Grain orientation of wedges

[memzey]

Hi everyone.

I’m making a coffee table for SWMBO and would like to use wedged through tenons for one aspect of it. I’ve never done these before so would welcome any advice but the thing that I’m looking for specific guidance on is regards the wedges. I’m using contrasting wood in ABW for the tenon and oak for the rail it’s going into and would like to use oak or another light coloured wood for the wedges. So here is my concern: if I orient the wedges so that the visible ends are long grain, I think I end up with a lot of end grain in the joint. If I have the end grain visible, the glue surfaces are long grain to long grain but the wedges will appear darker once a finish is applied, spoiling the contrast somewhat. Any advice on this or am I over thinking it?

Thanks in advance all!

 

[Beau]

You need to have end grain exposed on the end as the wedge would more than likely break if driving it in in any other orientation. Yes it will darken more so chose your contrast wood allowing for this.

 

[mr edd]

I assume you mean African Blackwood ABW? tennon going into oak? or am i being especially dense?

Contrast/timber choice aside accurate production of the wedges driven into the same depth is necessary to achieve the right look as this sort of detail screams out otherwise,
I think both David Charlesworth (check out his benches for through tenon with contrasting wedges)and David Baron have both done articles/ videos respectively.
Apologies if i am barking up the wrong dog

But seriously a quick small scale sample joint would give you all the feedback you need, then if necessary post a photo of it here if you are still undecided to get more directed feedback

All the best Edd

 

[mr edd]

oh and as Beau said try to avoid large amounts of short grain run out in a wedge if poss, when i am making dowels and wedges i tend to split them out (or rive i suppose) to try to get the strongest/best grain orientation before band/hand sawing the wedge, the same applies when making dowels using a dowel plate.

Cheers Edd

 

[marcros]

I assume you mean African Blackwood ABW? tennon going into oak? or am i being especially dense?

Contrast/timber choice aside accurate production of the wedges driven into the same depth is necessary to achieve the right look as this sort of detail screams out otherwise,
I think both David Charlesworth (check out his benches for through tenon with contrasting wedges)and David Baron have both done articles/ videos respectively.
Apologies if i am barking up the wrong dog

But seriously a quick small scale sample joint would give you all the feedback you need, then if necessary post a photo of it here if you are still undecided to get more directed feedback

All the best Edd

I assumed American black walnut. could be either I guess

 

[memzey]

ABW = American Black Walnut. Thanks for the tips everyone. Looks like exposed end grain it is then.

 

[Myfordman]

Once the wedges are fitted and sanded mask off the surrounding ABW and treat the wedges with sanding sealer and let it soak in and dry. Remove mask and give it a light sand with your finest paper. This should help minimise the darkening when you apply the finish.

 

[custard]

The wedges for through tenons should always have the end grain visible, any other orientation risks snapping them off as they're being hammered home.

You can still get plenty of contrast, this is African Blackwood wedges in Elm,

If you want lighter wedges in Oak through tenons, then I'd suggest Boxwood, Sycamore or Maple.

Another issue with wedges in through tenons is you must make sure the orientation of the wedges isn't acting to split the stile pieces, that's a very common error. The wedges should act to bear against end grain on the stile pieces, not against long grain.

Good luck!

 

[memzey]

Thanks again everyone.

I have the orientation of the wedges correct in relation to how the grain of the stile runs. I was just unsure as to how the grain of the wedge itself should run - basically I thought I couldn’t get away with long grain showing but wanted confirmation. The only light coloured wood I have is oak so I shall make do with that for now even though the contrast won’t be quite as sharp as I’d like. I do like box and sycamore but they are rarely stocked at my local places. It will be fine. I’m the only one who will notice these small details anyway!

 

[custard]

I do like box and sycamore but they are rarely stocked at my local places. It will be fine. I’m the only one who will notice these small details anyway!

In cabinet making the small details are everything, plus it's you noticing details and deriving satisfaction from them that makes it all worthwhile!

If you drop me a PM with your address I'll send you some Box/Holly and Blackwood/Ebony off-cuts so you can choose between lighter or darker wedges.

 

[MattRoberts]

Another issue with wedges in through tenons is you must make sure the orientation of the wedges isn't acting to split the stile pieces, that's a very common error. The wedges should act to bear against end grain on the stile pieces, not against long grain.

Good luck!

Custard, would you mind explaining that a bit more please? I created some wedged through tenons in the past and someone mentioned my wedges weren't in the correct orientation (not surprising, as I had no clue what I was doing )

That lovely stool, for example, has the wedges through the top in one direction and through the legs in another?

Cheers

 

[custard]

Hello Matt,

this should help explain it,

The wedges should always be at 90 degrees to the grain direction of the stile piece. If the wedges were running in line with the stile grain they would drive apart the tenon and risk splitting the stile.

I appreciate that a stool seat isn't exactly a stile piece, but the same principle applies, the wedge is at 90 degrees to the direction of grain on the seat, so no matter how hard the wedge is pounded in (or how much the seat subsequently shrinks across the grain) it's not going to split the seat.

 

[MattRoberts]

Ah, so it's about the grain direction of the piece that has the mortise, and not the piece that has the tenon that's the concern? Got it, thanks very much

 

[Brandlin]

Ah, so it's about the grain direction of the piece that has the mortise, and not the piece that has the tenon that's the concern? Got it, thanks very much

Thanks for the explanation custard - i was looking at the tenon grain direction too.
I guess the material of the tenon would split too if it wasn't constrained by the mortise.

 

[memzey]

I do like box and sycamore but they are rarely stocked at my local places. It will be fine. I’m the only one who will notice these small details anyway!

In cabinet making the small details are everything, plus it's you noticing details and deriving satisfaction from them that makes it all worthwhile!

If you drop me a PM with your address I'll send you some Box/Holly and Blackwood/Ebony off-cuts so you can choose between lighter or darker wedges.

I’m always taken aback by the generosity of folk on these boards any you Custard are a prime culprit! Thank you for the very kind offer. I’ll see what I can find myself and get in touch if I draw a blank.