Glue has failed three times this week

[devonwoody]

New bottle of titebond3 purchased on offer from Axminster used to glue the pin box I am making.

First the base sides failed,
Next the lid fell apart at the lamination join
Finally the lid sides wouldn't hold.

Usually this glue is OK to allow pieces to be handled after 30 minutes but this consignment I have, the glue is still tacky after an hour.

I purchased it a short while ago when it was subject of a mail order offer.

Anyone else having trouble?

 

[Philly]

It's not temperature related, is it John?
Philly

 

[devonwoody]

Most probably yes, but I'm bringing it indoors, and the last glue up in the workshop I had a fan heater blowing for an hour, set at over 70f and it was still tacky, so brought it in and I reckon it was 3 hours before it could be handled.

I cant read the batch numbers on the bottle they are in code but there is a figure 7 legible. Might be the expiry date for all I know.

 

[p111dom]

Something I've found with Titebond Origional is mould. The glue up seem fine drying wise and well set after 30mins but and excess squeezed out develops dark green or black spots. Think it's mould at least. Does this mean the glue is off or does the chemical drying process lend itself to mould in the atmosphere?

 

[Paul.J]

Well DW.
The glue i used on my garden bench as failed,which was why i withdrew from the competition.Though i used Bison Polyurethane.
This was made back in the so called summer months :?
Paul.J.

 

[devonwoody]

You will now have to bring it into the kitchen one evening to reglue I'm afraid.
Best time would be when the wife goes to bed early and you say you are staying up to watch Channel 4. :wink:

 

[orangetlh]

Could possible be past its sell by date. Glue will also fail if it had dropped below a certain tempreature in the bottle. If this has happened its probably no good

 

[9fingers]

According to the manufacturer
http://www.titebond.com/IntroPageTB.ASP?UserType=1&ProdSel=ProductLineTB.asp?prodline=94?prodcat=1
The shelf life is only 12 months and it should be applied above 8 degrees centigrade.

Sounds like some heating in the workshop is called for DW

Bob

 

[Paul Chapman]

Sounds like the glue's gone off. If it has, you won't get it back to its original condition, so you might as well throw it away and get some new stuff.

Cheers :wink:

Paul

 

[David C]

If off I would send it back to APTC for replacement. Sometimes the dodgy storage has happened before you recieve it.

My professional friends always do a glue test before commiting to a major job, they once had 5Kilos of cascamite that was off!

Temperature is important, Cascamite manufacturer used to get many calls in the winter due to work being done in unheated/freezing sheds. Glue did not set after a week.......

David

 

[David C]

Dom,

You may be seeing iron stains. I would be very surprised if the issue is mould.

Oxalic acid soln removes iron stains see my book 3 the finishing section.

David

 

[devonwoody]

But if I send it back its even colder weather now so I have gone round in a circle.

So the answer must be to purchase sufficient glue around September to last 12 months.

Also I think the EU overpaid officials should do some work and insist that all coding on products should be understandable to the consumer as well as the trade. :roll:

 

[Paul.J]

The Bison glue i used i knew was over it's sell by date,but it as been fine on interior glue ups,but as failed,in places on the one item which as been stuck outside
I did do a test glue up on 2 bits of Oak,before i made the bench and that was fine.So i just carried on with the build.
All my glue is kept in the house till i need to use it.
I think something must have changed in Cascamite,as i have used really old Cascamite out of a rusty old tin and it was fine,in fact i made a big notice board about 15 years ago and it is still outside today in all weathers,but this new stuff doesn't last long at all.
Just seems a lot of glue as to be thrown away.
Paul.J.

 

[White House Workshop]

I've used nothing but PVA glues for years now and have only had one failure - a post glued across the grain (back in the days when I didn't know what I was doing), but all the other posts are still there! I have two bottles of glue in my workshop - one for indoors use and one for outdoors. That's it. Oh, and a pair of tubes of fast setting Araldite for sticking things onto the surface of the wood (design concepts).

 

[PaulO]

I cant read the batch numbers on the bottle they are in code but there is a figure 7 legible. Might be the expiry date for all I know.

I remembered this thread when I stumbled across the information you need in a Titebond woodglue guide. To decode the lot number you use the first two characters. The first number is the year of manufacture, a 7 means 2007. The second character represents the month, with A being January, B Feb, C March etc.

The information is in the guide here:

http://www.titebonduk.com/downloads/woodglues_guide.pdf

 

[devonwoody]

Thanks for that info.
So my glue was manufactured in July 07. and we hadn't had any weather below 5c when I used it.
This glue is still tacky at 3 hours, so I will give Axminster a call on Monday and see what they have to say.

 

[Digit]

Eh! Silly question, what timber is the box made of?

 

[devonwoody]

Hi Digit.

Br.Mahogany to Br. Mah.
Ash to Br. Mahogany.

Must now be two weeks since box finished and final regluing has worked but takes much longer than the 30 minutes to harden than the previous bottle.

 

[Digit]

I had been wondering if the wood was one of the oily ones, but there shouldn't have been any problem with your choice. I try to leave glued up articles over night and haven't had this problem.

 

[Philly]

John
Just an observation - I notice that you are gluing the ends on. That is a "cross-grain" situation - as the bottom expands or contracts it will crack the joint to the end pieces. Is this where the joints have been giving?
Cheers
Philly