Old Record planes - Restoration thoughts?

[Escudo]

Hello all,

Here's a couple of pics of two old record planes a no 5 1/2 and a no 4 which were kindly given to me. They are in a poor state, although with a lot of effort I suppose they could be restored, but to what end?

I just wonder if it would be a worth while project. I already have a LV BU jack plane and a LN 4 1/2 smoother. It seems hard to believe that I would turn to one of these planes over my existing planes which work perfectly.

I have thought about turning the jack plane into a sort of scraper plane. I have seen a post on this whereby the blade was sharpened with a 45 degree bevel and used bevel up to give an effective cutting angle of 90 degrees. Does this really work as well as a dedicated scraper plane?

What's the verdict are these old planes worth restoring, or are they beyond salvation?

Hope someone has got an idea.

Cheers, Tony

 

[J D Architectural Joinery]

I have seen joiners use worse.
I have some in my cupboard that are alot worse than that, waiting to be looked at. I think it will all depend on how you see the end result, and what the condition of the sole is in. But for me as much as it is nice seeing a mint condition 1940s plane, they were made to be used. And if the end result is they function properly and will be used. I would go for it

 

[woodbloke]

Tony - the planes look to be in reasonable condition. I wouldn't go the whole hog like I did to my T5 and No4 last year but stripping them down, fresh lick of paint, strip off the old icky varnish on the handles and a general bit of fettling (sole flattening and making sure that all bits fit snuggly together) would improve them no end. A thicker blade would also help but if you decide to keep the original ones then some attention to the chipbreaker is also warranted.
I tried the trick of putting on a back bevel on a No4 plane blade to make a sort of scraper out of it but I only had very limited success. My own view is if that you want to use a scraper, then buy a dedicated plane. I've just got hold of the Veritas No80 from CHT after having used Paul Chapman's a while back and it's superb - Rob

 

[dennis]

I agree with David they dont look that bad to me I have seen much worse used on sites admttedly not with as much finnesse as in a shop go for it.
dennis

 

[Smudger]

I wouldn't bother. Send 'em to me and I'll get rid of them for you!

Rob - what do you use to strip the varnish off the tote and knob - is Nitromors too aggressive?

 

[woodbloke]

I wouldn't bother. Send 'em to me and I'll get rid of them for you!

Rob - what do you use to strip the varnish off the tote and knob - is Nitromors too aggressive?

Dick - Nitromoors is fine. The varnish is pretty thick and takes a fair bit of gloop to soften it but it comes away quite well. Pete Newton did a couple of superb handles on his old Stanley No4 by stripping off the varnish, a coat of stain and then finishing with some Osmo PolyX and wax over the top - Rob

 

[Paul Chapman]

Tony, a scrub-type plane can sometimes be useful. I use a couple of old Records (#5.5 and #7) like this. Just grind and hone a steep camber on the blade, set the cap iron and frog back and off you go

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[David C]

On my tool tuning, sharpening and plane use courses, we regularly transform this kind of plane into a perfect super smoother. See the video clips on my website.

One old bench plane with new replacement blade and one block plane take, about 2 1/2 days of the course, with attendant theory.

This does not include cosmetic work on the paint/japanning and the handles, but does include all functional work, as Rob describes above.

Since you already have some top class planes, this may not be an attractive proposition.

I am not particularly fond of 90 degree scraping, but a back bevel at 70 degree Effective Pitch will plane the most refractory timbers, if the shaving is fine enough.

David http://www.davidcharlesworth.co.uk

 

[mahking51]

Hi All,
Re stripping the old varnish from totes, I have found it a LOT less messy to just take a fairly blunt utility knife and gently scrape the old stuff off. It come off really easily in lumps. I then chuck the front totes in a drill and sand, the rears I do by hand. They come up really nicely and no messy Nitromors!
Cheers,
Martin

 

[Paul Chapman]

I agree with Martin. I've used an old card scraper before. Quite often the old varnish is crazed and therefore not adhering very well and it scrapes off quite easily. Using stripper can be very messy.

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[Escudo]

Thanks for all your comments fellas, food for thought thats for sure.

I am tempted to have a go at refurbishing these old planes when time allows. It just somehow seems wrong to leave the poor things in such a sorry state. (sorry smudge your chance to make a fiver at the local car boot is lost )

Rob, I remember that excellent job you did on refurbishing your plane and I will look up that thread for guidance on the approach.

The varnish is shot through and accordingly should be easy to remove.

I will also gen. up a bit by re reading your very formative book David. I know there is a chapter on plane fettling.

I am also going to have a closer look at the scraper planes, perhaps at the forthcoming Yandles show. I have made arrangements to make an appearance and hope to see one or two of you there.

Cheers all, Tony

 

[Smudger]

Curses!

I'll stretch to a tenner if you find one of these:

 

[Racers]

Hi,

The 5 1/2 is an old one you can tell from the square shouldered blade and cap iron the tote and knob might be rosewood, so a quick scrape and wax is all you need. I have one the same and its the first one I reach for, its well worth the effort of sorting out, Mine came with a cracked side, I had it welded and spent some time flattening and tuning it but it works very well. You might find the blade is laminated mine was and a cracking bit of steel it is to. Don't turn it in to a scrape plane sort it and use it.


Pete

 

[ac445ab]

Hi,
If the planes are solid in the base can be successfully restored.
This is a Stanley 605 Bedrock I restored recently:

Ciao,

Giuliano

 

[Smudger]

Bellissimo!

 

[ac445ab]

Bellissimo!

 

[Escudo]

Hello Giuliano,

Wow, what a top job restoring that 605. It looks great, well done.

How did you go about removing the rust and polishing up the sole and sides, also ensuring that these remained flat and square?

I thought about using my polishing machine, is that a good idea?

Smudge what do you think, how would you go about this job?

Thanks for helpful advice. Cheers, Tony.

 

[Smudger]

Citric acid to remove rust (though I'd probably replace the cutter and chip breaker) and then polishing with fibre and wire wheels - I use a Dremel, but I would use a bigger 3M wheel on my bench grinder if I could find one. Strip the paint and then refinish (I've used Hammerite and it works) including sanding and oiling the wood. I would use a polishing wheel on the bright steel.

But I'm a rank amateur compared to some on here - they're the ones you want to listen to!

 

[woodbloke]

Cracking job on that bedrock...very nice =D>

As Dick has said, Hammerite (or Smoothrite which is better) does work very well. On the two I did, I stripped off all the old lacquer with some Nitromoors, 'nuked' them under the high pressure washer and then stored them in the airing cupbaord to keep the surfaces rusticles at bay. Just before painting (two coats) I degreased then with some acetone - Rob

 

[Paul Chapman]

Excellent, Giuliano =D>

Cheers :wink:

Paul