Curved Door

[OPJ]

Hi guys,

I've been working on a key cabinet, made from white and brown oak (something like the drawing below, with dovetailed corners).

You've hopefully noticed :wink: that the cabinet has a slight curve to its front. It's not much but, I think it's enough to add interest. Anyway. I've already done the easy stuff - assembling the carcase and making the drawer with curved front! 8) Now, I'm looking at how to construct the curved door...

Rails will be laminated from thin strips I've already cut on my bandsaw, and then bent around a former. But, do you have any suggestions for grooving these rails, so I can fit a panel inside? They're only about 32mm wide x 16mm thick (not enough to balance a router on top). I have thought of trimming the middle veneers or setting them back to effectively create a groove but, I know these things may well slide once the cramps go on.

If at all possible, I'd like the curved panel to also have a raised and fielded look front the front! :shock: Best way I've come up with would be to glue a sheet of 4mm MDF inside the 16mm thick frame. Then, form the detail on a flat lump of oak and, seeing as I now have a bandsaw man enough for the job; rip <6mm off each face and glue these directly on to the MDF panel.

What do you think?

Hopefully, I've made it all clear...

Thanks for your help,

Olly.

 

[SketchUp Guru]

Nice work. You just need to do something with the top of the sides where they overlap the top.

As to your panel construction, how about if you make the three layers as you say but laminate them together over a form. Make it so the raising extends into the groove as in a traditional flat door. I think it'll be easier than trying to cut the panel to fit exactly in the door frame open.

 

[rileytoolworks]

Olly, I make doors like these almost weekly for kitchens.
The way I groove them is as follows...
I bend the laminations in a male/female former. When they're dry I clean up and square/size the edges.
The rails on my doors are 24mm thick.
I use a 16mm GB and a 6mm cutter in a router.
Clamp the rails back in the formers and run the guide bush against the female edge of the former, giving a groove which is 7mm back from the front edge.
Obviously the GB/cutter combination and depth of cut would need adjusting for your stock.
Hope this helps, and good luck.
P.S. Will you be doing through tenons as in your picture?

One more tip.... Draw a full sized rod to take your angles off.

Adam

 

[mailee]

Just what Adam said. I almost did the same on my curved door although I bent it in the vacuum bag. I just cut a curve into some scrap timber of the same thickness and double sided taped them down to the bench top. I then used the router with a fence to cut the slot. :wink:

 

[OPJ]

Thanks for your replies.

Dave, that is initially what I was intending to do. I just thought I might be able to save some work, as the former would only need to be large enough for the rails. 4mm MDF should be flexible enough to slot in without bending, first.

I don't actually think it would be that difficult to cut a panel to drop directly in to a recess - besides, there's always a shadow line... :wink: Though, the oak either side of the MDF may still want to expand and contract? These would be between 4-6mm thick, unlike your standard veneered MDF sheets.

Thanks to Adam and Mailee for you thoughts on how to cut the grooves - good thinking. :wink:

Adam, they won't be through tenons; that was just my initial sketch, as with the corners of the cabinet, which should be dovetailed.

Do you have any tips for gluing and cramping the curved rails in to the the stiles?

 

[mailee]

Not sure if this is of any help Olly but this is the technique I used for mine. I have some of the Dakota bessy type clamps and I reversed two of them to expand first. I then placed the glued up frame with the concave surface downwards on the bench. I then put a little pressure on the centre of each rail using the clamps braced on the rafters of my workshop. (Just light pressure to stop it spreading) I then used a couple of tapered blocks at each end of the frame and clamped on these. (Just applying enough pressure to close up the joint) I hope this is clear as it is a little hard to describe for me. :wink:

 

[rileytoolworks]

Mailee, that technique sonds interesting!
Olly, unfortunately I use ANOTHER jig, which cradles the door and allows one to apply pressure to the edge of one stile whilst the other sits against a stop.
Bear in mind though that I work in a large workshop for a large company and produce these almost weekly.
For a one off, or the small workshop, I'd try to find ways to do this all with fewer jigs.
I really like the idea of Mailees. Just make sure not to 'flare' the door too much.

Good luck and let us know how you get on.

Adam.

 

[OPJ]

Thanks again, guys, that's given me something to think about. :-k

In the mean time, I made a couple of mistakes on the cabinet the other week...

First up, I set this shelf back from the front edge when I should have made it flush! I don't know why I did this... :roll: I was going to use it to divide the space between the bottom door rail and top of the drawer but, now, I reckon I'll have to fit the door so it covers it.

I don't fancy trying to gluing a lipping on to bring it forwards; even a contrasting bit of brown oak. Purely because it might look naff and matching that curve neatly to get a good glue joint would be a right PITA.

...That may actually benefit the design!

More critically, I made an even bigger mistake when cutting the dovetails and didn't realise until it was much too late. The back edges are grooved to accept a back panel yet, for some reason, I cut this section off of both rear bottom corners! :x

Whatever I try to do, it's going to be tricky getting a decent grain match. So, I wonder whether it would be better to cut a piece of brown oak and just given the appearance of a wider pin? This piece is going in to an exhibition in July so, it does matter!

It's all oak and brown oak throughout. I've also made a framed back panel but haven't properly photographed it yet.

 

[rileytoolworks]

Olly, have you got any more brown oak? If it were me, and I had enough, I think I'd remake the bottom.
With regards to the drawer, don't forget that now you're going to have to open the door enough for the trailing edge of the hinge stile to clear the path of the drawer front. Not a problem, just an observation.

Quality work so far, and I respect the fact that you've shared your 'mistakes'.
Many would hide them (probably me included!)

Adam.

 

[clewlowm]

you f ucked it proper. bin it and start again. if you are going to show this piece? can you afford not to re make it.

 

[rileytoolworks]

Bloody hell Clewlown. Don't hold back mate, say what you're really thinking... :shock:

 

[clewlowm]

sorry. did not mean to offend. its just if the piece is meant to be special. it should be re made.

 

[jhwbigley]

sorry. did not mean to offend. its just if the piece is meant to be special. it should be re made.

I think the big C is right on that if its for show it's got to be spot on.

we all know you can do a good job Ollie!


Dovetails are easy

JH

 

[OPJ]

you f ucked it proper. bin it and start again. if you are going to show this piece? can you afford not to re make it.

Bloody hell! :shock: While you do have a point, you're message doesn't come across very well! I'm glad I don't work for you and I hope you don't speak to your clients like that!

I'm not prepared to bin all this oak. Some of it's quite nice and I'm not sure I have enough brown oak spare to remake the top and base. Gluing another piece of brown oak in there should actually work quite well - it will mirror the joints at the top of the cabinet, where the same pin is wider to accommodate the groove (I may photo it later, if that isn't clear). :wink:

How often would a member of the public closely examine a piece like this? I'd expect my tutors to pick up on it but, as it's on the back, I bet no-one else would notice unless I pointed it out! :wink: I'm also pleased with the back panel I've made, which should draw some attention away from the joints, anyway.

If this was a commissioned piece, I may consider re-making the whole thing though, I should've have noticed this much sooner, anyway... Or, at least drawn the joints out fully in SketcUp, first of all...

 

[rileytoolworks]

Lesson learned mate. If YOU'RE happy to continue, then go for it. As you say, I doubt it'll be noticeable to the UN trained eye.

Clewlown I was only mocking mate.

Adam.

 

[clewlowm]

please do not take it as an insult! i do not speak to my clients that way? but if i am not happy with any of my work. it goes in the fire pile. you should have one standard! if you are not happy with it? then bin it.