Dining table leg constuction

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fobos8

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Hello all

I'm gonna make a oak dining table in about a month and so I' just checking out a few things before I start.

I've read a couple of posts of table projects where woodworkers have made say 4x4 leg by laminating 4 pieces of 4x1.

Why not just use a piece of 4x4 in the first place?

Why is it common to make the legs by laminating and are there any disadvantages to use 3x3 or 4x4 for legs?

Thanks in advance, Andrew
 
Andrew,

There would be a couple of good reasons that I can think of for laminating the legs. Firstly, thicker pieces of timber are possibly more prone to being incompletely seasoned, and thus to movement and possible cracking. Secondly, everything else on the table is going to be made from 1" or 1-1/4" boards, so why buy a massive amount of 4" stock just to make the 4 legs from?

As an aside, and probably entirely irrelevant, a laminated leg is likely to be stronger than one made from a single solid piece.

Mike
 
Another reason for building an oak leg out of 4 pieces of timber is so that you could have the medullary rays visible on all faces.
 
Thanks for the replies

I'd like to make the legs from 4x4 if possible. Whats the worst that could happen?

If they twisted a little or split a little for me it would give them a bit of character.

Is it a no no to make them out of one solid piece of 4x4?

If I make them out of one piece do I need to make sure the oak is seasoned properly?

Best regards, Andrew
 
thanks for the reply mike

next question is how do I make sure the oak is well seasoned?

What do I look for or what question do I ask the timber supplier?

Cheers, Andrew
 
Basically, you're looking for oak which has been air-dried or kiln-dried, assuming you can find 4in. thick stock, of course. Green or unseasoned oak is what you should avoid, at all costs! If you're buying English oak (generally sold with one if not two waney-edges) then the moisture content will almost certainly be higher than the equivalent of imported oak (European or North American)... You could be looking at somewhere between 14-18%, depending on how well the wood's been stored and how long it's been lying around for.

With furniture going in to a home with central-heating, you ideally want a moisture content of 10-12% before you start machining. This can mean stacking the wood indoors for several weeks, checking with a half-decent moisture meter, every so often.

Buying 4in. oak is going to be expensive, as you'll probably have to buy a full length, from which you could cut a lot more than four table legs! You could look at your cutting list and, if your looking for rails at a sawn size of 4"x1", for instance, you could try to get these from the same length of 4in. oak, instead of buying more 1in. boards... But, this is a more expensive way to do it and there is the risk of unleashing stress from inside the timber (wood often has a higher moisture content inside, particularly with thicker timbers).

You could try laminating them from 1in. boards but, you've either got to join for lengths together with perfect 45° mitres down both edges or, unless you can get a perfect grain match, you'll need to veneer over the two faces (carefully!) to hide the joints and glue lines. The choice is yours.

Really, a moisture meter is what you need to determine whether or not your timber is ready to work with. Even if it's vastly over-sized, I'd be reluctant to starting ripping rough components out until the m/c is closer to 14% - I made this mistake a few months back with some beech and it split quite badly! :? Oak is more stable but, at more than £50/ft³, it's not worth the risk! I have access to a decent moisture meter at college for now. I did own a cheap one (£20) but, it wasn't terribly accurate and is now destined for the bin!

Unless there's a forum member closer who could lend you a meter then I'd suggest you look through some old posts in the Buying Advice forum, where the subject of 'moisture meters' came up over the summer. :)
 
4x4 will be very expensive and I'd put money on it cracking or shaking somewhere on it's length at some point, fine if you don't mind a more rustic look, not if you don't.

I'm doing a chair at the minute and the legs will be 4 pieces mitred together to ensure I have medullary rays all round
 
This is a very interesting thread so why not more input from forum members????

I can see all the points raised for not using solid, but there are manufacturers out there in production using solid timber this thick.
So how do they get away with it??

What's expensive??? £200..£300 for the leg timber....whatever it is it will be proportional to the finished price if you bought one complete for £3000 or more????

My timber supplier only kiln dries up to 2 inches. Above that thickness it's air dried. According to him you can only extract a certain amount of moisture from a certain thickness using kiln drying then it's not effective,but he says the legs aren't the problem, it's the top that will generally split if the moisture content isn't quite right......
But they manage in USA making furniture in the Arizona desert, and shipping to say New York where the climate is so different??

I think there is more to this subject to be honest and I have to say there isn't much about it on the web.
Maybe it's about getting a sealer on the timber after drying /machining and to prevent moisture coming out and moisture getting in????

There must be someone out there that knows how to make 4 inch table legs from solid that will be stable after they are made??

Just as a thought there was a programe on TV where the curator of a large country home was being interviewed.
During the discussions he was asked how they prevented damage to the tables in the house. He told them that during the summer and also less frequently during winter, all the windows were opened to compensate for the central heating and prevent splitting and movement.......
He had not had a holiday for 25 years!!!!!!!

Mikee
 
Many thanks for all the thorough replies.

I will phone up the timber supplier to find out what lengths 4x4 comes in, where it comes from, moisture content etc. Oh yes and cost too verses 4x1.

All the best, Andrew
 
I suspect the cost of 4" stock will be enough to put you off, if you can even find it properly seasoned/dried.

Carefully laminated, or edge jointed into a box, you can make a 4" leg out of 1" material that no-one will ever know is not a single piece.

Ed
 
British hardwoods and John boddys both sell these-
oak-squares-4.jpg
in Oak and at various lengths. The drilled hole is supposed to stop the shakes and faults common when drying thicker timber.

HTH
 
Mattty":1fv60zee said:
British hardwoods and John boddys both sell these-
oak-squares-4.jpg
in Oak and at various lengths. The drilled hole is supposed to stop the shakes and faults common when drying thicker timber.

HTH

I was just about to mention that!

Although I've never come across them, I've heard of timber suppliers that stock 3" and 4" square stock that has a hole bored all the way through the centre. In which case they only have to dry the wood as if they were drying 2" stock, as the moisture can escape through the centre hole also.

It's just a case of finding a supplier now.

Cheers

Aled
 
A little while ago I started making a dining table in AWO. The legs were laminated from three pieces, to give a finished thickness of about 3 1/2". I didn't like the look of it one bit - it looked like an Ikea table leg.

I'm going to be picking the project up again in the next few weeks, and will be re-doing the legs from two laminations of 2" stock.

Cheers

Karl
 
Karl":1ysbykgq said:
I'm going to be picking the project up again in the next few weeks, and will be re-doing the legs from two laminations of 2" stock.
l


Why not cut some thin veneer out of wider stock to cover the 2 side laminations of each leg? Or go all around and have the grain follow. Will save the timber and look good to boot.
 
Tom - I had thought about laminating a veneer onto the side pieces, but i've got another use for the timber used in the legs, which will be ripped down on the bandsaw.

Cheers

Karl
 
The planes for the chair I'm making suggest using thinnish veneers re-sawn from your leg timber to cover the join in a 2 piece lamination. I'm going for the 4 piece mitre, though there is of course much more scope for cock up with this method
 
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