Purchased Workshop

[SketchUp Guru]

Ah, thanks WiZeR. "Big Sheet ofPlastic" I understand.

 

[Sawdust]

Byron,

Here's my two peneth..

I'd be careful about putting your floor joists, tannalised or not, directly onto a concrete base because however you do it, water will gather and it will rot, it might take a few years but when it does, your shed is knackered and they are almost impossible to replace.

I set a row of bricks perpendicular to the run of the joists and rested the joists on them, this also allowed me to level the bricks so that I was building the floor on a level base. Doing this means that the contact area between the joist and the ground is very small and there is nowhere for rain to gather. I've just moved house and left the shed but it was 12 years old when I moved and there was no rot at all on the floor joists.

I used floor boards on top of the joists and was glad I did as it made a really nice floor to work on.

4 x 2 carcassing is great for the walls and makes a very solid frame.

I used 6 x 2 for the roof joists and Stirling (or maybe Sterling, who knows) board for the roof. The roof was solid enough to walk around on when felting etc and after 12 years, it had had a few felt repairs but the boards were like new and never needed any attention.

It was 5m long and 3m wide which at the time was the biggest building you could erect without planning permission.

Final bit of advice; work out how big you need it to be and then multiply by at least 2. When I built mine I thought it was massive but in truth it was tiny!

Hope this helps

Mike

 

[SketchUp Guru]

Mike makes a good point about not putting the joists right down on the concrete. I was going to figure out an elegant overly engineered way to deal with that but he beat me to it with an elegant yet simple approach.

I have another question for you. Would you want to use some of the space in the rafters for storage?

 

[StevieB]

If you are going to put joist ends directly onto a concrete or brick plinth/wall I would advise seperating the joist from the wall with a strip of normal black DPM as used when building a house wall. This will stop water/damp penetration up from the brick into the timber. If the joist is not supported along its length you only need one end to rot slightly before the floor tips :wink:

Steve.

 

[Sawdust]

If you are going to put joist ends directly onto a concrete or brick plinth/wall I would advise seperating the joist from the wall with a strip of normal black DPM as used when building a house wall. This will stop water/damp penetration up from the brick into the timber. If the joist is not supported along its length you only need one end to rot slightly before the floor tips :wink:

Steve.

Thanks Steve,

I realised I missed that from my description. I did that when I built mine and as you say, it will stop damp rising through the brick and into the wood.

Cheers
Mike

 

[devonwoody]

It doesn't seem as if you will need to send for Noah with all the advice you have up there Byron.

 

[wizer]

when it comes to DPM or DPC's, is it best to have one sheet that covers the base and the walls + floor sit on top or just a DPC that only goes under the walls?

 

[Johnboy]

Wot Mike said about the floor. I used 8 x 2 for the floor joists, never know how much cast iron you may end up with!! 16" centres is standard and the insulation will fit straight in then. I used 18mm flooring chipboard(moisture resistant grade) for the floor, it is tongue and grooved so you dont have to have a joist under the joints. I used pressure treated timber for the floor joists.

I clad the exterior with 12mm WBP ply under pressure treated feather edge but stirling board(OSB) would be ok as well.

To attach the rafters to the wall plates I just used 70mm screws driven at an angle though the side of the rafters. Probably not the best method but it is still standing after 5 years.

Walls from 4x2 and rafters from 6x2. 18mm shuttering ply roof covered in felt.

I lined the interior with 6mm MDF but would use 12mm ply if doing it again as then most thing could be screwed to the walls anywhere, you would only need to find a wall stud for very heavy things.

Insulated everything with 100mm fibreglass. One small oil filled radiator keeps it nice and warm all winter.

John

ps. The sharpening kit is in frequent use.

 

[engineer one]

while i think about it, insulating and lining the interior is a good excuse for
buying a nail gun, either air or battery to enable you to stick the
insulation up in all the right places :tool:

paul :wink:

 

[Sawdust]

Further to John's comments,

My rows of bricks were 2 feet apart so the 4 x 2 floor joists only ever spanned this much and were as solid as a rock. Obviously a wider span needs bigger joists.

Totally agree about the 16inch centres.

I lined my walls inside with chipboard flooring, the T&G stuff from B&Q for doing lofts was good value and I found it fairly light in colour without painting. It was also great for putting shelves etc anywhere without having to work out where the joists were.

John was 'posher' than me and screwed his roof beams down, I just nailed them but it's still on after 12 years so I guess it was OK!

Cheers
Mike

 

[ByronBlack]

OK Byron, I understand most of the dimensions you gave and I have something to work with. I need a bit of clarification on a couple of points.

6x2 and 4x2 lumber: What are the actual dimensions? Here in the US a 2x4 is smaller than 2"x4" and they seem to get smaller every year.

I think 6x2 is 50mm x 150mm and 4x2 is 50mm x 50mm *give or take a few mm

DPM? What's that?

Damp Proof Membrane - plastic sheeting

6mx3m: Is that the size of the concrete slab? Or is that the exterior dimension of the shed? What's the 1m part that won't be used for the shed?

6x3m will be the wooden base (6x2 on 12" centres) I will be only using 4.87m x 3.0m of that for the workshop, and these are the external dimensions. The extra 1m of the wooden base will be used for a small decking area infront of the shed.

re: Marine ply on the exterior side of the walls. You shouldn't need to do that if you are using T&G wood siding. I put OSB sheathing on my shed because I used vinyl siding. The siding is too flimsy not to be backed up. I think you should just build a boat with that marine ply. (This comes from a guy who wants but can't get marine ply locally.)

On thoughts your right, i'm scrapping the use of any sheathing on the outside, and the walls will just be the 4x2 frame with the T&G cladding on the outside

Is this shed going to be built immmediately next to another structure or will you have some space around it?

The shed will be approximately 1m away from a fence, and about 2.5 meters away from the other side.

What sort of roof strikes your fancy? Single slope? Peak in the middle? Peak off center? One side higher than the other with a short wall of windows or vents? A gambrel roof?

After thinking about this, I think a regular gable ended peak in the middle roof would be best, i'll be having some windows at the back near the roof, but these will be incorporated in the wall panels.

Doors: Are you going to buy commercial doors or build them? I built mine but wish I'd thought about buying a door.

I'll be making them, along with the windows - this is where my dad will come in handy

Windows? Any or none?

There will be four 2ft x 3ft (3ft high) windows on the right hand side of the workshop (as looking at it from the house towards the doors). These will start from 4ft up from the wall panel and extend upwards for 3ft leaving a 1ft gap before the roof. I also intend to have a couple of smallish windows on the back high up (as this backs onto fields) to allow some more light in.

I think thats all the details I can think off, anything else you require, don't hesite to let me know

 

[ByronBlack]

Byron,

I'd be careful about putting your floor joists, tannalised or not, directly onto a concrete base because however you do it, water will gather and it will rot, it might take a few years but when it does, your shed is knackered and they are almost impossible to replace.

Final bit of advice; work out how big you need it to be and then multiply by at least 2. When I built mine I thought it was massive but in truth it was tiny!

Hope this helps

Mike

Hi Mike

thanks for the feedback, i'll definitly take your advice regarding the floor, in truth I wasn't entire sure about putting the joists directly on the slab, with regards the size, unfortunatly 5mx3m is the max I can go due to limited width of my garden (mid-terrace) also there is an original concrete slab from a garage of the same size, so some of my work is already done

 

[ByronBlack]

I have another question for you. Would you want to use some of the space in the rafters for storage?

I've been thinking about this, and I think it would be great to be able to utilise this space for storage, but it's an area which I have little knowledge/experience of so have not gone into detail - i'm open to any idea's you may have!

 

[engineer one]

byron, you have to work with what you have, but i definately agree
about not putting the joists directly on the slab. as i have said
before, we used sleepers. in my area of london they are below 20 quid each, but as we all know they are built to last.

the only thing i would consider now is to put some kind of trellis
under the shed to stop foxes getting in there, bloody urban foxes. :twisted:

paul :wink:

 

[SketchUp Guru]

I think I've got enough to go on now, Byron. I'll get something worked up ASAP.

 

[SketchUp Guru]

Very quick sketch. Does this look something like you had in mind? I figured we'd work out the looks before I do the framing details.

 

[ByronBlack]

Paul - I back on to open fields and farming crops, so foxes, hedgehogs, mice, cats, rogue sheep and the odd owl all come by at some stage, so good point about the trellis!

Dave R - Thanks alot for taking the time, I really appreciate it. that looks pretty much spot on with what I was thinking!!! I can't believe you did it so quickly! It took me about 2 hours today to make a simple 8'x4' frame :lol:

You have the windows and front doors spot on - and the likeness of the chap is uncanny

 

[engineer one]

the question is byron are you looking so nonchalant at the
thought of all the work and money? :lol:

paul :wink:

 

[SketchUp Guru]

Good, I'm glad I found a chap who looks like you. That'll help. How's the roof look to you? I drew it with a 30° angle. That's what I used on my shed and I'm sure I get a bigger snow load than you do where you are.

By the way, where is Thurrock? I found West Thurrock and Little Thurrock. And what is that down near the river next to St. Andrews Road?

I was hoping to have a high res Google Earth image so I could see placement for a better idea of what I'm up to. Unfortunately it looks like they got close but not close enough with the newer images.

 

[devonwoody]

Byron, I would make accommodation for chain link fencing/chicken wire, when putting in trellis work. If small stuff gets under/in big stuff will want to follow!