Oak Writing Desk

[Dizzwold]

Hi Guys,

I've purchased this old oak writing desk. To begin with I started to sand it, but as the sand paper was just getting clogged up with crud, I washed it down with white spirit then started on the sanding again. So far I've sanded back the top (full of stains and burns), to find that It's been coated in some kind of coloured varnish.

What I'd really like to do is to get a finish similar to something I found on ebay (seller, selling leather writing inlay pads), but I want to ask your opinions first;

Due to the amount and depth of the scratches and burns, I've had to sand it right back and lost most of the patina.

I'd be grateful for your thoughts.

I may go with a leather writing pad but not inset it, just have it loose on top. I'll try to get a photo tomorrow (weather permitting), of the top sanded back.

D.

 

[J-G]

Hmm. . . I have little knowledge of the wood-stains that you cite in your PM nor finishing that area of Oak. The only job in this class that I've done was a re-furb of an G-Plan table where the centre fold-out section had been protected simply by dint of non use and had retained its original colour but the main table had suffered sunlight degradation - as well as some minor damage such as cup ring stains and 'dings'. I stripped the original finish and used Polyvine Wax Finish Varnish [Polyvine varnish] to great effect - well the customer was well pleased

Though you say that you might just use a leather writing pad loose on top of the desk, I suggest that you might be more satisfied (in the long run) by re-working the top - - - not by routing out a shallow depression to take the leather but a more serious approach - - You have some nicely figured Oak there and you could easily take the top off completely and make a 'frame' (say) 100mm ish wide (this would be determined by the size of the leather pad that you can get) just like the eBay desk that you show, and use a sheet of plywood in the centre set low enough to take the leather pad.

You haven't mentioned how thick the top is but it should be easy enough to get some sutable ply and set it in from the bottom even if you have to route the 'frame'.

I still have some of the Polyvine left (Teak Satin) so if you'd like to do a test on a piece of Oak you are welcome to come over (you're only 20 minutes away I think).

 

[Fitzroy]

Personally I think saving any of the aged/patina look means you will also retain the stains, cup marks etc. Personally I would be thinking of a complete refresh, top off and cut the boards to fix the splits in the top, scrape and sand back to remove all old finish and marks etc, change the handle and then refinish. Or if not then just do the minimum and clean up with wire wool and white spirit, then add a new wax polish over the top.

 

[Dizzwold]

Hi guys,

Thank you for your comments.

I've already removed, cleaned with white spirit and sanded back the top with 40 grit (in the process of 80 grit);

I agree, the top does need re-joint.

I don't plan on dismantling all the drawers or drawer carcasses, unless I find any broken dovetails etc. (edit) Low and behold the next photos;

Would it be wise to use any form of paint stripper on the carcasses due to the tight 'shaker' style recesses?

 

[Fitzroy]

Hi guys,

Thank you for your comments.

I've already removed, cleaned with white spirit and sanded back the top with 40 grit (in the process of 80 grit);

View attachment 187921


I agree, the top does need re-joint.

I don't plan on dismantling all the drawers or drawer carcasses, unless I find any broken dovetails etc. (edit) Low and behold the next photos;

View attachment 187922

Would it be wise to use any form of paint stripper on the carcasses due to the tight 'shaker' style recesses?

View attachment 187923

I'd have a go with a card scraper before chemicals, should get into those square edges no problem.

 

[alex robinson]

I have used the water based stripper form Screwfix before and it was astonishingly effective. A carbide scraper with a replaceable blade was also very useful.

If you want to get out stains / fading you could try using oxalic acid.

What are you thinking of finishing it with? I find linseed oil looks very good on this sort of furniture.

 

[Dizzwold]

Hi Guys,

Thank you all for you advice and thoughts. I'm most grateful.

The Desk Top is now in it's individual 3 planks/boards ready to be re-jointed.

My only problem with this now is I don't have a router table or table saw. I have a router (Trend T9E), and many bits that I inherited. I believe I have a couple of small bits called Flush Cut with the bearing at the bottom;

I invested in a Bacho 665 Carbide Scrapper ((2 &1/2"), along with a Bacho Card Scrapper. These worked great on the carcass, but without thinking I went straight ahead an used them on the inlay 'shaker style' panels only to have chunks of it pull off. Where I thought these were oak, they're oak veneer ply. I tried gently sanding them and the same happened. I think there may have been some water damage at some point and the veneer has de-bonded, thus as soon as you mechanically touch them it just tears apart;

Got to laugh. I've pulled all my stomach muscles scrapping this one carcass.

Although I've created extra work, it was probably a good thing that I've found this problem now.

I've got to say it is looking completely different and looking much better.

Do you guys have any recommendations for where to buy oak veneer to refit to the panels. They are roughly 9 &1/2 x 19" (slightly oversized measurement).

 

[duke]

Hi Guys,

Thank you all for you advice and thoughts. I'm most grateful.

The Desk Top is now in it's individual 3 planks/boards ready to be re-jointed.
View attachment 188140
My only problem with this now is I don't have a router table or table saw. I have a router (Trend T9E), and many bits that I inherited. I believe I have a couple of small bits called Flush Cut with the bearing at the bottom;
View attachment 188136
View attachment 188137

I invested in a Bacho 665 Carbide Scrapper ((2 &1/2"), along with a Bacho Card Scrapper. These worked great on the carcass, but without thinking I went straight ahead an used them on the inlay 'shaker style' panels only to have chunks of it pull off. Where I thought these were oak, they're oak veneer ply. I tried gently sanding them and the same happened. I think there may have been some water damage at some point and the veneer has de-bonded, thus as soon as you mechanically touch them it just tears apart;
View attachment 188141
View attachment 188138
View attachment 188142

Got to laugh. I've pulled all my stomach muscles scrapping this one carcass.

Although I've created extra work, it was probably a good thing that I've found this problem now.

I've got to say it is looking completely different and looking much better.

Do you guys have any recommendations for where to buy oak veneer to refit to the panels. They are roughly 9 &1/2 x 19" (slightly oversized measurement).

Firstly try to remove the dowels and if possible reuse them, if not cut them off. Mark the orientation of boards on the bottom side.
Take the left and centre board and lay them bottoms together, clamp them up then clamp a fence(straight edge) on top for your router plate to follow along. Then remove a little material on the mating edges using a straight bit. Remove clamps and the two edges should line up flush. Rinse and repeat for centre board right edge and right board left edge.
Then glue them together. Or eliminate the router and use a hand plane!

 

[Dizzwold]

Cheer's Duke,

I've actually been in a little head scratching over this. I really didn't fancy doing it manually with this router as it is quite heavy, but with your comment's it makes perfect sense to do so. Thank you.

 

[XTiffy]

With leather desk tops (Skiver) it often was done by making a shallow sloping groove around circumference at the required inset from desk edge, with a router bit with the router base tilted i.e. pack up one side. the max depth would be equal to the leather thickness down to nothing. Can also be done with a rebate plane The skiver is glued down with old fashioned wallpaper paste, allows lots of time for positioning, smoothed down with a cloth pad. Normally in the workshop the leather would be applied and then embossed. veneer obtainable from Crispins (Now Capital Crispin). Though Oak faced mdf would be the easiest. That desk (1920s/1930s probably) will have been glued with hide glue and joints can be released using steam or boiling water ( water filled syringe to inject).

 

[Chubber]

If ever a job was crying out for biscuit jointing it's this one, given the O.P.s lack of practical resources, space and being presumptive, clamps. I wouldn't touch the jointed edges other than a clean.

 

[Dizzwold]

Hi Guys,

@XTiffy ooh, that's interesting information. I didn't know that. Thank you.

My problem at the moment is not having a straight edge long enough. I've checked loads of timber I have around, but there all like a dogs hind leg. I've even checked some steel wall straps I have, but due to them being rolled steel there no good either.
I'll just have to wait (financially), to get a larger spirit level

@Chubber I do have, and was contemplating using biscuits. I have couple of slot cutters and some no" 10 biscuits. Thank you for your recommendation.

 

[Dovetail]

That is going to be a beautiful desk when you are done.

 

[Dizzwold]

@Dovetail Thank you, I hope so
@XTiffy Also thank you for the hint on the possible glue used. I guess that's a distemper based then?
I've recently been stripping my walls (moved here a couple of years ago). The walls have only ever had one coat of paint since being built in the 1970's and was a distemper based paint. I had to use a wall paper steam stripper and scraper. In places it would peel off like sun brunt skin (in strips), in other places it was like chewing gum. Terrible stuff and it soaks into the walls, so I also had to use Zinsser peel stop to stabilise it.
I've actually got one of those kettle style steamers with nozzles and wands for cleaning windows etc, so this may come into action.

Finances are holding me back a little at the moment for a straight edge long enough and a sheet of oak faced ply, but I have plenty of sanding to do in the meantime.

Thank you everyone for your comments, advice and wisdom. I'm really grateful for all your help.

I'll keep you posted.

 

[XTiffy]

With regards to straight edges. In our workshop we had to rebuld 10 ft x 6ft doors, as I needed a 10' plus straight edge, I went to a metals supplier and there is a particular type of steel that is pefectly straight. From memory (though I do have them stored away) they were something like 50mm x 8mm section, perfect for running a saw or router against. Very reasonable price per metre then (25 years ago). In my case I screwed them to ply and trimmed one side for a router and the other for a portable circular saw.

 

[Dizzwold]

@XTiffy Lol "Great Minds think alike" and all that. I'd looked at the 1.8m spirit level on toolstation, then thought "Aluminiumwarehouse" for some rectangular box section ali, but they now have a min spend of £25 after vat and then wanted £20 t ship it.
So I contacted a local engineering fabricators who replied with £37 + vat for 6m of 50 x 25mm rectangular box. I replied enquiring for 3m, £47 + vat (I only have a ford fiesta, lol).
A friend then popped his head in and said a friend of his might be able to help and lend me some sash clamps to re-assemble the top.

Thank you for your thoughts. I'm most grateful.

I'm planning to rebuild the top as it was previously, see what I think to it, then when I can afford a leather writing pad, then I'll start to consider all the options that have been kindly offered. Firstly I'll see if the sheer weight of the pad due to its size will hold itself in-place (2, build a 3" frame from the existing top, rebate the frame for a ply base to sit on for the leather pad to sit in, 2, a tapered shallow for the edge of the pad to rest in (with wall paper paste)), and any other offering that come to fruition.

 

[Dizzwold]

Hi Guys,

With having a quick look at the drawer locking system, it seams that there used to be more to it than it's current state.
In-between the 2 drawer units (where your legs would be), there is a bolt protruding on each side. These connect to a timber beam with screws located towards the back of each drawer, and will locate into a slot on a piece of angle iron fixed to the back of each drawer. It looks as if there was some kind of pinion/pivot lever that would then be connected to a bar/rod on each drawer unit, then coming out towards the front on the underside of the top. I've highlighted the bolt, and where there looks to have been some kind of lever system, and the groves in the side of the drawer unit going towards the front where there seams to have been another fixture to hold a rod/bar.
These groves are also apparent on the under side of the top.

Is anyone familiar with this type of locking system or has a diagram of such?

I appreciate it's a reasonably simple locking system and I could fathom something out for myself for this to be working in a similar fashion, but wounder if anyone has seen this before and if it was a common design of-sorts.

It would be nice to keep it as original as possible and make use of the existing fixing holes.

 

[Dizzwold]

Hi Guys,

Look at what I've just spotted. This is near-on exactly the sme as my desk, with the leather writing pad and the design the @J-G had recommended;

https://www.whisperandecho.co.uk/product/early-20th-century-desk-in-oak-by-angus-of-london/

This must be the same design of lock for the drawer units also (a Angus Design patent no˚ 472060). Some research to be done when I get the chance.

 

[J-G]

the design the @J-G had recommended;

I've had further thoughts on this matter and suggest that if (when?) you do go down this route, rather than use a butt joint, (with mortice & tenon / loose tenon / dowel / domino) - a mitred half-lap might be more 'elegant'. It would be a little more challenging but I think well worth while.

Here are some drawings showing exactly what I envisage :

This shows a 12mm plywood centre panel rebated to provide a 'well' for the leather pad, inset into an 8mm wide groove on the inner edge of the 75mm (3") wide x 19mm thick Oak surround. I could provide detailed dimensions but (to some extent) they would depend upon the thickness of the leather - to which I am not privy - (I've guessed at 2mm for the purpose of the drawing.

 

[Cabinetman]

That looks eminently doable, the only thing that could go wrong is if the panel is large enough to flex, but that’s easily fixed.
Ian