Just a thought.

[finneyb]

Thinking of good design in terms of shape must use Fibonacci numbers and the Golden Number http://www.maths.surrey.ac.uk/hosted-si ... ibnat.html as its basis.

Keith Tomkins' paper Designing with Triangles may be a more useful document for woodturners http://www.woodturner.org/resources/tompkins_design.pdf

Brian

 

[Roger C]

Thanks Brian the links work great, appreciate it and thanks for sharing Roger C

 

[Silverbirch]

Brian
Maybe that`s one way to approach design and I`m sure the links you posted are useful and illuminating if that`s your sort of thing, but I`m afraid that sort of approach would turn me right off! I think good design can equally well be arrived at through studying the work of others, whether woodturning, ceramics or whatever; by looking at and thinking about the natural and man made objects which surround us; by trying to relate these to our own work.
If you try to apply formulae to this kind of thing, you will end up with formulaic work!
Just my opinion.

Ian

 

[finneyb]

.... I think good design can equally well be arrived at through studying the work of others, whether woodturning, ceramics or whatever; by looking at and thinking about the natural and man made objects which surround us; by trying to relate these to our own work.....'
/quote]

Ian,

I agree.
The formulae have been back engineered from the examples you give. The Golden Number is 1.618 ie height to width ratio is 1: 1.618 (or thereabouts ) or vice versa. The Golden Number was known to the Greeks and earlier. Try it on something that pleases your eye - but don't work to the millimetre (1.618 is the work of an academic mathematician - we are in the real world)

Fibonacci - was an Italian mathematician born 1175 AD its been around for some time. And he was the person who put it in writing the proportions were probably in common usage a long time before the academic looked at it and provided the theory.

Brian

 

[KimG]

If you try to apply formulae to this kind of thing, you will end up with formulaic work!

Not necessarily Ian, your concept could apply to say music, but the principle contained in the stuff Brian has highlighted are what have been recognized for centuries as balances that are generally pleasing to the eye. Sure, some folks are pleased with what to others are some very odd shapes, but on the whole, the concepts in Fibonacci sequences and the golden mean, as well as the various kinds of curves are pleasing to the eye of the majority.

Now any artist or craftsman can say, well I make what I like and I like what I make, and fair enough to that, why not eh? But I would guess on the whole that most of us are not often that happy with our creations, for two reasons, one, we are pretty sure we could have done it better, and two we see it up close and personal, and the tiny little flaws bug us.

However, if we are truly honest, what most of us desire is that others find our work pleasing, and in particular our peers, because lets face it, as in any skill, the uninitiated simply don't know what to look for in a good piece. However, even then, they can often recognize an exceptional piece, and that can often make the difference between making a sale or not.

For those who are trying to market their work this surely becomes and even more important concept, after all, who would want to known as a maker of mediocre items, we all aspire to be thought well of for making the best we can, design of work following these principles is what will set us on that road.

Picasso as an artist drew and painted some bizarre looking people and animals, but that was after he learned how to draw extremely well, his draftsmanship was fantastic, superbly realistic, as also was Salvador Dali. Trying to be avant garde with turning without understanding and applying the foundations of good design is only likely to be successful for the odd savant,for the rest of us, it's best to learn how to walk before we run.

This is how I see the value of good design and how it can benefit both the hobbyist turner and the professional alike, but it is just an opinion and as such carries little weight.

 

[porker]

N

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk 4

 

[Silverbirch]

I would think that gaining a good grasp of woodturning design can happen in two basic ways :
1. Via the application of principles and formulae in a logical and progressive manner.
2 In a more eclectic manner, picking up bits of information and ideas from here and there, looking, listening to others, etc and gradually absorbing a sense of what works and what doesn`t.
Which approach you follow will depend on things such as your prior experience and training and your natural aptitudes and personality.
Taking elements of each path and combining them into our own unique approach is perhaps what happens with most of us, in reality.

Ian

 

[Tazmaniandevil]

When I first got my lathe, I had no idea where to start and spent hours turning beads & coves etc. I watched youtube videos a-plenty, and still do, and read a great many books.
I tried like a bear to emulate various stances and tool handling techniques. One of the best pieces of advice I was given was on here and that was to, "watch others, but don't get too hung up on copying them completely. Take bits and pieces from each person and develop your own technique."
I think the same goes for design in some ways. We all need to start somewhere, so copying things you see on the t'interwebs that other turners have produced is an ideal position for a beginner. Get to a stage where you are happy enough with the finish from the tools. A lot of tool marks can be sanded away if you use a coarse enough abrasive. (What I have found since moving to more expensive abrasives is the sanding marks are more obvious than the tool marks at times because I'm a wee bit heavy handed.)
Branching out and trying something different is like an itch that needs to be scratched for me. I find doing repetitive stuff gets boring after a while. This is the main reason I could never do any kind of wood-craft for a living. I play at wood working, turning included, and if I manage to earn a few quid along the way then happy days. I believe that is the main difference between myself and many other folk out there.
I like to experiment with shapes, methods and finishes. I am on an exceptionally tight budget for my hobby, so can't go buying lots of tools, polishes, exotic timbers etc. I want to get the most out of what I can find lying around. One of the biggest problems I find though in terms of finish etc. is that I am often beyond the point of no return by the time I realise it is too late to think about the final finish. Having already parted something off then realising there is no way to remount it for finishing without causing untold damage is often why I end up with poorly finished stuff.

[/ramblings]