Planing the Outside of a Case

[D_W]

Dave, if you think MikeG has "little actual project work" on this forum, I suggest that you spend the next few hours reading through some of the most thoroughly documented and explained work to be found on it. This search should help you:

search.php?keywords=&terms=all&author=MikeG.&fid%5B%5D=15&sc=1&sf=firstpost&sr=posts&sk=t&sd=d&st=0&ch=300&t=0&submit=Search

That looks like mostly power tool work and architectural.

 

[D_W]

In case anyone was wondering, the original text suggested that it's not helpful for someone to show the edge of a board, state what might be in their mind, and that you have a history of doing this in threads - leaving a stink with "I wouldn't do that", but "I haven't done that" kind of stuff. It's your signature here. It stinks.

Now I'm confused. I've read your post three times and can't make sense of it.

In general I think it's better to check what you write and make sure its clear, rather than getting cross at other people not guessing what you meant to say.

The point of the original thread is that when you're working by hand, and mostly sans sandpaper, you'll end up doing things like planing the side of a case. I posted this elsewhere on a forum where someone suggested that finish planing is a pipe dream because you can't do things like plane assembled work.

That's pretty much it. You have to be able to use a plane correctly to do it (so that you can finish plane in one direction, even on glued up boards), and it shouldn't take more than butting whatever you're planing up against something (so that the idea of complicated work holding or affixing clamps, etc, where they don't need to be fixed is thrown out).

Imagine how this thread could've gone differently if someone would've just said "I'm not sure of your objective here" rather than "there shouldn't be any humps, you should just clamp it, how hard is that?". But without any examples, of course.

It reminds me of another forum where there is someone who makes a living with hand tools. Once in a great while, he will address someone and say "please don't confuse how you think it should be done with how you've done it".

 

[MikeG.]

.......That looks like mostly power tool work and architectural.

Nope. The bog oak coffee table, for instance, was mainly hand tools. The tool cupboard was entirely with hand tools. So were the horses....and they're all just in the last few months. You can carry on making a fool of yourself trying to slag off one the most traditional cabinet makers here if you want, but most of the posters here know rather better than you about my projects and capabilities.

This is all by the by. You still haven't made clear what you are trying to say in this thread. Is it about the planing (bog standard stuff)? Or is it about the workholding (trivial stuff)? Or is it just ego-preening ("if you know anything about planing.....")?

Edit.......our posts cross. You've now explained that it was about planing and workholding. Great. Well done. You can plane the side of a box. How wonderful.

 

[D_W]

There are cabinetmakers here, too, Mike. They don't do anything other than joints with hand tools, they wouldn't plane carcass and they finish everything with sandpaper.

If you don't like to work that way, that's fine, but you lack depth talking about it.

I lack depth talking about working with power tools and the process that it entails (cut lists, sketch up, joint templates, etc). The difference is that it's very easy for me to admit that I do.

 

[MikeG.]

There are cabinetmakers here, too, Mike. They don't do anything other than joints with hand tools, they wouldn't plane carcass and they finish everything with sandpaper.

If you don't like to work that way, that's fine, but you lack depth talking about it. .........

What are you prattling on about? I don't finish with sandpaper. You don't finish with sandpaper. What on earth is your point?

You want an example?

Fundamentally, if you've got an argument with someone on another forum don't you think it might have been best to have shown him your ground breaking planing of the outside of a case, rather than look for an argument here?

 

[Trevanion]

I certainly couldn't spend five hours morticing spindles into a handrail by hand, Mike did though.

To say he's a predominant power-tool user would be a grand mistake lead by ignorance.

 

[D_W]

predominantly a power tool user is something like, all power tool use and cutting dovetails and mortice and tenon by hand.

I know some who use hand tools incidentally will see this as "what?", but cutting joints for 5 hours is not a particularly long time. It may not be that much fun, but it's half a workday.

I work with a friend (less now, he thinks working with hand tools for coarse work is off the deep end) who does joints by hand and probably spends 75% of his time with power tools (Which does the bulk of the work by a long shot). He would call cutting joints for 5 hours a hand tool marathon and then spend an inordinate amount of time sanding something and call that part of the process (I would consider that a marathon).

I guess the bar for hand tooling now is just cutting joints. As often as we see dovetails as a showoff joint (it's entry level quickly executed stuff that should be hidden by long grain), it's not surprising.

There is a hand tool instructor here in town who has stopped by a couple of times. He calls his shop hand tool classes because they cut dovetails and mortise and tenon and they teach students to refurbish a stanley 5. He and mike are in the same group. I planed something in front of him (heavy planing) that he considered only sandable and his retort was that what I just demonstrated wasn't practical because it couldn't be taught (I still have no idea what that meant).

He bought my old workbench.

 

[FatmanG]

I have read this thread 3 times and don't have the foggiest idea what going on. Nowt new there I suppose I'm off to carry on reading mikes stair build wip that will inspire me while I wait for Mrs fatty to wake up.

 

[D_W]

>>Mrs fatty <<

well, it was derailed from the start (the point being about planing cases level and smooth all in one direction without too much faffing. The thread has become a faff. but.....!

I now have something to call the mrs. the next time she tells me that I've gotten tubby!!

 

[D_W]

There are cabinetmakers here, too, Mike. They don't do anything other than joints with hand tools, they wouldn't plane carcass and they finish everything with sandpaper.

If you don't like to work that way, that's fine, but you lack depth talking about it. .........

What are you prattling on about? I don't finish with sandpaper. You don't finish with sandpaper. What on earth is your point?

You want an example?

Fundamentally, if you've got an argument with someone on another forum don't you think it might have been best to have shown him your ground breaking planing of the outside of a case, rather than look for an argument here?

Horrid. I would hold my tongue for anyone else, but you've often said to others on here (not me) "i don't see the point" when they show something.

Unless you only had green something left, I don't see the point.

 

[MikeG.]

I'm not interested in whether you like it or not. I'm simply proving the point that I finish with a blade, not sandpaper.

 

[AndyT]

I can't remember anyone on this forum making a nonsensical statement that it's "impossible to plane assembled work."

But if they did, and I thought it worth correcting them, I certainly wouldn't try to do so on a different forum, then insult people if they didn't share my dogmatic beliefs that hand tools are somehow morally superior to power tools.

 

[MikeG.]

..........There is a hand tool instructor here in town who has stopped by a couple of times. He calls his shop hand tool classes because they cut dovetails and mortise and tenon and they teach students to refurbish a stanley 5. He and mike are in the same group.......

Honestly, it's time you stopped DW. You haven't got a clue how I work, as you keep demonstrating. Your hackles rise as soon as someone doesn't prostrate themselves at your feet in awe and adoration of the pearls of wisdom that fall from your lips, and it's this self-important attitude which is why you meet such resistance here. As soon as someone says "yes, and?......" when you post something as every day and trivial as planing the outside of a box you turn it into a personal crusade against the person and their work. This reflects only on you, and not at all on your target.

 

[FatmanG]

>>Mrs fatty <<

well, it was derailed from the start (the point being about planing cases level and smooth all in one direction without too much faffing. The thread has become a faff. but.....!

I now have something to call the mrs. the next time she tells me that I've gotten tubby!!

The one thing I did understand from your posts was your doing this because of your mrs and doing it her way i reckon you call her Boss :wink:

 

[D_W]

you're off the mark, Mike. I can't remember what thread got you to start trolling all of mine with the "I can think of a better way but I haven't done it", but that's pretty much the issue that I have with your responses.

IF someone else doesn't want to work the way I do, it doesn't bother me. I don't come to your threads and harass them. you come to mine and preen your crest and accuse me of ego. It's ridiculous.

You don't know enough about finish planing to understand the difference between the way it would've been done on fine work (through strokes from end to end) and planing in from the ends and creating needless follow up work.

I'm still not inclined to follow your shed building or epoxy filling threads - you win.

 

[D_W]

>>Mrs fatty <<

well, it was derailed from the start (the point being about planing cases level and smooth all in one direction without too much faffing. The thread has become a faff. but.....!

I now have something to call the mrs. the next time she tells me that I've gotten tubby!!

The one thing I did understand from your posts was your doing this because of your mrs and doing it her way i reckon you call her Boss :wink:

Pretty much nailed it. It would be slightly different, but I guess to this point, the case would be the same. If it were left to me, it would end up with the same mouldings, but with a face frame and raised panel doors, and no stain. Finish would be shellac on bare wood, french polished.

I guess I'd have to use better wood for parts as some would end up being sap, and i'm not a fan.

But the name "mrs. fatty" is grand, and the next time the mrs. accosts me over my inability to run a marathon, I've got it!! "If I'm mr. fatty, then that makes you....."

 

[MikeG.]

.......You don't know enough about finish planing to understand the difference between the way it would've been done on fine work (through strokes from end to end) and planing in from the ends and creating needless follow up work........

And clearly you haven't the first idea what a cabinet scraper is for. You do it your way, and we'll do it our way. Scraping is the way it's done in high class work, and has been through the ages. Just stop coming here and telling us we don't know what we're doing.

....... I can't remember what thread got you to start trolling all of mine with the "I can think of a better way but I haven't done it"......

I've never said anything like that. You're familiar with the term "straw man", no doubt.

 

[D_W]

Once again, you get to telling people what to do and where they should go and call other people egotistical.

I scrape when it's necessary. It's not necessary on flat work.

 

[MikeG.]

.......I scrape when it's necessary. It's not necessary on flat work.

It's not necessary, no. It's superior and preferable, but no, I'll concede, not necessary.

 

[D_W]

Asurd - a duller surface and torn edges, more time spent doing it and less flat.