Looking for an electronic version of an old book

[Halo Jones]

I was at a local craft symposium at the weekend and had a fascinating talk about local furniture. One book that was talked about was SCOTTISH WOODWORK OF THE 16TH & 17TH CENTURIES by John William Small. This chap took in on himself to accurately draw and document a whole load of Scottish furniture that he found on a trip around the country. Committed as he was he then set up a company in Stirling to make facsimiles of these pieces of furniture, many of which are on still on show at a Palace a few miles from my house.

I would love to give this book a good look but don't want to spend the £85 - £100 required to buy it (well I would if money were no object!). I was wondering if those in the know (Andy T?!) would be able to find an archived electronic version? I have had a quick look but only been able to find it on a slightly dodgy looking site!

Any help appreciated.

H.

 

[bugbear]

St Andrews University hold a copy, as do others;

http://www.worldcat.org/title/scottish- ... lc/8300138

BugBear

 

[Halo Jones]

It was an Art Historian from St Andrews that gave the lecture. The book is likely to valuable to be eligible for inter-library loan too! I see they also have it at the national library in Edinburgh. If all else fails I could spend an afternoon there.

Thanks BugBear

 

[bugbear]

It was an Art Historian from St Andrews that gave the lecture. The book is likely to valuable to be eligible for inter-library loan too! I see they also have it at the national library in Edinburgh. If all else fails I could spend an afternoon there.

Thanks BugBear

Depending on your priorities, and how you value your own time, (and travel costs), you might save money by buying an expensive book!

BugBear

 

[Harbo]

What's the significance of "drawn and measured for the stone"? In the books title.

Rod

 

[AndyT]

A good way to check whether an accessible scanned version is available is to look at a book's record on the Open Library site.

In this case, the answer seems to be No - https://openlibrary.org/works/OL177191W ... _centuries

- so a visit to a library is the best option.

I'd guess that 'measured for the stone' refers to making accurate to scale prints for reproduction by lithography, a printing process using pieces of very flat stone.

 

[bugbear]

...lithography, a printing process using pieces of very flat stone.

How flat?

BugBear (running away)

 

[Homerjh]

http://www.abebooks.co.uk/book-search/t ... n-william/

these any better?

 

[Halo Jones]

Those could be tempting but I would like a look before I buy (I am going to Edinburgh on Saturday so might be able to get to the shop in one of those links).

I did find http://pdf-directory.org/ebook.php?id=3T5JAQAAMAAJ

but the site seems a little bit dodgy to me (plus I couldn't figure out how to register!)

 

[AndyT]

One of the frustrating aspects of this is that although this title is long out of copyright and has been scanned by Google to make it publicly available, it's not available to us in the UK. If you search for it on Google and look at the 'books' results you will see something like this - https://books.google.co.uk/books?id=3T5 ... sQ6AEIHDAA - which they call 'snippet view' - you can search inside the text and see if it contains key words you are interested in, but no more.

It's a long complicated story, but I think this has come about as a consequence of the way that Google went about its book scanning project, disregarding rights in works which were scanned but were not in the public domain.

Users in the USA may well be able to see and use the Google scans - that's how you will sometimes find print-on-demand copies or e-books listed for sale. It's presumably how the text ends up on a dodgy looking file exchange site. Often, texts are copied across to the Internet Archive and listed on the Open Library, so are readily available for us here.

What you can't tell from Google is whether the 100 pages of lithographs which make up the important part of this particular book were properly scanned and included - some of Google's early scanning work was done very mechanically and mindlessly, disregarding what a reader might actually want from a book. I think your plan of looking first and then buying is a good one - provided your bookseller of choice is not besieged by eager UKW readers ahead of you in the crush!

 

[AndyT]

Lightbulb moment!

Here it is online.

I'd forgotten about the Hathi Trust, which also has e-texts from Google in its care, but the NLS catalogue led me there.

Here in the UK we are restricted to reading online or downloading individual pages (unless you have academic privileges) but it's all there and it looks fascinating. Here are the pictures

http://hdl.handle.net/2027/uiug.30112114024695


You'll also want this link for the words:

http://hdl.handle.net/2027/mdp.39015024387154

Read on!
And if the words and pictures were in two separate volumes, be careful what you buy!

 

[Homerjh]

Those could be tempting but I would like a look before I buy (I am going to Edinburgh on Saturday so might be able to get to the shop in one of those links).

I did find http://pdf-directory.org/ebook.php?id=3T5JAQAAMAAJ

but the site seems a little bit dodgy to me (plus I couldn't figure out how to register!)

dodgy? what about the 'recomanded books' at the bottom!

dodgier than a politicians promises!

 

[Halo Jones]

Amazing. Thanks Andy! Confirms that I want to buy! Ordered from Glasgow. Not looked at the second link as closely but I think that is a different (but equally fascinating) book.

If you are ever up this way I recommend a trip to Falkland Palace in Fife where there are approx 10 - 15 pieces of his work on display and they look almost new for something over 100 years old. He even had the foresight to have a little brass plaque discreetly hidden explaining this was not the original but an exact copy of the original. Very forward looking for the time!

 

[JohnPW]

The author died in 1911, so this book is definitely out of copyright in the UK, and probably worldwide.

From https://support.google.com/books/answer/43729?hl=en

Why some books aren't available in full view

There are a few reasons why some books in Google Books aren’t available to read in full.

Partner agreements: Many books come from authors and publishers who participate in our Partner Program. These partners decide whether to make their books fully or partly viewable.

Copyrighted: If a book is copyrighted, there are restrictions on how much you can see. But if a book is out of copyright and in the public domain in your country, it can be made fully viewable.

Note: We review books on an ongoing basis to determine if they’re in the public domain. If you think a book is in the public domain in your country but is not viewable in full, ask us to review it https://support.google.com/books/answer/43729?hl=en.

Tip: If you want to view a classic novel, try searching for the original edition. If a classic novel has been re-published with some new content, that usually means it’s copyrighted and not fully viewable.

Not yet scanned: Some public domain books have not yet been scanned, so we don’t have anything to show you at the moment. We’re working to make them viewable for you.

I suspect Google doesn't make the book available because they get money from booksellers advertising on the Google page for the book.

 

[AndyT]

I've just looked again - please ignore my erroneous inclusion of the other book - I was looking at the search, not the result.

 

[Harbo]

There was a programme about fossils where they featured a famous quarry in Germany which was worked for litho plates - they found a lot of rare fossils too.

Rod