whiskywill
Established Member
Nice to see that Yulia Skripal has left hospital. I hope she paid her bill before she was discharged.
NHS
- Thread starter whiskywill
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Yes nice to see that Pukin didn't get his wicked way with her! Don\t worry about who paid the bill.
John Brown
Freeloading Social media influenza
Her father used to work for UK intelligence, she was here visiting him.whiskywill":1giei52s said:
Hardly NHS tourism... :roll:
whiskywill
Established Member
John Brown":3daxcv77 said:
I don't recall mentioning NHS tourism. My son lives abroad. If I visited him I would have to pay for treatment or rely on my travel insurance, and rightly so. I have as much compassion as anyone :roll: but it's an attitude like that means that the NHS is losing out.
Leaving hospital after a serious illness or injury isn't like checking out of a hotel. I agree that those who have the means to pay, via insurance or personal resources should pay for their treatment, if they are not entitled to use NHS free of charge, but not that people should be presented with a bill as they leave the building - this kind of mindset leads to the ridiculous situation of people who have lived here 60 years being denied treatment because they didn't have the right bit of paper, and it's not a road a civilised, egalitarian country spud go down.
AES
Established Member
I can only say that while visiting UK on business a few years ago, I needed both a hospital and a GP.
As I hadn't been resident in UK for years before that (and therefore had not paid UK tax) I fully expected to pay both the hospital and the GP (I would of course have claimed it back from my Swiss health insurance - standard practice here).
I EVENTUALLY paid the GP about 6 months after the event (they kept asking for a cheque, and here we haven't seen those for at least the last 20 years!) and even though briefed before hand about no cheques and bank account crediting they only finally sent the necessary bank info so that I could credit their account bout 6 months after the event.
The hospital was similarly briefed before hand, and again after my treatment, and I pushed and pushed to pay them before leaving (cash if necessary) and they just did not have the necessary "mechanism" either to bill me there and then (so that I could claim the money back, as above) nor to take my money on the spot. I left that hospital having given all my details so they could eventually bill me, and despite sending them a reminder about a year after the event, I've never received a reply - or bill either.
That event was about 10 years ago now and I don't know if NHS procedures have since been changed,but based on my own experience from 10 years ago I'm not surprised if "foreigners" leave NHS hospitals without paying.
I should perhaps add that my UK visit was to attend a training course, it was NOT NHS tourism - if a huge gale had not blown a heavy car door hard on to my lower leg, so creating a nasty ulcer, I wouldn't have been found anywhere near the hospital during that visit!
As I hadn't been resident in UK for years before that (and therefore had not paid UK tax) I fully expected to pay both the hospital and the GP (I would of course have claimed it back from my Swiss health insurance - standard practice here).
I EVENTUALLY paid the GP about 6 months after the event (they kept asking for a cheque, and here we haven't seen those for at least the last 20 years!) and even though briefed before hand about no cheques and bank account crediting they only finally sent the necessary bank info so that I could credit their account bout 6 months after the event.
The hospital was similarly briefed before hand, and again after my treatment, and I pushed and pushed to pay them before leaving (cash if necessary) and they just did not have the necessary "mechanism" either to bill me there and then (so that I could claim the money back, as above) nor to take my money on the spot. I left that hospital having given all my details so they could eventually bill me, and despite sending them a reminder about a year after the event, I've never received a reply - or bill either.
That event was about 10 years ago now and I don't know if NHS procedures have since been changed,but based on my own experience from 10 years ago I'm not surprised if "foreigners" leave NHS hospitals without paying.
I should perhaps add that my UK visit was to attend a training course, it was NOT NHS tourism - if a huge gale had not blown a heavy car door hard on to my lower leg, so creating a nasty ulcer, I wouldn't have been found anywhere near the hospital during that visit!
5 years ago I was taken to hospital in turkey.
the treatment was superb, from a small town hospital.
But they made very sure my insurance was going to pay before they got too far into the tests, and then at the end of the day I had to wait a couple hours because they wouldnt let me leave till the UK insurance company had faxed a confirmation to them. Once that arrived, i got a free 10 mile ride back to my hotel.
I dont see a problem with that. Its the UK "honour" system that is the cash flow problem.
But has any one actually confirmed that this particular incident has been charged to the NHS ?
Or are we just speculating and ranting?
the treatment was superb, from a small town hospital.
But they made very sure my insurance was going to pay before they got too far into the tests, and then at the end of the day I had to wait a couple hours because they wouldnt let me leave till the UK insurance company had faxed a confirmation to them. Once that arrived, i got a free 10 mile ride back to my hotel.
I dont see a problem with that. Its the UK "honour" system that is the cash flow problem.
But has any one actually confirmed that this particular incident has been charged to the NHS ?
Or are we just speculating and ranting?
AES
Established Member
+1 for sunnybob's comments.
I had to undergo an emergency operation while working in Singapore on a contract - again similar circumstances to mine as explained above. I first visited them on a Friday, and had the op the following Monday morning, BUT the specialist I saw made sure that whatever the final bill would be, the hospital would get paid - in that case they had an imprint of my Am Exp card before the session with the specialist ended, and before the resulting op was started. And the bill was put into my hand as I left the hospital (by taxi) after the op. And I see nothing at all wrong with that approach.
I'm NOT suggesting that if, for example, you're ambulanced into hospital after a serious traffic accident everything should halt before they know how you'll pay, but for straightforward but non-emergency treatment I see no reason why both hospitals and doctors practices shouldn't make sure they're going to get paid before the treatment starts, AND that they really are paid within a reasonable period after discharge.
As I say, I don't know if NHS procedures have changed in the last 10 years, but as to those 2 Russians in Salisbury, I'm sure that we're all just speculating as to what happened and who paid what, when, where and to whom.
But although that hospital clearly did a brilliant job I wouldn't be at all surprised to learn that all costs were paid by UK tax payers! Dunno. Who does?
I had to undergo an emergency operation while working in Singapore on a contract - again similar circumstances to mine as explained above. I first visited them on a Friday, and had the op the following Monday morning, BUT the specialist I saw made sure that whatever the final bill would be, the hospital would get paid - in that case they had an imprint of my Am Exp card before the session with the specialist ended, and before the resulting op was started. And the bill was put into my hand as I left the hospital (by taxi) after the op. And I see nothing at all wrong with that approach.
I'm NOT suggesting that if, for example, you're ambulanced into hospital after a serious traffic accident everything should halt before they know how you'll pay, but for straightforward but non-emergency treatment I see no reason why both hospitals and doctors practices shouldn't make sure they're going to get paid before the treatment starts, AND that they really are paid within a reasonable period after discharge.
As I say, I don't know if NHS procedures have changed in the last 10 years, but as to those 2 Russians in Salisbury, I'm sure that we're all just speculating as to what happened and who paid what, when, where and to whom.
But although that hospital clearly did a brilliant job I wouldn't be at all surprised to learn that all costs were paid by UK tax payers! Dunno. Who does?
LeeElms
Established Member
Phil Pascoe
Established Member
It could be classed as valuable work experience for when one of our own people get the same poisoning.
rafezetter
Troll Hunter
AFAIK all UK residents are urged to buy travel insurance before going anywhere - even inside the EU - and some countries won't grant a visa without it.
Some of those countries have a nationalised health service, some don't.
Question: Are non UK residents urged to do the same when travelling to the UK?
The cynic in me thinks not.
It would be interesting to know what sort of numbers of health tourists Germany, France, Brussels, Italy etc get.
I needed some minor attention after an incident on a boat in Portugal - despite my showing them my passport and Portugal supposedly having a quid pro quo system with our NHS, I was told to pay and "sort it out with the NHS when you get home". Suprise suprise NHS weren't even remotely interested.
The sooner we adopt a "prove you can pay" for all but the most immediately life threatening of conditions, the better off UK residents will be.
Sorry but the UK simply cannot help everyone who needs it, and other countries have no problems with prioritising its own citizens, and I'm tired of being made to feel like some nazi death camp commandant for saying that, by the special snowflakes who don't understand simple economics.
Some of those countries have a nationalised health service, some don't.
Question: Are non UK residents urged to do the same when travelling to the UK?
The cynic in me thinks not.
It would be interesting to know what sort of numbers of health tourists Germany, France, Brussels, Italy etc get.
I needed some minor attention after an incident on a boat in Portugal - despite my showing them my passport and Portugal supposedly having a quid pro quo system with our NHS, I was told to pay and "sort it out with the NHS when you get home". Suprise suprise NHS weren't even remotely interested.
The sooner we adopt a "prove you can pay" for all but the most immediately life threatening of conditions, the better off UK residents will be.
Sorry but the UK simply cannot help everyone who needs it, and other countries have no problems with prioritising its own citizens, and I'm tired of being made to feel like some nazi death camp commandant for saying that, by the special snowflakes who don't understand simple economics.
quite a few years ago now i was in Kuala Lumpor (sp?) and the guide explained their health system to us. He was very proud they HAD a health system.
Everybody who worked got health credits to a certain value per week. If they got sick, they could use those credits untill they ran out, then they had to pay. If the illness was serious, it was permissible for the person to use other peoples credits (family, friends, public appeal). Those credits werent just borrowed, they were given. With no refunds.
Everybody who worked got health credits to a certain value per week. If they got sick, they could use those credits untill they ran out, then they had to pay. If the illness was serious, it was permissible for the person to use other peoples credits (family, friends, public appeal). Those credits werent just borrowed, they were given. With no refunds.
"Question: Are non UK residents urged to do the same when travelling to the UK?"
I'm from a non EU country. Our NHS has bilateral agreements with most European countries.
We are covered when abroad for treatment of all non-chronic conditions. When in the UK, you just show your passport or NHS card at the hospital and that's it.
When traveling to the US, we have to pay extra medical insurance (about a 100E per month),
for the treatment of any emergency or non-chronic conditions.
I'm from a non EU country. Our NHS has bilateral agreements with most European countries.
We are covered when abroad for treatment of all non-chronic conditions. When in the UK, you just show your passport or NHS card at the hospital and that's it.
When traveling to the US, we have to pay extra medical insurance (about a 100E per month),
for the treatment of any emergency or non-chronic conditions.
Health tourism costs the NHS 0.3% of it's budget, deliberate health tourism costs approx 300 million. While I agree it should be stopped we need a simple way of doing it, the admin costs alone of checking everyone who comes into hospital is eligible would be enormous as well as chasing up payments later on in emergency cases (the vast majority are emergency cases).
Also, what do we do about those in this country who never pay into the system? I know plenty personally who not only have they never worked and paid taxes, their parents haven't either, should they be denied care too? How would you decide?
You all talk about it like it's easy, if it was so easy, don't you think something would have been done about it?
Also, what do we do about those in this country who never pay into the system? I know plenty personally who not only have they never worked and paid taxes, their parents haven't either, should they be denied care too? How would you decide?
You all talk about it like it's easy, if it was so easy, don't you think something would have been done about it?
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Some very old friends of ours had a boat on the Canal du Midi a few years back. They were insured. The guy had all sorts of problems and finished up in Carcassonne Hospital for 2 weeks. When he was discharged he was given a bill for well over 2000€ and asked for the money there and then. He had to pay it and claim it back from that insurance!
They were under the impression before that that the insurance they had would pay the hospital direct. They were wrong. So it might just be a good idea to check anyway if you have travel insurance?
As far as the 2 Russians are concerned it's a shame that the NHS can't clobber Pukin with the bill!
Just as a matter of interest, did you know that 'putain' means prostitute in French? It's pronounced the same as that person's name so they actually spell his name with an 'e' on the end to change the pronunciation :twisted: :twisted:
They were under the impression before that that the insurance they had would pay the hospital direct. They were wrong. So it might just be a good idea to check anyway if you have travel insurance?
As far as the 2 Russians are concerned it's a shame that the NHS can't clobber Pukin with the bill!
Just as a matter of interest, did you know that 'putain' means prostitute in French? It's pronounced the same as that person's name so they actually spell his name with an 'e' on the end to change the pronunciation :twisted: :twisted:
julianf":27mxtq65 said:
Because no one likes paying taxes and it's easy to bash foreigners.
That being said, HMRC only lost 4.4 bill, tax evasion is illegal, tax avoidance is perfectly legal so they didn't lose anything. HMRC wrote the rules, if they don't like that, they should change them (and I think they should, the tax laws need massive simplification.)
I believe in the principle of universal healthcare and i'm very thankful for the NHS but needed two fairly major operations while working overseas one time. The private hospitals that took care of me were excellent, fast, and very much more user friendly. They billed the medical insurance direct, getting approval for each stage of the treatment as the investigations and surgery proceeded. I got a copy of the itemised bill at the end which was enlightening and totalled about $30k 
