Radiator on studs on top of bricks

[phloaw]

I think this turned into a very useful thread, at least for me: thanks everyone.
@J-G : I was amazed at the fact that you cared enough to take the time to draw.
@Jonm: this is exactly the solution I was thinking of! Due to problems in sourcing dedicated fixing such as dryline, corefix, rigifix, etc. Do you know if the 10mm steel tube is easy to find in hardware shops?

 

[Doug B]

This conversation spike my interest & made me wonder what weight a plasterboard fixing could take a quick google bought up several different makes a few of which were new to me, this P/B fixing claims 113kg per fixing more weight than I imagined

https://www.gripitfixings.co.uk/products/gripit-blue
They claim it is suitable for hanging boilers on a wall, interestingly I couldn’t find a weight for the Fisher toggle I tend to use.

 

[phloaw]

There is a wide choice of plasterboard fasteners, some of which can indeed stand big loads (see here for non-rigorous experiments: ).
However, the problem is long-term: vibrations, jolts, etc. can induce a progressive decay of the material, leading to final failure. This problem can be worked around with glue to prevent the slightest movement.
Disclaimer: I have no direct experience of all this, I only googled.

I would therefore avoid fastening to plasterboard if at all possible. This doesn't mean that good plasterboard securing is impossible, merely that I don't feel confident myself achieving one.

 

[Rorschach]

Cheap decorators filler or cheap no more nails type adhesive (not decorators caulk, you want stuff that sets pretty hard, you can also mix your own powder filler and put in an old mastic tube) in a mastic gun is great for preventing plasterboard from collapsing if you only have a shallow cavity, drill your hole, squirt in a good splodge of the filler/adhesive and let it set overnight. You now have a pretty solid bridge between the plasterboard and the wall behind. As long as you are fitting something with a washer/bracket that spreads the load the plasterboard now won't collapse.

This trick works well for fixing the same issue caused by someone else.

 

[Misterdog]

a crappy bit of folded plastic

Only expanding metal fastners designed for the job and load tested have been suggested though,

 

[user 35906]

Was an heating engineer for 42 years and no way would I try to fix a rad through plasterboard into a 1/2" batten if there was bricks behind it, have had to repair plenty of rads that have been fitted with toggle screws in plasterboard and thermolite blocks aren't much better behind dry lining especially in kids bedrooms. I wonder why all/most radiators are supplied with plugs and long screws and not plasterboard fixings and glue

 

[phloaw]

Was an heating engineer for 42 years and no way would I try to fix a rad through plasterboard into a 1/2" batten if there was bricks behind it, have had to repair plenty of rads that have been fitted with toggle screws in plasterboard and thermolite blocks aren't much better behind dry lining especially in kids bedrooms. I wonder why all/most radiators are supplied with plugs and long screws and not plasterboard fixings and glue

Not sure: do you mean the way to go is to fasten to bricks?

 

[Spectric]

You can get these issues with dot and dab plasterboard, my solution has been to drill a 6mm hole through the pboard into the massonary. Then using a hole saw centred on yur hole cut out the pboard to leave a void, now drill out the 6mm hole to suit the nylon fischer plug and fit plug. Need a round section of wood with a hole in it that fits the hole and sits flush, now you can screw straight into the plug and no compression of pboard or extraction of plug that can blow out face of certain types masonary.

 

[user 35906]

Not sure: do you mean the way to go is to fasten to bricks?

Through batten to stop pulling plasterboard in and into brick behind then long screws. I could have fitted a full c/h system in the time this we are still discussing screwing a couple of rad brackets on

 

[Rob_Mc]

There are specific products designed for fixing into brickwork and bridging the cavity between plasterboard and wall in high load situations. They are designed to ensure you don't deflect the plasterboard when tightening the fixing. For example Rigifix;

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Rigifix-M8...ocphy=1006948&hvtargid=pla-695947142142&psc=1
I have used these and they work brilliantly. You drill a hole in the wall through to the brickwork, insert the plastic sleeve, screw the long metal insert into the plastic sleeve with an allen key. This leaves the metal insert flush with the plasterboard and fully supported by the brickwork, so when you tighten you radiator bracket up against it (with the provided M8 screw) the plasterboard can't deflect in over.

Here is a video showing the principle;



I use mainly the M8 version but a smaller M6 version is available. You need to drill a 16mm hole (100mm long) for the M8 sleeve.



Here is the datasheet with the specifications and load bearing capacity;

http://buyrigifixonline.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/Rigifix_Main_Datasheet-DELTALEIGH.pdf

 

[Jonm]

I think this turned into a very useful thread, at least for me: thanks everyone.
@J-G : I was amazed at the fact that you cared enough to take the time to draw.
@Jonm: this is exactly the solution I was thinking of! Due to problems in sourcing dedicated fixing such as dryline, corefix, rigifix, etc. Do you know if the 10mm steel tube is easy to find in hardware shops?

The problem I had was hanging kitchen wall cupboards on a 9 inch wall which had been lined with 50mm celotex and plasterboard, no studs, the plasterboard was fixed back to the wall with long plasterboard screws. In places there was a gap between the celotex and the wall, foam filled. Advantage was that there were no cold spots.

I bought the steel tube from a local steel supplier. The closest one only sold it in 6 metre lengths but I reasoned that it would come in useful for other things, and it has. I had a quick look online and there are steel places that sell shorter lengths. When I come across this problem I tend to use this method as I have the tube available.

If you only have a 12 mm gap then Rorschach method should be fine, provided you have time to wait for it to set. As he said, you need the cheap stuff that sets solid.

Cheap decorators filler or cheap no more nails type adhesive (not decorators caulk, you want stuff that sets pretty hard, you can also mix your own powder filler and put in an old mastic tube) in a mastic gun is great for preventing plasterboard from collapsing if you only have a shallow cavity, drill your hole, squirt in a good splodge of the filler/adhesive and let it set overnight. You now have a pretty solid bridge between the plasterboard and the wall behind. As long as you are fitting something with a washer/bracket that spreads the load the plasterboard now won't collapse.

This trick works well for fixing the same issue caused by someone else.

 

[baldkev]

Hold my beer......

Im not going to weigh in on the p.b fixing debate, but i would mark out the section of wall where the rad is going, including bracket height, cut out the p.b behind the rad and stick a lump of ply in.
This way you get to check and if necessary, reinforce the batten fixings ( 12mm studs?? ) before you install the ply. You can use 15mm ply, fill as necessary ( hidden behind rad, but scrim tape and easifill would be nice ) paint it wall colour, hang brackets and rad.... at least you can use 5x30 screws into the ply

 

[Stevekane]

Only expanding metal fastners designed for the job and load tested have been suggested though,

Artistic licence old fruit,,,but you get the point and our chum the heating engineer confirms what I suspect most people would think, hanging a rad onto just plasterboard with any type of fixing is chancy to say the least.

 

[johnny]

Through batten to stop pulling plasterboard in and into brick behind then long screws. I could have fitted a full c/h system in the time this we are still discussing screwing a couple of rad brackets on

that made me laugh Hunter........ sometimes you just want to say '...oh for heavens sake just give it to me and I'll do it for you ' lol

 

[Daniel2]

Right, but that's not really in the spirit of the forum is it ?

 

[johnny]

...lighten up Daniel.... we cannot expect everyone to always agree with us about everything can we eh !
A Forum is a place for meeting and open discussion