How long should a trend dovetail cutter last ( for stairs )

[ColeyS1]

Hello there,

I've recently started a job which involves making 4 identical flights of small oak stairs. The previous trend cutter (32/11 professional range) had been sent off a couple of times for sharpening so thought i'd use a new cutter for the 4 flights.

After routing 19 treads and risers (about 1.5 strings) , the new cutter broke. Ordered a couple replacements and carried on where i left off. 2 strings later and the sames happened again. I've still got 4.5 strings to route, with only one cutter.

The previous trend cutters i have used, have usually done 3-4 smallish flights, before needing to be sent away to be sharpened. At this rate i'm going to be needing to buy another 2-3 just to finish the job off !!! At 35-40 quid a pop, i'm not keen on doing that :shock:

I cant for the life of me figure out why they keep breaking. I've checked the router speed, checked the collets tight, and am using extraction to clear the shavings. The first one looks like it broke where the cutter part sticks to the shaft.

My question is, has any one else had similar problems with the trend cutters, and would there be a better brand someone could reccomend ? I've noticed titman do the same sized cutter, which would mean i wouldn't need to alter my stair jig.

I was under the impression trend had a good reputation for being quality. Have they suddenly took a nose dive, or do you think there might just be a dodgy batch?

I look forward to your thoughts chaps :wink:

 

[Racers]

Hi, coleysbiscuit

Can't you clean out most of the waste with a straight cutter in several passed and they do the undercut with the dovetail bit? it puts a lot of strain on the bit doing a full depth cut.

And shouldn't this be in thr General Woodworking section?

Pete

 

[Digit]

That's the way I do it, as Pete suggested, not had any such problems. So far!

Roy.

 

[JonnyD]

I was dissapointed when I bought a trend stair housing cutter only lasted a couple of jobs. I now use perform cutters from axminster. They do the same ones as trend as far as i know and costing about £7 a pop they seem to last as well as the trend ones.

cheers

Jon

 

[Keenedge]

I have heard that trend have had their router bits made in Israel for a while now. I think Titman are still made here, I'm backing Britain.

 

[Chems]

Probably the heat build up weaking the bit as well?

 

[cutting solutions]

If the cutter has broken at the bottom of the shank it can often be an indication that bearings are going, old/worn collet or wrong size collet.
The shank doesn't show much sign of it being the collet but I am interested in the black marks at the bottom of the shank.....indicating burning! can you post a couple of more pics with the two halves separate please.
I don't have a Trend catalogue to hand but see they have two cutters "basically" the same. a 32/11x1/2LTC and a 32/11x1/2TC.
I'm not sure what the "L" means. The LTC is £8.00 more!

Aha! just checked the Titman site "L" is the left hand version.

Interestingly the UK made Titman one is also cheaper £45.83 inc Vat against £48.76 for the Trend probably foreign johnny.
I might just know someone who could offer a discount on the Titman price :roll:


Keenedge
You are correct. Trend have sourced a lot of routers from outside the UK for a good few years now.

Doug.

 

[ColeyS1]

Thanks for your thoughts everyone.

Pete, roy, I've only ever used one cutter to do the whole operation in the past without any problems. Is the idea you suggested common practice then? Im going to try a couple of titman bits, if the same happens with them, may have to give your idea a try.

Doug the pic is a little deceiving. The black is just the colour of the cutter. Looks like they've only polished the top part to fit in the collet.

With the last new cutter i've got, just routed 7 housings and it appears to be quite dull already.

Simon

 

[cutting solutions]

Simon
I am intrigued as to why they have left that bit black.
can you still post pics of the broken one. i would like to see as closely as possible the metal structure. It is not uncommon to have metal fatigue.

 

[ColeyS1]

Couldnt get a very clear picture

 

[Digit]

To be honest Simon I do not know if it is common practise or not, what I would say is that when ever I look at a Dovetail bit it always seems to me to be one heck of a cut to take in one pass, especially in a timber like Oak. So I play safe!

Roy.

 

[cutting solutions]

Something has shattered the carbide on both cutters. which means its hit something quite hard. or the carbide was duff.
It looks like (on the right hand cutter in your pic) the metal behind the carbide is damaged too. again suggesting its something hard. you seem pretty good with the pics can you try to post one showing if thats the case....
Were there any knots in the wood?
is it all new timber?

As they have both broken in a very similar place it "COULD" be faulty cutters.

There is no reason why the cutters should not do the job required in one pass.

 

[ColeyS1]

Its all brand new timber, the housings seem to have missed any knots. The first bit came off the cutter and it looks like the other side hit the stray loose bit of metal. i'm beginning to think it must have been a couple dodgy cutters.

The cutter i'm using now, felt a little dull after doing 7 housings. 20 housings later and its still the same. The other 2 seem to deteriorate almost instantly after becoming dull, then leading to breakage. I'll try posting some better pictures later

 

[chippy1970]

Even though I hate Trend machinery I have always bought their router bits and payed their higher prices but perhaps now their bits are going the same way as their machinery has gone, maybe they have gone to a cheaper poorer quality manufacturer to make them, like their routers.

 

[cutting solutions]

Trend predominately used to sell routers made by Titman (but badged as Trend of course).
Some years ago they did a deal with a company called Dimar (Israel owned) and have been selling mainly those routers since.
many people have noticed the change over the years. Still good quality but generally on a price comparison Titman come out tops.

 

[Paul Chapman]

Trend router cutters that I bought in the 1970s were superb (still using some of them) but I've been very disappointed with ones bought in recent times. I've had a few break despite always taking very shallow cuts

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[ColeyS1]

Doug, heres a few more pictures of the broken cutters.

I've finally finished routing all the strings (except the winders)
It must have been just a couple dodgy cutters. The one i'm using now is performing fine - just like the old days

It really knocked me sideways, having 2 cutters break so close together. In panic mode, i rushed and ordered a couple spare titman bits (£31 each) It will be interesting to see what these are like. :roll: Hopefully i wont be needing to try them in the near future.

Fingers crossed, hopefully the cutter will behave when it comes to routing the winders

Simon

 

[MickCheese]

Send them back to Trend. They may be interested for quality control and send you two new ones.

After all they are a reputable firm.

Mick

 

[cutting solutions]

The more I see pics of the cutters the more I believe it looks like you hit something in the cut. Its not impossible to have foreign material buried in the timber.

titman SRC58 x 1/2 @ £31.00?
Inc VAT & delivery?
Bargain 8) ....Well done =D> .....
Someone is giving cutters away for nothing......

 

[JonnyD]

I always get a minium of 20% discount on Titman sometimes 25% if its a lot of stuff through my local dealer. The 20% discount would bring that cutter in at £31ish but excludes the Vat and delivery.

cheers

Jon