How Much Wood Does a Jointer Remove?

[Neomorph]

I know it's gonna be a "how long is a piece of string" answer but what I'm looking at is the maximum and minimum the thing removes. I'm going to use my router table as a jointer (no cash and no space to buy a dedicated one) and need to work out how much to increase the outfield fence to do good jointing.

 

[Sgian Dubh]

A big, powerful router (2000 Watts or so) could have the ability to take as much as 3-5 mm off easily in a single pass on soft easily worked woods up to about 40 mm thick.

On very hard woods like oak and maple the ability to take that amount in one pass in the same thickness would be extremely hard work and you'd most likely end up with a lot of burns, and put yourself in danger too. The thickness of the piece of wood might have to come down to 16 mm or less for the router to be able to tear off 3- 5 mm at a time.

If you set the outfeed fence tangent with the circumference that the cutting edges of the router bit describe, and then set the infeed fence back about 1- 2 mm this works for edge straightening most woods. You can adjust the depth of cut according to the hardness of the wood, the thickness of it, and how much you need to remove to straighten it. 1-2 mm depth of cut is a good place to start, and for this I am assuming a big router, not one of the little 700- 900 Watt machines. The longer the fences, the longer the pieces of wood you can straighten the edges of.

Of course there is always the option of using one of those dreaded handplane thingies for flattening boards and straightening their edges. A no. 7 try plane, if you've got one, does a good job of both and is especially useful for straightening and squaring edges. Slainte.

 

[Chris Knight]

John,
If you use the router table, make sure you use the largest diameter bit your setup can accomodate (eg a one inch diameter is preferred over a half inch).

 

[Neomorph]

John,
If you use the router table, make sure you use the largest diameter bit your setup can accomodate (eg a one inch diameter is preferred over a half inch).

Biggest one I have is a 20mm. I think I've even worked out how to get an adjustable outfield fence that moves in and out as well as left and right. I used the theory of a tail vice and adapted it to the jointed. I've roughed it out in Sketchup so I'll just tidy it up and then post the pics either later today or tomorrow.

 

[Anonymous]

I wouldn't try to take off more than 1 mm at a time on the router table.

I would cetainly not try to take 5mm :shock: in single pass, maybe we'll get to compare finger pictures if you do :lol:

Most hobbiest/light duty pro jointers i've seen specs for or used are rated to take around 3mm max., however, I tend to take a max. of about 1-2 mm in a cut

 

[Neomorph]

I wouldn't try to take off more than 1 mm at a time on the router table.

I would cetainly not try to take 5mm :shock: in single pass, maybe we'll get to compare finger pictures if you do :lol:

Most hobbiest/light duty pro jointers i've seen specs for or used are rated to take around 3mm max., however, I tend to take a max. of about 1-2 mm in a cut

Cool... So if I take into account a max outfield adjustment of 3mm for softwood I should be ok yeah? That actually makes it easier as I can move the alignment device slightly nearer the fence.

 

[engineer one]

i don't think there is a real advantage to taking large lumps of for jointing, you will only get burn out, and on a router make it more difficult to control the possibilities of snatch etc.

i use a mafell 160 planer thicknesser, and this has a max of 3mm cut, but i generally go for multiple passes of 0.5-1 mm. you get more control almost never any kick back, and your feather boards need to be less strong.

on a router table you would definitely need both a hold down and side play control to ensure the wood stays against the cutter.

why go for an adjustable outfeed?? why not have shims which fix on the outfeed side???

as said above the infeed side needs to be set at cutter centre less pass thickness, and if it is a one piece fence, then shims to move the outfeed seem to be more sensible. although i am not happy with its overall design, the sliding wedges on the ryobi table offer some advantage.

paul :wink:

 

[OPJ]

I also agree, you shouldn't be looking to take off any more than 3mm in one pass with a jointer; that's what we're taught at college, using the industrial Wadkin machinery we have. Personally, I don't even like taking off that amount through the thicknesser.

If you are intent on using an inverted router, PLEASE take all the neccesary precautions with regards to your own personal safety and keeping any exposed blade totally inaccesible to your naked fingers.

I also reckon you'd benefit from adding a featheredge to the fence which presses down on the face to keep the cut at ninety degrees - I presume you'll initially work the faces through the thicknesser, right?

 

[Neomorph]

OK... here is my very own design (with ideas taken from other fences but which were not quite what I wanted...

At least this way I won't lose the shims (I'd lose my head if it wasn't sown on! :wink: ). It has all the benefits of the shims and the adjustable fence of Norms. The anti twist bolts will actually sit inside 10mm metal pipes that have an 8mm internal diameter that fits the M8 threads exactly. That way they won't catch on the wood and eventually wear it down. I got them from B&Q for about £1.80 for a 1m length.

 

[tim]

John

Clever fence aside - are you the guy who said he couldn't get his head round Sketchup?

GREAT drawings =D> =D> =D> =D> I'm very impressed.

Cheers

Tim

 

[Neomorph]

John

Clever fence aside - are you the guy who said he couldn't get his head round Sketchup?

GREAT drawings =D> =D> =D> =D> I'm very impressed.

Cheers

Tim

Cheers...

Yeah... I just gotta say I wouldn't have got my head around it if Dave R hadn't helped. But now I've actually figured it out Sketchup is helping me think out problems instead of being a problem itself.

Now the only thing I'm dreading is if my architect friend asks for his copy of Sketchup back lol.

Time to hide behind the curtains methinks... :lol:

 

[Sgian Dubh]

Tony, I didn't suggest that it would be wise for Neomorh to attempt to remove 3-5 mm of stock in one pass if using an inverted router for edge jointing. I did say it's possible in specific circumstances that I outlined in some detail and added a caution or two.

I know it's possible because I've removed that amount of certain types of wood, and more, with routers safely, but I suppose I am somewhat long in the tooth at this game and know what I'm doing.

You will surely have noticed that my suggestion was to set the fences for edge jointing with a powerful inverted router to take about 1- 2 mm as a starting point and make adjustments from there. Slainte.

 

[Neomorph]

After talking to a friend about this I realised I must be stupid.

Me: "I'm trying to figure out how much wood I need to remove with my router to enable me to have a nice flat edge to enable me to join board edges with accuracy. 3mm? 5mm? 1mm?"

Friend: "So basically you just want to get rid of the bumps in the edge yeah?"

Me: "Yeah."

Friend: "So why not just take 1mm off and then check if it's ok. Wouldn't it be would be a waste of wood taking lots off at a time? If 1mm isn't enough just run it through your thingy again. Wasn't it you who told me trying to take too much off in one go is dangerous?"

Me: "Err yeah..."

Friend: "So just limit it to the minimum you need and it will be safer too."

Me: "DOH!" (homer)

Do you want to know why it's REALLY embarrassing? It was a non-woodworker female who freely admits she can't even put up a shelf and that she can never remember what power tools are called (except for a drill)!

 

[CHJ]

As mentioned in a previous post I do not bother with adjustable depth Out Fence. I use the little sample pieces of worktop laminate provided by Wickes etc. as fixed depth packers and drop them behind the fence.
It takes seconds to pass the wood back past the cutter a few extra times if necessary.

 

[Anonymous]

If you are intent on using an inverted router, PLEASE take all the neccesary precautions with regards to your own personal safety and keeping any exposed blade totally inaccesible to your naked fingers.

For obvious reasons, I second that!! :wink: :lol:

 

[engineer one]

nice design for adjustment, and i understand the problem with losing shims.

for those with less mechanical skill, go to a car boot/ machinery sale, and or a real shop, and buy a bearing or hub puller, this will allow you to have similar movement and accuracy without needing too much engineering skill.

even on my planer i only take small slices, not least because until your are finally sizing, the wood will move again, so until it has finally settled, small slices will make it easier to see the shapes.

finally you really do need both a hold down for the vertical, and a feather board for the horizontal holding, just to ensure that the boards stay straight and level, as well as to stop kick back.

paul

 

[Neomorph]

nice design for adjustment, and i understand the problem with losing shims.

for those with less mechanical skill, go to a car boot/ machinery sale, and or a real shop, and buy a bearing or hub puller, this will allow you to have similar movement and accuracy without needing too much engineering skill.

even on my planer i only take small slices, not least because until your are finally sizing, the wood will move again, so until it has finally settled, small slices will make it easier to see the shapes.

finally you really do need both a hold down for the vertical, and a feather board for the horizontal holding, just to ensure that the boards stay straight and level, as well as to stop kick back.

paul

Believe me I'm definately going to be using featherboards, a safety cover and a push stick after reading about Tony's diy surgery attempt.

If you read my Router Table Fence Design thread you will see the design I've done for the safety cover. I've already got the acrylic (nicked from a skip years ago) and all I need is my vice and my hot air blower and I'll be in business. I do find though that you have to go verrrrry slow when cutting out the shape or you end up with the sodding stuff melting on you heh.

I'm going to have a look at that bearing puller you mentioned. I've built my prototype adjuster (pictures to follow) but had to add a couple of L shape metal to the inside to counter possible over-tightening of the T-bolt slides. If I had kept the knobs on the adjuster bracket I wouldn't have had this problem but access was a bit fiddly.