Convert a lever handle to a twin push-button on a close coupled toilet?

[Yorkieguy]

I wonder if there are any plumbers out there who can answer a question for me?

i have a close-coupled toilet which is about 30 years old. Along with the sink taps the toilet handle is gold, and looking decidedly old-fashioned, so I'm converting them to chrome. While I'm at it, I though that rather than just replace the toilet lever handle, I'd convert it to a dual-flush push-button. However, a plumber friend has said that the hole in the ceramic cistern where the lever handle is, isn't large enough to fit a push button unit. (It's approx 20mm diam).

I've looked at a couple of youtube videos and as far as I can see, the toilet cisterns are just like mine, but none of the kits state the actual dimeter of the push button unit which has to go through the cistern and secured with a nut. No-one seems to stock the lever to push-button conversion kit, and I don't want to have the hassle of buying something online that I have to return.

At about 7.30 mins in, this 2019 video appears to show that the threaded part which goes through the hole, is quite small (20mm diam?), and has a spacer on the outside (which wouldn't be needed for say a 40mm diam hole), so would fit my cistern:

https://www.google.com/search?sca_e...ate=ive&vld=cid:7c5d245f,vid:Q6G-s2fAvro,st:0

Likewise, in this video from 2014, at 4mins 35 secs it seems to confirm that:

https://www.google.com/search?q=con...ate=ive&vld=cid:a4a29faf,vid:T-WPaiLsMDU,st:0

Any advice would be welcome, and a recommendation of source a suitable conversion kit, even better!

I've attached a couple of pics showing the existing handle arrangement.

Thanks for reading.

David.

 

[MikeJhn]

Lever systems operate on lifting the syphon physically with a rod and lever as can be seen in pic1, push button systems/cistern's do not, they work from a push cable, you will need a new internal syphon to operate with a push button, easy to do if you know how to take you close coupled cistern to bits: https://www.victorianplumbing.co.uk/viva-skylo-dual-flush-valve-long-cable

I would go for a modern modular built in cistern and toilet: https://www.victorianplumbing.co.uk...-shape-soft-close-seat-with-concealed-cistern If you don't have children and of an age, I would recommend the comfort height toilets that are just a little easier to get down to and up from.

 

[Spectric]

I would avoid anything with a flap valve and use a proper syphon from Thomas Dudley, especially if you have a close coupled toilet as you can replace the diapragm without removing the unit from the cistern so maybe sticking with a lever is not a bad thing, buttons and complexity are great for plumbers bank balances but not house holders.

 

[ChaiLatte]

Your links are Google search pages, not specific YouTube videos.

Try this. Do as they say and send them a photo and measurements:

https://www.toiletspareparts.com/collections/conversion-to-push-button-kits

The button and chrome surround project from the face of the cistern. It is only the white operating shaft that goes through the 20mm hole.

I think this is the 2019 video to which you refer.



They link to the product manufacturer here:

https://www.vivasanitary.co.uk/

Contact them and find out the part number.

 

[Windows]

An easy fix for a gold handle is some paint if you’re not wedded to the buttons.

 

[Yorkieguy]

Lever systems operate on lifting the syphon physically with a rod and lever as can be seen in pic1, push button systems/cistern's do not, they work from a push cable, you will need a new internal syphon to operate with a push button, easy to do if you know how to take you close coupled cistern to bits: https://www.victorianplumbing.co.uk/viva-skylo-dual-flush-valve-long-cable

I would go for a modern modular built in cistern and toilet: https://www.victorianplumbing.co.uk...-shape-soft-close-seat-with-concealed-cistern If you don't have children and of an age, I would recommend the comfort height toilets that are just a little easier to get down to and up from.

Thanks for reading.

The conversion kit will do me fine if the push-button unit will fit the 20mm hole in the cistern. the kits come with the syphon unit and all the parts necessary. It's well within my capabilities to fit it.

The bath, pedestal basis and toilet are 'whisper grey' -the height of fashion 30 years ago when the house was built, but not now! Hence, I don't want to replace the toilet as it would inevitably have to be white and wouldn't match the bath or pedestal. I could simply fit a chrome lever handle to replace the gold one and leave it at that, but if the chrome push-button conversion unit will fit the 20mm hole, that would be a better option.

This is in the guest bathroom which is only used when we have visitors to stay. We have an en-suite bathroom which we've just upgraded - bath out, shower compartment in its place, thermostatic shower, re-tiled, dual fuel ladder towel rail, new vanity unit and yes, a comfort height seat!

 

[Yorkieguy]

An easy fix for a gold handle is some paint if you’re not wedded to the buttons.

A chrome one is under a tenner, but I'd prefer a push button conversion. The only issue is whether they will fit the 20mm hole in the front of the cistern, which is the essence of my query, which I hope someone will be able to answer.

 

[Yorkieguy]

Your links are Google search pages, not specific YouTube videos.

Try this. Do as they say and send them a photo and measurements:

https://www.toiletspareparts.com/collections/conversion-to-push-button-kits

The button and chrome surround project from the face of the cistern. It is only the white operating shaft that goes through the 20mm hole.

I think this is the 2019 video to which you refer.



They link to the product manufacturer here:

https://www.vivasanitary.co.uk/

Contact them and find out the part number.

Thanks - I've done that and await a reply.

 

[Yorkieguy]

Your links are Google search pages, not specific YouTube videos.

Try this. Do as they say and send them a photo and measurements:

https://www.toiletspareparts.com/collections/conversion-to-push-button-kits

The button and chrome surround project from the face of the cistern. It is only the white operating shaft that goes through the 20mm hole.

I think this is the 2019 video to which you refer.



They link to the product manufacturer here:

https://www.vivasanitary.co.uk/

Contact them and find out the part number.

Thanks - that looks promising.

 

[Stevekane]

Another option is to buy one of the modern dual flush valves which are cable operated by a chrome lever handle, you depress for full flush and left for a part flush, I dont recall the make but Ive fitted a couple to old toilets and were probably from Screwfix. The only issue I seem to recall was the handle getting fairly close to the cistern lid on its short lifting stroke.
Screwfix part number

57025​

Made by Fluidmaster and about £15.

 

[flying haggis]

from the jokes section so it seemed appropriate

 

[flying haggis]

just a thought if the top of the handle is getting scruffy could you swap it to the other side and turn it upside down thereby seeing the unused underneath bit

 

[Yorkieguy]

Another option is to buy one of the modern dual flush valves which are cable operated by a chrome lever handle, you depress for full flush and left for a part flush, I dont recall the make but Ive fitted a couple to old toilets and were probably from Screwfix. The only issue I seem to recall was the handle getting fairly close to the cistern lid on its short lifting stroke.
Screwfix part number

57025​

Made by Fluidmaster and about £15.

Thanks reading the thread Steve, and for the info.

David

 

[dickm]

Just a small note of caution. Both our loos have the dual push button arrangement, but one requires considerable force to operate it, and since her fall, my wife finds it almost impossible to flush. Possibly significant that almost all disabled loos seem to have the olde worlde handles.
Of course, if you are really old, you go for a high cistern and a chain!!

 

[Spectric]

if you are really old, you go for a high cistern and a chain!!

They are probably still the most efficient flush going, even the most stubborn of monsters is given the heave ho by having a good volume of water coming at them from height.

 

[Yorkieguy]

Just to update this, my only concern was whether or not the push-button unit on these conversion kits would fit through the hole in my close-coupled 30 year old cistern. The diameter of the screwed shaft isn't mentioned anywhere. I sent an email to Viva to ask if there was a local stockist. I received and acknowledgement, but no reply. Meanwhile, I discovered that Toolstation stock them, and also the 'Fluidmaster' dual flush kit, as do Screwfix:

Toolstation:

Viva Skylo Lever Or Push Button Dual Flush Valve

Toolstation Product Code: 58085 £14.98 inc VAT

Viva Skylo Lever Or Push Button Dual Flush Valve | Toolstation

Also the 'Fluidmaster' kit which Steve Kane mentioned in post #10.

I visited Screwfix, looked at the kit, and it's clear that it is suitable for any aperture from 20mm upwards.

For small apertures, there is a chrome spacer which fits outside the cistern under the button unit.

I haven't fitted it yet, but the mechanism is really smooth and only needs a light touch. Both the Skylo and Fluidmaster get largely favourable 5 star reviews. Some say that the chrome button unit, being plastic, is a bit flimsy and cheap looking, but it's adequate and functional, and hey, at £13.00, (£2.17 of which is VAT) for the whole kit, it is cheap!

Fluidmaster Dual Flush Push Button Valve

Toolstation Product Code: 65429 £13.04.

Same product at Screwfix:

Fluidmaster Push Button Cable Dual-Flush Valve (Code 51173)

https://www.screwfix.com/p/fluidmaster-push-button-cable-dual-flush-valve/51173

£13.00 inc VAT

Replacement close coupling kit just in case. £6.39 inc VAT

Essentials WC Close Coupling Kit - Screwfix

Or from Toolstation:

Product code 86616 £6.08 inc VAT.

Bottom like is that the problem is solved - many thanks to all who chipped in with advice.