Cutting thick, old oak using band saw?

[brynmaxwell]

I propose buying a 20” throat secondhand band saw to cut a quantity of old railway sleepers into 4 x 2 x 15 inch lengths for use as sleepers on a steam garden railway (hopefully about 60 per sleeper). I’m looking to use oak as it will rot slower, but old oak is hard and I’m wondering if the blade will blunt rapidly. Anyone had experience of cutting aged 10 x 6 inch oak with a band saw?

Max

 

[Corset]

Don,t know much about trains but seems a shame to chop mice oak into sleepers. Stuff that size would be lovely to have and make some furniture with.
Owen

 

[ByronBlack]

wouldn't it be easier and cheaper to buy reclaimed oak flooring or even one of the billets of oak that is often going for cheap on ebay, these will be much more in tune with the sizes you need and easier to work with.

How do you propose to lift a sleeper and feed it into a bandsaw? Thats some heavy/difficult work!

 

[Newbie_Neil]

Hi Max

Welcome to the forum.

You would also need to be aware of nails etc. in sleepers.

Cheers,
Neil

 

[Scrit]

Hi Max

Have you come across these people? They sell mini railway sleepers. May be cheaper than tyrying to convert your own

Otherwise if you have a big enough saw you'll find that, in my experience at least, TCT, stellite-tipped or bi-metallic blades bimetallic blades all last a lot longer than carbon steel (providing you buy a saw capable of handling them) and they won't tend to overheat and lose their edge. A hook tooth blade with low pitch (1.5 to 4tpi) will work best. Fine pitch blades just clog up, overheat and jam on deep sawing of thick and potentially slightly damp materials

Scrit

 

[brynmaxwell]

You can buy them by the lorry load, but doubt many would suit furniture making. Most are used in landscaping - raised flowerbeds etc - more criminal than my intended use! :x

 

[Taffy Turner]

Hi Max

Have you come across these people? They sell mini railway sleepers. May be cheaper than trying to convert your own
Scrit

Crikey Scrit - where do you find all this stuff????? :shock:

I stand in awe!!!!

Gary

 

[beech1948]

I have recently cut some tenons (4"x3" x 8" long) on the end of a 6"x6"X12' piece of pine using my bandsaw.

EStimated weights were about 100 to 120 kg per pine baulk thats about 18-20 stones per piece of wood..it was a bit wet also so adding to weight. It was a two man lift and a two man job to fiddle and adjust the baulk to the right place and position.

I had to use two very large supports with roller tops to feed into the bandsaw and if I had been cutting through it into strips I would have needed two more at least on the outfeed.

It can be done but even with these supports there were slight issues with the material rocking, lifting it to move into the blade and then providing a slight push against a dead weight.

Worked out OK...chewed up one blade in cutting 16 of these...due to the problems of backing out the blade..not really recommended.

If you do it perhaps better to cut sleeper into 15" lengths ( I think you said that) first and then cutting each one...that would be quite easy to do.
regards
alan

 

[brynmaxwell]

Sorry, I'm getting a bit behind the thread!

scrit. Mini sleepers might be easier to handle, but are still approx 10 x 5 inchs. I need sleepers (and lots of them) 4 x 2 inchs 15 inchs long. Can you get TCT band saw blades or are you referring to circular saw teeth?

Max

 

[ByronBlack]

Does it have to be Oak? Couldn't tanalised 2x4's be suitable? A lot easier to cut to size.. and could be stained to match? Just throwing out idea's here ..

 

[Scrit]

Crikey Scrit - where do you find all this stuff????? :shock:

I needed to find somewhere that did oak sleepers for a house I did some joinery work on 4 or 5 years back and I was put onto them by someone in the trade as being one of the few that did 'em. The rest is just retentive memory (or dustbin mind syndrome :lol: )

Can you get TCT band saw blades or are you referring to circular saw teeth?

You certainly can - try for Lennox Trimaster (better than Symonds). If you PM me location I'll ask the Lennox rep wh your local stockist is - alternatively I've got a local supplier up here who carries Trimaster band stock stock and makes-up to order. The alternative might just be a few Dakin-Flathers Ripper blades - shorter life but much cheaper

If you are going to saw these yourself as beech says it will require manpower, a roller table (a couple of lengths of s/hand industrial roller track should do - try Williamsons in Oldham if you can't find any elsewhere) and a substantial machine (possibly something like a 24in wheel job or larger). This is the sort of job where it might be easier to find a local sawmill with a Robinson or Stennor power resaw to handle the sawing

Scrit

 

[Scrit]

Does it have to be Oak? Couldn't tanalised 2x4's be suitable? A lot easier to cut to size.. and could be stained to match? Just throwing out idea's here ..

You can't stain tanalised until it's been out of the kiln for 3 to 6 months

Scrit

 

[ByronBlack]

You can't stain tanalised until it's been out of the kiln for 3 to 6 months

Scrit

No problem, just use my local timber merchant, they age their wood by how thick the mould is so all tanalised stuff must be atleast a year old

 

[brynmaxwell]

Thanks guys for all the input.

I decided on old sleepers because they’re available in oak (and therefore less susceptible to rot) and should work out cheaper (colour doesn’t matter). Sleepers the right size are available off the shelf, but they’re expensive – over £1 each and I need LOTS, whereas using full size sleepers cut to size I reckon they should work out at around 30p.

I’ve been offered a band saw with 24” wheels (20” throat) cheap, but it’s old VERY old. Presumably saw bands have not changed over time, so a modern band with hardened teeth will fit?

Max

 

[OLD]

I have found dragon saws very good just have a look through the info and contact them for advice and a quote they will do a buy it now .
ebay link

 

[RayUK]

Why not use cheap oak offcuts and use Potassium Permanganate on them - they'll look old enough I reckon. (but i reckon the idea of a 20" bandsaw is temptation enough)

 

[beech1948]

Hi,
If yuor going to get a s/h bandsaw then you need to check,
1) Wheels are co-planar
2) Upper and lower guides are functional or can be easily made functional
3) Dust collection..there will be a lot of fine dust
4) For the amount you need I would use a standard 3/4 or possibly 1 inch blade with 2 or 3 skip teeth per inch...I would only go to Stellite etc if you have many hundreds to do. Blades from Duredge ( see other posts in forum) would be good or from Dragon.
5) Make sure that Bandsaw has no obvious misalignments, if its old and cast iron they are great but can take a long time to refurbish.

regards
Alan

 

[iajon69]

I would be a bit wary of using a TCT blade on old sleepers just in case there's any nails or hard objects in the sleepers that you can't see. TCT bandsaws are expensive and can be easily damaged if you hit a nail.
Hard tooth carbon blades are ok but you won't get a great blade life cutting Oak sleepers.
M42 Bi-metal blades would be better as they are a lot cheaper than TCT not much more expensive than the hard tooth rippers and have a great blade life as well. If your machine can handle a 1" M42 blade then there's a 2/3 vari-tooth blade available that should do the job.

personally I'd take scrit's advice and find a local sawmill with a big re-saw and get them to do the job.

Ian

 

[brynmaxwell]

Alan. My knowledge of band saws is almost zero (other than they’re machines to treat with caution). What does co-planar mean (aligned?) and what dictates the width of blade that can be used – wheel width or will any blade width fit? It is a very old machine – about the turn of the century - but made of cast iron. Big attraction for intended job is throat size and price.

I hear what’s being said about nails, but being old sleepers I doubt there being much risk of hidden nails.

Max

 

[beech1948]

Hi,
Turn of century ....so I suppose all cast iron. Look for cracks or repair welds in the base, arm reaching from table to top wheel and around the top wheel frame and case. If cracked then leave it alone as a repair is difficult and potentially expensive. Once cracked then all sorts of alignment diffulties become apparent.

Co-planar refered to the top and bottom wheels being in the same plane. Essential so that they can acccurately track and run a blade a 90 degrees to the table. Best way to check is to use a 6ft level, open both doors, remove table if necessary and lay level on both wheels....bubbles in level will show any misalignment. Then look for the adjustment points on top wheel and see if they are free...or look easy to free up.

Check guides....probably just wooden blocks or metal triangles...if wooden blocks then you can easily replace if metal triangles then you will need to judge if they can be cleaned up or flattened and reused, Not a big job but a bit time consuming. Have a look at top guides thrust arrangements also...often they were just a hard metal rod that could be adjusted back and to to fit blade size.

Turn of century probaly had no dust collection.

Try to see if there are any seized bearings...but you should be able to get new ones cheaply from modern bearing suppliers.....you might have an issue with pressing them out and back in but look at any car repair manual to see ways to do this.

Do you know what make it is and or a model number. Is it working now and being used recently.

regards
Alan