LED Battens for Woodwork workshop

[Thedog]

Hello,

I have a small workshop, which has no windows .
Its really about the size of a medium garage, maybe a bit smaller.

At the moment I have 4x 6ft tubes, each 70W which the spec states 6200 lm output with a colour temp of 4000K.
These have been pretty good, but I have always thought that were not as bright as what I would like, and Perhaps the wrong colour.
And of course being Fluorescent, tend to degrade fairly quickly.
Years ago I replaced them with 6500K but these were too much giving everything a blueish tint.

Anyway, my question is really what colour is best for general woodworking. I have read a lot about 5000K being best.

I like the look of the Crompton Lamps offering which are tri colour (Switchable 3K, 4K & 5700K) but are 80W giving 8000 lm each, so maybe a bit too bright with four of them!

https://www.cromptonlamps.com/Catal...-High-Output-1800mm-80W-3000K4000K5700K-14459

What I am looking for is a metal framed, tri colour but with switchable power. (Only want tri colour so I can test / change if required)
I could have two light switches, one for normal power and for high power when needed.

Maybe somthing like this, but I think 6K is too blue. Would be nice to have Tri colour up to 5700K maybe?
https://www.lighthubdirect.com/coll...roducts/vala-led-batten-6ft-cct-ip20-standard

Is 5700K far enough away from 6500K to make a difference, perhaps less blue?

Any ideas or suggestions about makes or models would be helpful.
I don't want the low cost all plastic ones because they get to hot. I just purchased a V-TAC one from Toolstation
It gets so hot on the back, you cannot touch it.

Thanks

 

[Jamesc]

If you are worried about colour matching then you need to use the same light (colour temperature) as where it is going. Mi workshop is used for both metal and woodwork. I prefer a colder white as I find it makes things easier to see with my duff eyes.
If you are really worried about colour matching then you need to pay attention to the colour rendering index (CRI) the lamps you link to list a cri of approx 80 which for matching is not great but for general purpose is absolutly fine.
I use the flat panels intended for false ceilings and find them excellent as you get a good even spread of light I find I have virtually no shaddows which makes marking out a lot easier.

 

[Thedog]

If you are worried about colour matching then you need to use the same light (colour temperature) as where it is going. Mi workshop is used for both metal and woodwork. I prefer a colder white as I find it makes things easier to see with my duff eyes.

Thanks for replying. I need to replace all four fittings with new LED ones. I don't need to match what I have already. As I cannot test these and have to buy online, I want to get it right. I have 4000K already (Tubes), but feel they may be just a bit to un-natural in colour. Maybe?

Most of the leds fittings state CRI of => 80.
I want these for general use, so don't need anything special for colour matching projects. Just for general woodworking use.
As I am replacing my 4x 6ft tubes, just thought it would be nice to get something more suitable.

I like the idea if the flat panels but this is too much work. I am looking at direct replacements for my 6ft fittings.
What colour is best for woodwork? I suppose its a matter of opinion really.

Cheers

 

[Jamesc]

It is really difficult to advise. What works for me is unlikly to be spot on for you. I have a few eye problems so have added far too many (in design terms) lights but that works for me. It may be worth trying to find a showroom that has examples, our B&Q used to have a display with bulbs of different colour temperature so you could compare but I don't think they do that now.
Alternatively you could take advantage of the likes of Amazon with their free returns and get different fittings and try them. It is such a subjective thing that not only depends on your eysight but the surroundings, what coulour you have painted the walls and ceiling, and what work you are doing that only you will be able to make the final call.
As a general rule we used to design offices and work spaces with a cool white around 4000 - 4500K
Domestic spaces warm white 3000 - 4000K
Display areas - galleries shops etc. Dayligh 6000 - 6500K

 

[Thedog]

Yeah, it certainly is not a one for for all.
I wouldn't mind trying 45000K, 5000K or 5700K. Seems like 4500K and 5000K are hard to find.
I did look on Amazon, but its seems the choices are less. Most are the lower cost plastic fittings either 4K or 6.5K

Time to put the kettle on and have another look online

 

[Thedog]

These units maybe be suitable.
They state they have a CRI of >85, so better than most of the common ones.
And are switchable with 3K, 4K and 5700K.

https://www.cef.co.uk/catalogue/products/5133367-27w-52w-6ft-led-tri-colour-batten-fitting

Price is not bad either.

Thanks.

 

[Jacob]

I just bought a couple of these https://www.screwfix.com/p/lap-reeve-twin-4ft-led-batten-36w-3300lm-220-240v/476pp
Very easy to fit and very nice cool white light for a garage workshop.

 

[Sideways]

LED's with different colour temp aren't generally intended to be switched in normal use.
The idea is more that an installer can carry one line of products that can be matched to something already there, or set as the customer wants at installation time.
It's more about minimising inventory.

Each to their own. I agree that 6000K odd is a harsh blue white and I don't find it comfortable. I'm personally happy with 3000K almost candle yellow for lights in the house when I'm sitting in the evening trying to relax. 4000K isnoften described as neutral white and is a nice shade to me for functional tasks like in the workshop or kitchen. Each very much to their own.

The advice to go for a high colour rendering index, CRI, is very good.

There are people who are interested in high performance torches / flashlights who are very into the technical details of LEDs. Some chase maximum output which is normally associated with the 6000K leds. Others chase an ideal colour tint, and in that case a 4000K tint with a high CRI is sought after.

 

[Jake]

Standard cool white 4000K or 4500k is high enough. The issue you might have with the fluorescents seeming unnatural could be CRI rather than temp, they emit a pretty 'spiky' light in terms of colour spectrum. The naturalness of colour temp is linked to lumens, and it's very difficult to get enough artificial light to make a 'daylight' temperature look natural. As lumens go down, your brain expects lower colour temp, so lower lumens and higher temps look very artificial and are more of a strain.

Good CRI and a standard cool white and plenty of fixtures to get the lumens up to a high level is as good as you will get.

 

[Spectric]

I have a small workshop, which has no windows

You cannot beat natural light and living in Cornwall I suspect you get plenty and long days so before going for the lights have you thought about roof lights to let natural light in ?

 

[alex robinson]

These units maybe be suitable.
They state they have a CRI of >85, so better than most of the common ones.
And are switchable with 3K, 4K and 5700K.

https://www.cef.co.uk/catalogue/products/5133367-27w-52w-6ft-led-tri-colour-batten-fitting

Price is not bad either.

Thanks.

I found CRI made way more difference than I expected. I fitted some very high CRI led panels (95 i think) recently and they are in a different league for seeing things. 5000k I think but the lack of shadow and clarity the more complete colour gives is wonderful compared with battens.

 

[BCS1980UK]

I have recently built my small workshop. For the main lights I opted for Led Batten Lights by Barrina (6500 K). You can find easily on Amazon. 8 x 2200lm divided in 3 groups: 4 for general light, 2 on top of the workbench and 2 on top of the 3 rolling carts on the back that work as a secondary bench. I expected it to be overkill to turn all lights at the same time but I realise that I do it often. Also, it gives me flexibility. I also added articulated working lamps (IKEA Tertial), fitted with Philips Master LEDs, which provide a CRI of 90% to correctly reproduce colours and fine details.
Overall, I couldn't be more pleased.
Pictures here.

 

[cemannion]

Thanks for replying. I need to replace all four fittings with new LED ones. I don't need to match what I have already. As I cannot test these and have to buy online, I want to get it right. I have 4000K already (Tubes), but feel they may be just a bit to un-natural in colour. Maybe?

Most of the leds fittings state CRI of => 80.
I want these for general use, so don't need anything special for colour matching projects. Just for general woodworking use.
As I am replacing my 4x 6ft tubes, just thought it would be nice to get something more suitable.

I like the idea if the flat panels but this is too much work. I am looking at direct replacements for my 6ft fittings.
What colour is best for woodwork? I suppose its a matter of opinion really.

Cheers

I've just fitted flat panels to a new plasterboard ceiling using 3d printed clips, easy, quick, cheap and effective
It means either surface mount the power supply or a 100mm hole to hide it.
8 in a 5m x9m room works well, no shadows which is my favourite bit of this. Let me know if you want the file to print them

 

[imageel]

As others have mentioned lighting is a very subjective so what works for one is unlikely to work for someone else.
One aspect not mentioned aside from CRI and spectral peak is directionality - and the latter has in my experience a marked affect on both the perceived brightness but also the clarity of the scene - years ago circa 2015 I had an extension built with vaulted ceilings and at that time no manufacturer was producing LED uplighters.
I ended up designing my own using high quality Bridgelux devices and using a luxmeter to measure the incident illumination levels I found that I could achieve startlingly bright illumination with only 4 uplighters in the 4 corners of a room with an incident illumination of only 350 lux.
Due to the reflective nature of uplighters you achieve a more dispersed light source so say you look at an AA battery standing on end, there are no discernible shadows cast by it and thus it appears very sharp.
I think this is the sort of lighting you want in a workshop so that when say measuring or marking up you can see precisely the measure and marking tool whether pencil or knife with greater clarity than you would with traditional task lighting.
As others have mentioned perhaps flat panelled LED arrays would provide similar non-point source light..
Just my two cents....

 

[Thedog]

Thank you for all your replies. Its really helpful.
I think that having flat panels would be best. However, for the moment I just need to replace the 4x 6ft fittings new led units.

Just one final question

I am considering one of these (Well, 4x actually).

https://www.cef.co.uk/catalogue/products/5133367-27w-52w-6ft-led-tri-colour-batten-fitting

Or

https://www.toolstation.com/integral-led-lightspan-ip20-ik08-batten/p51267

Both have good reviews, and a metal body etc.
The Toolstation option is off the shelf and lower cost.

The tool Integral LED brand has a CRI of 80 and a beam angle of 120 Degrees. (7800 lm)
The Knightsbridge offering (From CEF) has a CRI of 85 and a beam angle of 145 degrees (7520 lm)

Would a slightly wider angle and higher CRI (85 over 80 and 145 deg. over 120 deg.) be better?
Does this small increase in CRI make a big difference??

Sorry for looking into to this far to much, but like I said, I don't have any daylight in the garage so its important.
I know that one fit does not fit all. Just wondered about the CRI.

Cheers

 

[imageel]

Colour rendition is very subjective - we only have ~5% cones in our retina which accounts for the fact we go colour blind in dim/dark conditions
I'd be surprised if without the aid of a colour chart you could tell the difference between 80 & 85 CRI
I wouldn't overthink it, 80 is the minimum you should aim for, the manufacturers charge shedloads to reach the nirvana of 100 and few I suspect would notice the difference.
Of more importance IMHO is colour temp - I prefer 4500K aka daylight which in comparison to tungsten is quite blue - but that's just a hangover from the days of oil lamps and candles...

 

[Jake]

Of more importance IMHO is colour temp - I prefer 4500K aka daylight which in comparison to tungsten is quite blue

That's cool white, daylight is 6000-6500K

 

[imageel]

That's cool white, daylight is 6000-6500K

Ah thanks for correcting me -it was over 9y ago...!

 

[Jake]

It's a lot nicer than 'daylight' for sure.

 

[thikone]

Heh, I'm in disbelief when it comes to LED battens. Firstly, they all flicker if AC mains powered. Secondly, LEDs that are used in them are never ones with CRI 95.

But you can buy decent power supply for 12 or 24 volts and you can buy individual LEDs with CRI 95 of the white temperature and brand you like from electronics parts suppliers.

Then there is the topic of dimming LED lights. The proper dimming should use current source control or PWM with frequency above 20kHz (like computer fans do). Otherwise, the camera would see it even if you don't. Well, mostly important to bloggers and such but I also make videos for myself, my wife or my friends sometimes.

So, the best is basically to aim for a video production stage lights, kind of. Those are usually done properly and not cheaply.

I'm doing my own lights for my workshop. With expensive power supply for 24 volts, with my own 32 channel controller with 25 kHz PWM dimming. But it takes time to find decent parts and design everything. Overengineered and not for everybody, I guess. But at least you know more now.