Jet JWBS-16 Bandsaw - electrical issues

[Inspector]

A decade or more ago I took a 2 speed tool grinder in for an estimate as one of the windings was burnt out and the centrifugal switch was in rough shape. They told me $400Can to $600Can to rebuild it. They said unless a small motor was unique and nothing else would fit they were not economical to rewind. They said (at that time) that motors under 60hp were not worth rewinding and he figured soon that threshold would be 100hp. I never bothered going elsewhere, especially since a brand new tool grinder was less. Perhaps things are different in the UK so I am interested to see what your shops tell you. Your bandsaw motor should be close enough to standard that a new motor can be made to fit even if it means drilling a couple new holes in the mounting plate.

Pete

 

[Spectric]

If the motor mounts to a plate then you might be able to mount a new flange motor onto this plate, even having the motor rewound is going to be cheaper than a new saw or paying £800 for a new motor.

@Distinterior are these the same company down near the quay? If so then have used them many years ago in the days of the old star delta starters.

 

[Distinterior]

They used to be down near the Quay but moved from those premises quite a few years back....Not too sure of their current location but still in the town somewhere.

I've had them repair a couple of electrical tools for me a long time ago when they were at that previous location.

It's got to make more economical sense to have the existing motor rebuilt than to buy a complete new motor for £800...

 

[Ttrees]

Hi Roy,,thanks for the link, I'll definately give them a call.

You aright, the motor mounts to a plate which pivots to tension the belt.

That sounds like a regular foot mounted TEFC induction motor, if its on a plate, but maybe I'm misunderstanding.
The Axi mag only has it pictured from the front.

If choosing say a 3hp single phase motor...
There is foot mounted, flange mounted, and face mounted to choose from, and there is frame size which I no nothing about.

Other things to make sure of is that the motor pole number is the same,
@ around 1740 RPM for a 4 pole motor,
and 3000 RPM is a two pole motor.

Shaft diameter is also on the list.

Shouldn't be too expensive I'd think.

Tom

 

[kmcleod]

So, have emailed the folks based in glasgow above, and also Remco, they both have;
- details of exisitng motor, (picture of the plate on the motor)
- details of shaft, diameter, keyway etc, (again pictures with ruler shown to illustrated centres etc
- details of mounting plate that is attached to motor to adjust belt tension, (essentially a triangular plate which pivots at one end in swings through small arc to allow pulley to tension the V drive belt
- for good measure also included picture of the start/run capacitor.

So hopefully someone can come up with a suitable replacement, (3HP would be idea), and now waiting for response.

 

[no idea]

If your motor looks like this (picture taken from ebay):

Then you need a B14 facemount motor along the lines of ebay item number 255010967000 ( Single Phase 230v Electric Motor, 1.1Kw 2 pole 3000rpm with face mount | eBay ). You probably won't be able to upgrade to a more powerful motor because a larger motor will have a larger shaft and motor frame, unless you want to fit a new pulley and make a new mounting plate.

What spec is your current motor (speed, power etc.)?

edit - just to add, does your existing motor have a brake? If it does, that is likely to be the reason why the replacement has been quoted with a high price. If it doesn't have a brake, any standard motor should be fine. A few pictures of what you have will help.

 

[Davey44]

There are many companies countrywide who rewind motors, we have two within fifteen miles.

I had a relatively cheap disc and belt sander do a burn out on me - sadly just out of guarantee - and the cheapest quote I could get after chasing all round the UK was in excess of £200 with a caveat of - "If we find further faults it may cost more!"

 

[kmcleod]

Attached is the plate from the motor - so its pretty identical to the one listed, from power perspective.

Does it have a brake - yes I think it does, but thats not why they quoted it at £800.

the direct replacement in the USA, on ereplacements is $451, however, ToolFrance say because the bandsaw is no longer made, there isnt spares in the UK, which means the only motor which 'fits' is what is fitted to the JWBS18 - which is a 3HP motor, and the £800 cost is the cost for one of those..

Attached pic of the burnt out part - it clearly was the motor !, and where the motor mount plate attachs - it is the same as above.

 

[Distinterior]

@kmcleod
Have you enquired with any company as to the cost of having the motor repaired/ rewound...? You may be pleasantly surprised.....

Potentially, it is likely to be more economical than buying a complete new motor...? It would certainly be my first choice if I was in your position.

Its obviously lasted well until recently considering the motor was made in June 2003.....Why would you need to search out a bigger motor that may or may not fit your bandsaw?

 

[Gordon Tarling]

I don't know what others might think, but it looks to me that you've had some sort of burn-up where windings/wires meet rather than the windings themselves. If you can find a motor rewinder/specialist local to you, then a remake of those existing connections might be possible without having to resort to a full rewind.

G.

 

[Distinterior]

I don't know what others might think, but it looks to me that you've had some sort of burn-up where windings/wires meet rather than the windings themselves. If you can find a motor rewinder/specialist local to you, then a remake of those existing connections might be possible without having to resort to a full rewind.

G.

That was exactly what I was thinking Gordon.....Its not going to cost too much for a motor specialist to take a look at it and give it a proper test to check the windings themselves.

Even if the worst comes to the worst and they state its knackered, at least you would know for certain!

 

[kmcleod]

Good points on the burn out itself - I'm trying to get a response from a local motor specialist, but as we are into holiday season at the moment, getting responses is hit and miss !

As to the company themselves - the response from Jet / Tool France, was to put it mildly - underwhelming. Neither seemed to have any interest in helping, nor did they seem to have any real knowledge of the saw and its variants. I found myself finding out more information from forums and the internet than either company were providing or could provide.
The overwhelming response seemed to be - oh, the motor has a problem, you need to buy a new bandsaw....

 

[Gordon Tarling]

What's your location?

G.

 

[kmcleod]

Scotland, just outside Glasgow,,,

 

[Gordon Tarling]

Ah sorry, can't recommend any motor repairers in that area.

G.

 

[kmcleod]

no problem, someone else gave me a link and have dropped them an email,,,

 

[woodfarmer]

My advice is to unplug it from the electricity and fault find it with a meter. Your current approach (scuse the pun) is very much akin to bomb disposal by whacking the bomb with a hammer to see if it works.
With the plug disconnected put a meter set on continuity (high resistance) across the live input and earth. Now play with the switch. If the meter moves find out why and fix it. Likewise also do the same from neutral to earth although the switch wont have any effect (usually). There should be no path between either to earth with the plug disconnected. If the switch is meant to operate a relay you will have to either manually operate the relay (if mechanical) or put the meter across the output side of the relay (live). Do your fault finding disconnected from the mains.

 

[kmcleod]

hi Woodfarmer...well, as someone who has taken apart the odd explosive device, my approach is actually pretty safe, given that at no point am i in contact with the electrics when testing them, plus, the first thing i did was discharge the capacitor, which potentially can give you enough of a jolt to stop your heart.
Additionally, there are two different electrical trips in place between the device and the mains, and I've spoken to sparks about what to do and how to do it.
Thanks for the input and advice, I will as they say, take it under advisement.....

 

[no idea]

If you can't get it repaired and do get a new one, take the end cap that has the label on it off and check if there is a mechanical brake - it look like it is too short for there to be one. If it doesn't have one then any equivalent 1.1kW 1400rpm face mount motor will do (the one I linked is 3000rpm). Just check the shaft size and mounting hole pcd is the same and you'll be good to go.

 

[Stevekane]

What about forget about the mechanical or other brake and just buy any straightforward motor that could be made to fit? I sadly do not have a bandsaw but I wonder, do they run on for long after they are switched off?,,,