Combination machine felder or minimax?

[rich1911]

Looking at combination machines. Budget about £5k.

There are used Felder 531's about for this money.

So would that be a better choice than say a new MiniMax C30?

How does a minimax c30 compare to a Hammer c3 30? The Hammer is more £££ but is it worth it?

 

[Trevanion]

If you've got the space go for separate machines. It's a right pain to switch things over sometimes.

The Felder BF series are very good machines if you're still after a combo. So are the Startrite Robland Combos.

But as I said, usually you end up paying more for a good combo machine than you would for some excellent separate machines, plus there are more options.

A Multico 9" or 12" Surface Planer with tenoning attachment would allow you to plane a straight and square face ready for thicknessing and it can also do rebate work very effectively, it can bevel your work and tenon your joinery easily. I mention this particular machine because most planers don't have a tenoning attachment which means you can pretty much make a window with just this machine and a thicknesser easily. You could easily pick one up for under £500. Alternatively, you could pick up a planer thicknesser like a Sedgwick or Wadkin for a little more money but they do lack the tenon attachment but also they thickness timber so it's a trade-off you can decide.

A Multico 12" thicknesser would also set you back just under £500 and would allow you to get your work down to correct thickness.

A Sedgwick or Multico Morticer are cheap as chips and are essential for good machine joinery. You'd get one of these easily for £300.

A spindle moulder is also a valuable tool, A Sedgwick SM3, GM3 or SM4 is what you should be looking for at around the £500 mark. Tooling isn't cheap but it also doesn't really lose value, I've seen used tooling get a 95% return value on eBay even though it's years old.

I would say that a panel saw with sliding table isn't essential for making traditional joinery, you'll get away without one of those and just use a regular table saw and get something like a mitre saw or radial arm saw. A good table saw like a Wadkin AGS would set you back around £500 also and will last indefinitely. And then a mitre saw would set you back £300 for a new one, you could get a secondhand radial arm saw for peanuts too.

So the options I've laid out barely scratch the 3k mark and in the end will be much better and easier to use than a combo machine. Leaves a bit of cash in the pot to buy all the power tools you will need.

 

[custard]

If you're getting a used machine you may win the jackpot and get a load of tooling chucked in for the price. The cost of tooling, especially spindle tooling, can easily outstrip the cost of the machine.

I use a Felder combination and I've used Hammer combos in the past, for the vast majority of users the Hammer gives you everything you'll ever need.

Combi versus separates?

If you have the luxury of space then separates every time, in an 80 sq metre workshop split over two rooms I don't have that luxury, so a combination was the only practical option. It works just fine as long as only one, or at the most, two people are using it. Then you can schedule work accordingly and work around the limitations. For a multi user workshop though I think a combination would be a non starter.

 

[rich1911]

Thanks chaps.

I think I would be pushing it for spave with seperates, even if they were all on wheels!

I will keep an eye out for the kit you mentioned though.

I have a used mill and lathe, both big chunky machines (600kg) running of a 3 phase converter. So much better than new 'hobby' machines. They cost me £1000 each.

Perhaps I will strike it lucky and pick up a complete set of seperates from someone locally retiring or similar...

 

[rich1911]

Did find these not to far away.

I know Charnwood is just Chinese stuff, like Axminsters hobby kit.

Is it a waste of money though?

1) w040 spindle moulder , which cost £850 new to buy.

2) B250 band saw , which cost £350 new to buy.

3) 12” x9” Planer thicknesser , which cost £1,700 new to buy.

4) W325 1” Hollow chisel morticer , which cost £690 new to buy.

5). W691. Dust extractor , which cost £ 250 new to buy.

Cost me over £3,600 to buy.

Whats it worth?

 

[Trevanion]

I've used some Charnwood kit and while it's not terrible it does leave a lot to be desired. You have to expect pretty much all of the plastic and metal handles to disintegrate with regular use and will have to be replaced with something more robust, the bearings and motors don't have a long lifespan due to being the cheapest available, you also have to check the machines quite thoroughly so that you don't get a dud machine also with warped castings or other dodgy stuff. Other than that, they're not terrible. I personally wouldn't pay much for them.

You're better off buying kit that won't disintegrate and will hold it's value if you decide to sell it on later.

 

[rich1911]

I've used some Charnwood kit and while it's not terrible it does leave a lot to be desired. You have to expect pretty much all of the plastic and metal handles to disintegrate with regular use and will have to be replaced with something more robust, the bearings and motors don't have a long lifespan due to being the cheapest available, you also have to check the machines quite thoroughly so that you don't get a dud machine also with warped castings or other dodgy stuff. Other than that, they're not terrible. I personally wouldn't pay much for them.

You're better off buying kit that won't disintegrate and will hold it's value if you decide to sell it on later.

Yep. What I thought. The machines do look almost new. He want's too much for them though. £2200.

 

[Jacob]

I've got Minimax Lab 300 . The C30 looks like a redesign of much the same machine.
Lab 300 brilliant. Very sold, accurate, reliable, faultless - except one capacitor failed some years ago but easy to diagnose and got it from SCM following day.
Presumably the C30 is an improvement so on the face of it I'd expect it to be excellent.
I got one with extra long sliding table which turned out to be very much more useful than I expected. If that's an option on your chosen machine I'd definitely go for it.
PS it had one small disappointment - the spindle well is small so large tooling has to be taken off if you want to put the lid on. But this was in comparison with a huge SCM T110 which I had been using previously so probably fine for a compact combi.

 

[rich1911]

I've got Minimax Lab 300 . The C30 looks like a redesign of much the same machine.
Lab 300 brilliant. Very sold, accurate, reliable, faultless - except one capacitor failed some years ago but easy to diagnose and got it from SCM following day.
Presumably the C30 is an improvement so on the face of it I'd expect it to be excellent.
I got one with extra long sliding table which turned out to be very much more useful than I expected. If that's an option on your chosen machine I'd definitely go for it.
PS it had one small disappointment - the spindle well is small so large tooling has to be taken off if you want to put the lid on. But this was in comparison with a huge SCM T110 which I had been using previously so probably fine for a compact combi.

Thanks Jacob. So difficult to know if these machines are worth the ££££ without genuine user feedback!