Radiator on studs on top of bricks
- Thread starter phloaw
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Woody Alan
Established Member
You could always try the appropriate fixings for dot and dab Corefix Metal Origional Heavy Duty Dot & Dab Wall Fixing 10 x 95mm 24 Pack They come in different sizes and have a steel support tube to avoid crushing plasterboard.
1steven
Claremorris Ireland
This should do you. Fischer SXR Hexagon Frame Fixings | Frame Fixings - MIDFIX
J-G
Established Member
I don't consider a sketch 'amazing' in any way - it's the way I work. If you can draw a 'problem' then you are more likely to understand the issues involved in the solution - or - as my father said many times "If you can draw it Lad, you can make it".
As Confucius apparently said, "A picture is worth a thousand words"
My guess being accurate is more down to your initial description, which, although sketchy, did provide the salient information.
There may be more appropriate solutions of course, I haven't investigated the various 'Plaster-board' fixings that have also been proposed.
CornishWoodworker
Established Member
12mm isn't a lot but if you use screws and use a construction adhesive between bracket and plasterboard, that should suffice.
That's the way I was taught.
Mollys into the plasterboard and glue between bracket and plasterboard.
IMO, fixing into the bricks may cause a hydraulic bridge for damp.
Misterdog
Established Member
johnny
Established Member
forget hanging your radiator on the plasterboard or just the battens as some have suggested .
It is not a sensible option for such a lot of weight.
Using plasterboard fixings to hang heavy items like radiators and wash hand basins should only be used as a last resort when there is not a more substantial substrate to fix to.
The first time someone uses the radiator to pull themselves upright after kneeling on the floor it will rip the fixings straight out of the plasterboard.
Fix the radiator brackets in the manner that J-G has outlined in his excellent sketch and you will never have the worry of the brackets coming loose or the radiator coming off the wall .
Before I became an Architect I was a Plumber and Corgi C Heating Engineer for many years and fixed many thousands of radiators and wash basins to all manner of walls . The number of times I had to remedy failed plasterboard fixings that others had fitted were too great to number.
It is not a sensible option for such a lot of weight.
Using plasterboard fixings to hang heavy items like radiators and wash hand basins should only be used as a last resort when there is not a more substantial substrate to fix to.
The first time someone uses the radiator to pull themselves upright after kneeling on the floor it will rip the fixings straight out of the plasterboard.
Fix the radiator brackets in the manner that J-G has outlined in his excellent sketch and you will never have the worry of the brackets coming loose or the radiator coming off the wall .
Before I became an Architect I was a Plumber and Corgi C Heating Engineer for many years and fixed many thousands of radiators and wash basins to all manner of walls . The number of times I had to remedy failed plasterboard fixings that others had fitted were too great to number.
I don't think so. I think they just became known as such, like
Hoover, Thermos or Elastoplast.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molly_(fastener)
Jonm
Established Member
I have an aversion to fixing to plasterboard and avoid it where possible, except for light objects. I appreciate that phloaw has been lucky and has battens behind the plasterboard where his fixings go. Where this is not the case I tend to use some 10mm steel tubing, bought specially for this.
Drill 10mm hole through plasterboard, insert tube to hit brickwork, mark and cut to length so it just protrudes beyond plasterboard, insert drill down tube (7mm works, not sure about 8mm) drill hole, put plug just on end of screw and insert plug. May need to remove screw and tap plug in place with punch (or large nail with head cut off).
I have used these where there was 50mm celotex plus air gap varying up to 30mm behind the plasterboard. Here is sketch
If the gap was small then the corefix suggested by Woody Alan look good, particularly if there were a reasonable number to do.
On my house build, the builder ensured that there was dab behind all the radiator brackets to avoid this problem.
Drill 10mm hole through plasterboard, insert tube to hit brickwork, mark and cut to length so it just protrudes beyond plasterboard, insert drill down tube (7mm works, not sure about 8mm) drill hole, put plug just on end of screw and insert plug. May need to remove screw and tap plug in place with punch (or large nail with head cut off).
I have used these where there was 50mm celotex plus air gap varying up to 30mm behind the plasterboard. Here is sketch
If the gap was small then the corefix suggested by Woody Alan look good, particularly if there were a reasonable number to do.
On my house build, the builder ensured that there was dab behind all the radiator brackets to avoid this problem.
With respect, I have hung enough radiators to have lost count, and have yet to have any
issue with this technique. Plasterboard is, in fact, immensely strong when correct fixation
techniques are applied.
Think of upper kitchen units. Usually hung only from the plasterboard, and they too
carry far more weight than a radiator.
Probably the failures you have witnessed are due to incorrect application techniques.
Stevekane
Established Member
Im sure plasterboard is incredibly strong but I personally wouldnt want to hang heavy things like radiators onto just it, esp as has been said, people do daft things like leaning on them and kids pulling themselves up on them. Screw through the battons will give you a decent fixing but, if as you have said the rad would look better sitting between the batons why not just cut the plasterboard and screw a couple of batons where you want them, finish with a wipe of polyfiller which will be hidden by both the bracket and the Rad. Its a relativly small amount of extra work but you will know that your rad is really well fixed.
Steve.
Steve.
Stevekane
Established Member
Around two years ago our friends in Andover had a lovely new kitchen fitted, after a couple of days she had put a moderate amount of stuff in the cupboards and when she opened the door one morning the cupboard fell off the wall on top of her, she crashed onto the floor surrounded by broken crockery. The wall units had been fitted using plasterboard fixings by a professional kitchen fitter.
When you think about it you can make a hole in plasterboard with anything a bit pointy, and even a really course screw alone would hardly hold a picture and yet a crappy bit of folded plastic would hold a 4 or 5ft rad!! I wouldn't do it.
Steve.
johnny
Established Member
why would you advocate fixing a 100 lb weight full of pressurised hot water to plasterboard when there is a stronger , safer fixing to brickwork available. ?
Because, executed correctly, it is perfectly safe and reliable.
It's also an issue of horses for courses. The method is simple and
straightforward. It is correctly proportionate to the task in hand.
The advice being bandied about here, is turning what is a very
simple, and basic, exercise into one of disproportionate
complexity and is unneccesarily time consuming.
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As Woody Alan said, I would go for the core fix. You do not know how well the battens are fixed or the plasterboard to the battens. For the extra cost of core fix against the possibility of not getting all the other holes/screws in the right place.
johnny
Established Member
this is not only factually incorrect it is a potentially dangerous and an unsafe practice and would never be recommended by a trained and qualified kitchen fitter.
There is no way anyone can accurately predict the amount of weight that users could put into a wall cupboard which is why manufacturers do extensive research and calculations to develop a safe product with a built in safety margin. This includes calculations of the maximum possible loading both static and dynamic.
Plasterboard fixings are never a fixing method recommended by reputable kitchen wall unit manufacturers or retailers .
No trained and qualified Kitchen Fitter would ever hang a kitchen wall cupboard on a plasterboard fixing of any kind .For one thing their professional and public indemnity insurance Policy would not cover any subsequent failure claim submitted by the customer.
If kitchen wall units are to be fitted to a kitchen stud and plasterboard wall then the units would be fixed to the studwork so that the weight and loading can be safely transferred through the studwork down to the floor.
Either a section of plasterboard would be cut out by the fitter and a noggin inserted between the studs for the wall unit to be fixed to and the small section of plasterboard would be replaced and finishes made good. The same goes for hanging radiators. Or alternatively a steel or aluminium hanging rail would be fixed to the studwork to hang the cupboards on.
A standard wall unit cupboard and door weighs approx 20Kgs and a set of plates and bowls weigh say 8kgs thats a combined load on the plasterboard of 28Kgs and the majority of plasterboard in the UK is 9.5 mm thick unless it is a firebreak wall where it would be 12.5mm
.
The posters radiator weighs nearly twice that and full of pressurised hot water. If you had ever witnessed the aftermath of an entire central heating system emptying itself onto a ground floor you might appreciate why a plasterboard fixing is neither safe nor advisable
