Further adventures in second hand land

[AndyT]

Well then I am in need of some guidance from an experienced sharpener then! Anyone in the St. Albans area willing to show me how it's done? It's probably a bit less interesting but does anyone know the provenance of the Johnson DT saw? I can't quite explain why but it feels really well made. The previous owner must have thought so too as he carved his name in the foot of the handle which you might not do for a lower quality tool?

It's worth repeating that in my opinion the single most thorough YouTube guide to saw sharpening is this video by Andy (Brit) - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u-_MF2Mnxwc&feature=player_embedded.

As for naming tools, apparently it was a condition of the tool insurance given by trades unions that all tools had to be marked with the owner's name - so people would have marked all their tools, not just their best ones.

 

[Cheshirechappie]

+1 to Andy's recommendation of the saw sharpening Youtube video. There's a lot of information about the subject on the interwebs, but that video brings it all together comprehensively and accessably. (Saw sharpening isn't really all that difficult, but it does need the gathering of a few bits of specialist kit - suitable saw vice and files, basically - and a bit of practice. It's worth starting on a rip saw with largish teeth, since there are fewer angles to worry about, then move on to larger-toothed crosscuts, and leave smaller teeth until a bit of confidence is built up. Results improve markedly after about ten saws or so, by which time the skill is embedded - you'll never forget, just get better.)
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Back to Robert Sorby and his tool-making firm. A correction to information presented earlier - the firm was first registered in 1828, not 1860 as I stated. That fits nicely with the shape of the earlier Sorby chisel; it must date from a time between the registering of the firm, and their adoption of the Kangaroo trademark (a date for the registering of which I haven't tracked down yet). So the chisel is 1830's, '40's, '50's or thereabouts.

There's a long Sorby family history write-up on the Robert Sorby website - http://www.robert-sorby.co.uk/companyinfo.htm - convoluted, but interesting.

 

[memzey]

As for naming tools, apparently it was a condition of the tool insurance given by trades unions that all tools had to be marked with the owner's name - so people would have marked all their tools, not just their best ones.

Here is another pic of the Johnson after I have cleaned it up a bit:


Can you see it has these two pins under the nuts in the handle? Do you think it would have come from the factory like that or is it a user modification? I haven't seen this feature before so am unsure?

 

[AndyT]

Hi Memzey, that's a really nice job on the dovetail saw. There's a useful checklist of saw makers at backsaw.net and this link should lead you to the page with several Johnsons on
http://backsaw.net/index.php?option...fabriklayout=default&Itemid=69&limitstart=500

I have no idea which of these might have made your saw, but I think you can safely describe it as "quite old".

I've never seen pins like yours has, but I've not seen many old saws. My guess is that they were an owner's clever way of fixing a loose handle without messing things up by trying to remove it - a neat idea!

 

[Harbo]

It's a very similar looking saw to my Mansell - made in the Wallace Steel Works, Furnival Street?

Rod

 

[Bod]

As for naming tools, apparently it was a condition of the tool insurance given by trades unions that all tools had to be marked with the owner's name - so people would have marked all their tools, not just their best ones.

Here is another pic of the Johnson after I have cleaned it up a bit:


Can you see it has these two pins under the nuts in the handle? Do you think it would have come from the factory like that or is it a user modification? I haven't seen this feature before so am unsure?

I think from the position of the saw nuts, and the uncorroded area in front of the handle, that a different handle has been fitted, in the distant past. Hence the metal dowels, probably done by an engineer rather than a woodworker.

Bod

 

[bugbear]

I think from the position of the saw nuts, and the uncorroded area in front of the handle, that a different handle has been fitted, in the distant past.
Bod

Ooh, well spotted. Agreed. (in hindsight...)

BugBear

 

[memzey]

Hi Bod. Actually I think the lack of corrosion immediately before the handle is more a function of the clumsy way I cleaned the blade up rather than anything to do with the saw itself but I can see why it may appear otherwise.

Andy - thanks for the link above. Every time I click on view against a particular manufacturer it tells me that form is not published. Do you see the same error?

 

[Harbo]

Here is Furnival Street in its "heyday" and as it's now

And here's my Mansell

Rod

 

[AndyT]

Andy - thanks for the link above. Every time I click on view against a particular manufacturer it tells me that form is not published. Do you see the same error?

I always get the same and could never make the Search function work either. I guess old saws are more interesting than IT problems and are absorbing all the available effort of the handful of specialists who make that useful site available.

 

[memzey]

Hi everyone. I hate to drag up an old thread like this but I wanted to share this with you and ask for an opinion from one the many sages we have here. I recently de-gunked three old oil stones I picked up at boot fairs using the old soak overnight in some petrol trick and one of them (the one I chipped) came up a markedly different colour to the others:



Would anyone care to hazard a guess to what type of stone it is? It is a light brownish/orangey affair in the flesh, the same grit both sides and by orders of magnitude smoother/finer than the finer sides of either of the two combination stones I also have. As I previously mentioned it is almost glass like.

 

[G S Haydon]

I'd say it's a fine India.

 

[memzey]

Thanks GS. Whenever I have used it I've noticed that the oil kind of beads on top of it rather than penetrating in if you know what I mean. Is that consistent with a fine India stone?

 

[MIGNAL]

Don't know. I have an Orange Norton stone but I don't think the Oil beads up. They must come in various colours because I have a double sided one that is more of a sandy/brown colour - on the finer side.

 

[matthewwh]

That gorgeous boxwood spokeshave may come into its own if you decide to make new handles for any of the chisels.

 

[adrspach]

The chipped oils tone is Norton India most likely made in Welwyn Garden City (Next to B&Q). Commonly the grit is in medium to fine range of woodworkers sharpening.

 

[memzey]

Thanks adr. WGC is quite close to where I live so that's a coincidence. I don't have too much experience of oil stones but I'd be very surprised if this was not at the very fine end of the spectrum especially given how it compares with the other stones' fine sides. Does anyone have any tips on trueing these stones up? I have tried rubbing on 80g and 120g paper glued to a flat mdf board but it is slow going. If I had a belt sander I'd probably use that but I don't. I do have a ROS and a finishing sander though. Would that work?

 

[Racers]

Sand on a paving stone is the usually recommended method.

Pete

 

[bugbear]

Sand on a paving stone is the usually recommended method.

Pete

Along with a very great deal of labour!

BugBear

 

[memzey]

It's the labour I'm trying to avoid! Is there a quicker method people can recommend?