putting in is ending up on thse gear teeth. They MUST mesh down to the roots.

If this does not work then there is another method so come back to me.
if you pm me your email addy i should be able to mail you something from the manual.

Bob

 

[stewart]

Thanks, Bob. That did the trick!
Best wishes

 

[9fingers]

Excellent!

Welcome to the new slope. Armed with the manual and Sparey you should soon be finding your way round the machine and making swarf.
Any probs just give me a shout.

Bob

 

[Digit]

Looks like another workshop widow is about to join the club doesn't it?

Roy.

 

[stewart]

Thanks, Bob and Roy - yep the slope is beckoning and my wife is making widow noises...guess I'll have to be careful
I'm just off to the workshop where I collected the lathe from to pick up more goodies - mostly bits of metal today - and to have another drool over the milling machine while I work on plans to move it.
As an aside, what do the back gears do? Are they only for locking the spindle or do they have another function?

 

[9fingers]

Hi Stewart,

Back gear introduces a significant speed reduction typically 6-10:1 - ie much more than pulley changing and is used especially when screw cutting.
There will be a mthod of disconnecting the thru drive on the bull wheel somewhere and the drive will then go from the brass gear, onto the back gear cluster large end and back to the bullwheel and chuck.
Your manual will show just how to do this. Once again it is different from my Myford ML7RB so I can't tell you exactly how to do it.

Bob

 

[stewart]

Thanks again, Bob!
I'm going to enjoy reading the manual when it arrives!

 

[dickm]

The back gears are for reducing the rotational speed of the chuck. To get them to work, you will have to release the larger gear from the main shaft, so the drive goes from the pulley, via the free gear to the backgear, then from the other gear on the back shaft to the gear that is permanently attached to the mainshaft ( if you see what I mean! - it's all well explained in Sparey). Releasing the back gear on the Myford 7s involves just flicking a semicircular cam with a finger lever on it, but I'm not sure about the 10. If, as you've discovered, you don't release the gear, the whole thing is locked up.
One tip, from bitter experience - if you are using the back gear regularly, make sure the bearings of the "free" gear are well lubricated (there's an oiler nipple on the mainshaft) or it can seize, which could be<<very>> expensive.

 

[stewart]

Thanks for the further explanation, Dick. I think it'll be some time before I get into screw cutting and using the back gears - but I have had a go today trying to make a copy of this:

...a precision stop sold by the Craftsman Gallery for the woodrat.

I've managed to make the horizontal bar and knurled end piece - still going with the horizontal nut...and even made it indoors in time for some of the evening with my wife, though the pull of the slope was hard to resist :roll:

 

[9fingers]

Hi Stewart,

Looks like the bug is starting to bite!

One further tip. I tend to find that treading the odd bit a of sawdust into the house only gets mild rebuke but metal swarf does get a more violent reaction as it tends to wind into the carpets and stay there. It has on occasions found its way into the bed - need I go on...... :wink:

Try and find as soon as possible some little repair job that you can do at immediate using the lathe to benefit SWMBO so that you build up some domestic bliss credits.

Happy Machining

Bob