File Types

[paulm]

Contemplating getting a couple of Nicholson files and a couple of rasps from Workshop Heaven, primarily for shaping saw handles and other similar uses, but a bit confused as to whether the single cut or double cut files would be best for these kind of applications on hardwoods ?

Any thoughts appreciated !

Cheers, Paul.

 

[engineer one]

as an engineer Ha ha :lol: :twisted: i would not think to cut wood of any sort with a file like a nicholson, rather by some cheap and nasty ones
for instance like those sold at time by lidl or maybe aldi.

rather use a rasp, or indeed one of those japanese ones that axminster sell.

actually i don't know how mike w does them, but i would drill, jigsaw, and then finish with spindle sanders after maybe routing the actual shape.
that way you don't need the files.

not sure if it helps :?

paul :wink:

 

[Alf]

I'm bound to get this the wrong way round, but iirc single cut will cut smoother but slower, whereas double cut is quicker but not quite as clean. Either way if they're saw files are anything to go by I wouldn't necessarily rush to get Nicholson's... fwiw I use double cut Swiss ones after considerable rasp work but follow up with many stages of abrasive use (yes, sometimes powered - shoot me ) - seems to work okay.



Cheers, Alf

 

[Philly]

Paul
I use smooth files for finishing chamfers in hardwoods, as well as other fine tweaking work. They cut amazingly well and very cleanly - try a 10 inch one and see what you think.
Oh, and the smaller the file length, the finer the teeth - regardless of the cut of the file.
Hope this helps
Philly

 

[dunbarhamlin]

For the mother of all threads file-and-rasp-worthy, try this Woodnet thread - heaps of fine info, especially from a fellow called Slav Jelesijevich

I have a couple of the Chinese rasps from Matthew at Workshop Heaven - excellent for the price, though an intermediate step between these and final surface prep is likely to be required (so the rasp/file combo may be just the ticket - I haven't used files for this myself)

Cheers
Steve

 

[paulm]

Thanks everybody, I have my finger hovered over the send button on Workshop Heaven as we speak.......

Wanted to get the rasps from there as recommended on another thread and, although getting the fine rasps figured I might need a file or two as the next step before abrasives on the saw handles and made sense to get them same place and minimise the p&p I guess, unless someone knows a better place to get both.

Not sure what you mean about "smooth files" Philly, do you mean that generically shock: :lol: ) or do you mean single as opposed to double cut ? :?

Like you say Alf, I can imagine one cuts smoother and one faster, but could probably imagine a case for each way round so not sure which is which ?!!!

Cheers, Paul,

 

[Philly]

Paul
Take a look at these..
Cheers
Philly

 

[engineer one]

hi another paul here goes. from myninth edition of machinery's handbook,
dated 1934. 1600 pages of anything you never wanted to know about engineering and tools, plus logs, nut and bolt data, hardening of metals
and tons more ,

rough files are usually single cut, whilst "dead smooth" are double cut.
the great thing about files is that you can use the term "turnip" in the nicest possible way :twisted: :lol:

in general, single cut files have their teeth cut at between 65and 85 degrees, whilst double cut are have one row at 40-45 degrees and the second row at 70-80 degrees, however the double cut finishing files
have a 30degree and an 80-87 degree second row.

the other thing to remember with flat files is that you can get them in about four forms. teeth all four sides., three sides and two side.
then you can have flat files as well as those with a taper to the end.

whilst i agree with philly, i wonder whether it is better to use wood tools to deal with the arrises etc??

paul :wink:

 

[paulm]

double posted by mistake !

 

[paulm]

Thanks for the further info guys.

Got to page 4 Steve before I admitted defeat !

Think I managed to figure that double cut is a finer cut than single but presumably slower as a result, but how fine compared to a fine rasp...... :? :roll:

Deep breath and will get a fine rasp and a double cut file as a transition and then hope abrasives will do it from there. Can always try some more later if needed I guess.

Now got to find some nice exotic hardwood for saw handles.........

Cheers, Paul.

 

[DomValente]

I'm bound to get this the wrong way round, but iirc single cut will cut smoother but slower, whereas double cut is quicker but not quite as clean. Either way if they're saw files are anything to go by I wouldn't necessarily rush to get Nicholson's... fwiw I use double cut Swiss ones after considerable rasp work but follow up with many stages of abrasive use (yes, sometimes powered - shoot me ) - seems to work okay.



Cheers, Alf

Huh would you believe it I have that identical saw.
Thank you Al.
Well you started it

 

[Philly]

Paul (Eng One!)
Files work great with the denser exotics - they ARE wood tools if you use them so :wink:
Cheers
Philly

 

[engineer one]

cheers philly i suppose after all those years using them on metals and having problems with aluminium choking the files it is a personal reaction.

actually some time ago we used to work with some of the other woods like lignum, and you are right, files work well.
:?
paul :wink:

 

[paulm]

After all that agonising the Nich' files are only supplied by WH in double cut for the type I wanted so double cut it will have to be !!!

Thanks all.

Cheers, Paul.

 

[Harbo]

Following the expert advice from this forum I bought a couple of rasps from W H and excellent value they are.
I also bought a couple of Dick's cheapo Chinese ones and they are good value too. (but mainly to get a copy of their superb catalogue!) have a look at the "Schwertfisch Cabinet Special at 5.50 Euros
I would steer towards the finer grades as the coarse and even medium ones are very aggressive.
Using them I made a replacement plane tort in no time at all.

Rod

 

[bugbear]

Using them I made a replacement plane tort in no time at all.

Rod

no pictures = didn't happen

BugBear

 

[Harbo]

Well I am afraid I did it - photo to prove it !
The one in front is the replica based on a posted closed tort pdf - the one behind is an original Mathieson I acquired later.
The third one is a Salmen.
Tight curves drilled out as in Alf's thread - the rest by bandsaw.
I stained the beech rosewood which is not a good match and coated with Danish Oil - perhaps should have tried a shinier finish but I was not after perfection as the plane is a bit beat up!
I made it out of laminated beech (3 layers) as I did not have any thick enough.

Also photos of my rasps - the WH ones are a 7, 6 & 5

handles on the Dick's from Axminster
Dick's Chinese Rasps including the long thin Cabinet Special.

The handles on the Dick's were from Axminster - the WH ones come ready fitted.

Rod

 

[woodbloke]

Paul (Eng One!)
Files work great with the denser exotics - they ARE wood tools if you use them so :wink:
Cheers
Philly

Interestingly, James Krenov uses files for certain jobs (iirc he uses a file to smooth of the end of dovetail pins) - Rob