Piano Desk

[DAC]

Hi,

I would hugely appreciate some help, if anyone would be kind enough to offer their advice.

Project Details

I'd like to have a sit/stand desk built for my home office, I'd also like to have a keyboard (piano) drawer underneath much like the example below, so that my keyboard can be stowed away.

• I already have an electric desk frame (see pictures below which also show where the desk is to be situated).
• The lifting columns of the desk are made by Linak and are rated at 800N (80kg) each (160N in total).
• The desk would be ~2m wide and ~0.75m deep, and I'd imagined a 40mm thick oak top
• The piano is reasonably heavy (16kgs), so would need to ensure it is adequately supported
• The horizontal support on the desk frame unfortunately gets in the way of a piano drawer, so either the draw would need to go beneath it, or the support needs to be cut out, or unscrewed from the lifting columns. If the support is removed, I would need to ensure there is no adverse racking or potential for the top to bow (both issues raised by the frame manufacturer when I spoke with them).

Questions

I don't intend to build this (as I'm very aware that I have neither the experience nor tools - despite the temptation). The part I'm stuck on is how to engage a skilled joiner to assist me. In particular, how to ensure that what I'm asking for is sensible.

1) I already have a couple of concerns, and any thoughts on these would be helpful:
a) Is it likely that a 40mm oak desktop would bow over time or rack if we dispensed with the horizontal frame support (so that the keyboard can be closer to the desktop).
b) Is it possible to have a keyboard drawer hanging off the desktop which can support the 16kg piano and the weight of someone playing it. I had imagined that the vertical members (marked A in the picture above) would be secured to the top using wood buttons (or something similar) to allow for gross grain movement of the desktop, but that feels like a lot of weight to be held by buttons.
c) Is that radiator going to cause movement issues with the wood.
d) Are there any other issues that I haven't considered?

2) It's pretty clear to me that I need to find someone to help me build this. If there is someone on the forum that would be interested, or could recommend someone, please do DM me. I'm based in Surrey but will happily travel a decent distance.

Many thanks

These are the lifting columns that attach to the horizontal member

 

[Ttrees]

Looks quite the undertaking, I presume someone has done something remotely similar.
I'd be guessing a mock up would be in order, or perhaps CAD skills.
Are you anticipating chopping it up, welding, or just using the lifts seems like it might
might simplify things.
Not sure how you're going to go about the keyboard engaging with the lift, and only when
it's being slid out.

I'd reckon it might not be a bad idea to have a go with a sheet of ply and some CLS
with consideration regarding components, in which you could then get more plentiful suggestions.

I do know there's another piano player on the wood haven 2, so perhaps that might be worth posting there too.

Sorry I cannot be of more help to ya.
ps welcome to the forum
Tom

 

[DAC]

Hi Tom,

Thanks for the response, and the welcome.

Not sure how you're going to go about the keyboard engaging with the lift, and only when
it's being slid out.

I had envisaged both the desktop and keyboard moving (up/down) together at all times. So in concept the legs lift the desktop, and the keyboard drawer, by virtue of being attached to the desktop moves with it.

Are you anticipating chopping it up, welding, or just using the lifts seems like it might
might simplify things.

Definitely possible that we just use the lifting columns and dispense with the horizontal frame. I guess it's a balance between function/cost, which is why I had also considered just putting an oak desktop on the frame, and having a floating keyboard drawer underneath the horizontal bar (but that comes back to one of the concerns I had about whether you could really have a floating drawer bearing the keyboard/playing weight).

Sorry I cannot be of more help to ya.

I certainly appreciate the thoughts.

 

[Yojevol]

Let's deal with the oak first. It's going to weigh about 45kg. Yes you must assume its going to move. To minimise risk of movement you'll need a good slab of straight grained, quarter sawn oak which will look fantastic but will cost several hundred pounds. The radiator certainly won't help.
I would regard this as more of a metal rather than a woodworking project. I would keep the frame as it is but add 2 extra supports for the piano. To keep maximum leg room the piano could sit on a sheet metal tray which would attach to the supports via long reach drawer runners.
My desktop would be oak veneered MDF, probably 18mm, with a solid oak front lipping to hide the steelwork. With sufficient support, possible longitudinal steel attached to the frame, the MDF will stay flat even with the radiator doing it's job.
Brian
PS where in Surrey? It was my home and cycling country as a youngster

 

[DAC]

Hi Brian,

Thanks for all your thoughts...

Let's deal with the oak first. It's going to weigh about 45kg. Yes you must assume its going to move. To minimise risk of movement you'll need a good slab of straight grained, quarter sawn oak which will look fantastic but will cost several hundred pounds.

That's what I had in mind. I think it'll look great too.

I would regard this as more of a metal rather than a woodworking project. I would keep the frame as it is but add 2 extra supports for the piano. To keep maximum leg room the piano could sit on a sheet metal tray which would attach to the supports via long reach drawer runners.

I like the logic of considering it as a metal project. I think what you are describing is quite similar to what was done in this example (Building a Heavy-Duty Piano Drawer - Nomadic Research Labs), but with the differences I've tried to highlight in red. The part I'm having difficulty in visualising is how (A) would be attached to the frame given that the frame is fairly central, ideally the drawer would be fairly recessed..

PS where in Surrey? It was my home and cycling country as a youngster

Esher. we get lots of cyclists around us heading out to box hill. Some great cycle routes.

 

[Jameshow]

I think it's do able.

I'd use oak worktop to keep the price down.

The drawer needn't be as thick. Some 18mm oak board should suffice.

Good drawer guides will easily carry the keyboard weight.

I'd Sound out local joinery firms. If they are too expensive then a local men's shed might have a retired cabinet maker interested in it.

 

[Jacob]

Overthinking?
Why try to incorporate the desk and the piano? If they are inseparable the function of one could obstruct the use of the other.
Simpler and more practical to build a desk to suit and to build a keyboard stand which you could simply push neatly underneath it, to be pulled out far enough to play, (on castors?) or further away quite independently.
So isn't it a better keyboard stand that you need? With legs at 4 corners so you can get your knees under it when working at the desk?

 

[DAC]

I'd Sound out local joinery firms. If they are too expensive then a local men's shed might have a retired cabinet maker interested in it

Thanks James - that's a good idea.

Overthinking?
Why try to incorporate the desk and the piano? If they are inseparable the function of one could obstruct the use of the other.
Simpler and more practical to build a desk to suit and to build a keyboard stand which you could simply push neatly underneath it, to be pulled out far enough to play, (on castors?) or further away quite independently.
So isn't it a better keyboard stand that you need? With legs at 4 corners so you can get your knees under it when working at the desk?

Thanks Jacob - I had considered a new keyboard stand on castors, but when you're using the keyboard many times throughout the day, pulling it forwards on castors is a bit cumbersome.

 

[Jacob]

Thanks James - that's a good idea.

Thanks Jacob - I had considered a new keyboard stand on castors, but when you're using the keyboard many times throughout the day, pulling it forwards on castors is a bit cumbersome.

Pile carpet!
What about ptfe runners instead? It comes in all shapes and sizes and just needs attaching to the bottom of a pair of ski like runners.

 

[DAC]

What about ptfe runners instead? It comes in all shapes and sizes and just needs attaching to the bottom of a pair of ski like runners.

That would certainly help.

When I'm using the keyboard, I envisage moving the desk slightly higher and then having the keyboard at the height the desk was at (otherwise it would be too low to play properly). So the option I looked at was a keyboard stand on castors that had a manual height adjustor (hand crank). It's still not ideal though.

 

[MikeH]

I built an oak keyboard cabinet a few years back so have some experience. The gotchas I can see are both the already mentioned height issue as you need the keyboard at the right height and anything that pulls out from under a desk is likely to be far too low. Secondly, and possibly more of an issue is stability, a keyboard stand does need to be stable and to not move much at all, ideally not at all. You often bash those keys quite hard and you dont want the keyboard moving around. Having built a few pull out shelves under desks over the years they are generally fairly lightweight and hence have movement. One thing I would suggest to also consider is any needed peripheral (USB etc.) ports, you may find it hard to get to the back of the keyboard to plug things in if it is on a pull out shelf. I designed mine with extension ports at the front of the cabinet that I could easily get too.

 

[MikeH]

I built an oak keyboard cabinet a few years back so have some experience. The gotchas I can see are both the already mentioned height issue as you need the keyboard at the right height and anything that pulls out from under a desk is likely to be far too low. Secondly, and possibly more of an issue is stability, a keyboard stand does need to be stable and to not move much at all, ideally not at all. You often bash those keys quite hard and you dont want the keyboard moving around. Having built a few pull out shelves under desks over the years they are generally fairly lightweight and hence have movement. One thing I would suggest to also consider is any needed peripheral (USB etc.) ports, you may find it hard to get to the back of the keyboard to plug things in if it is on a pull out shelf. I designed mine with extension ports at the front of the cabinet that I could easily get too.