Cheap Remote Controlled Dust Extraction

[Sheptonphil]

Its a Axminster Hobby FM300BC

That has a non latching NVR, you just need to pop the switch out, measure it and find a non NVR the same dimensions. The wiring is fairly basic, there will ne two wires to discard that power the magnetic coil which will not be required with the new switch. You will need a relay like this to activate it though with micro switches, a standard solid state relay will fail real quick with that 2HP motor. Use a small 12v power supply, in a box with the relay, the relay 12v control voltage is switched at a very low amperage by the micro switches, use bell wire to connect it all together. The relay is two pole contractor type rated to handle the inductive load of a motor. Total cost to control extractor from seven blast gates is about £25, same as OP’s wireless version for a lesser powered unit. You could also use the wireless unit from OP to operate an ac/ac version of this contactor If you wanted to go remote fob controlled.

 

[Charlie]

That's great, thanks for that Sheptonphil. Do the microswitches have to be a particular size then? I see these microswitches on the same site as the relay

 

[DBT85]

This is still a very viable setup even with high power motors using light switches and intermediates by incorporating a relay at the socket end. It was one of the ways I had considered. Now I am going with a low voltage switching system using micro switches on each blast gate so the extractor will turn on as soon as a blast gate is opened, and a capacitive rated relay in a control box by the extractor.

Hope to see lots of details in a thread Phil!

 

[Sheptonphil]

Hope to see lots of details in a thread Phil!

Will do, as I think it will be a very effective setup suitable for large and small workshops, but really not costing a great deal and doable by anyone with very basic understanding of simple circuitry. I’ll make a dedicated thread for it.

 

[Sheptonphil]

That's great, thanks for that Sheptonphil. Do the microswitches have to be a particular size then? I see these microswitches on the same site as the relay

Use 12v switching, you don’t want or need heavy cable runs to each gate and there may be contacts slightly exposed in the workshop, so they will only be 12v.

Those switches would work, but I’ve sourced the lot on the bay as delivery is included in all these prices

Here are the components, total about £24

relay contactor two pole for total isolation, they’re listed as used, but in fact are new without a box £6.50 edit ** I see it’s gone up £2 since yesterday to £8.50
microswitches Pack 10 £3.69
12v transformer £4.29
bell wire 100m £9.99 30m for about £4.00

12v transformer doesn’t arrive till tomorrow, I’ll then know what size enclosure to put the stuff in, that’ll be another three or four quid.

I’ve got 100m bell wire, will probably only use 30m but a 100m drum wasn’t much dearer than 50m And I’ll be an idea for further remote control.

Will do a WIP and a full schematic for the wiring.

 

[DBT85]

Use 12v switching, you don’t want or need heavy cable runs to each gate and there may be contacts slightly exposed in the workshop, so they will only be 12v.

Those switches would work, but I’ve sourced the lot on the bay as delivery is included in all these prices

Here are the components, total about £24

relay contactor two pole for total isolation, they’re listed as used, but in fact are new without a box £6.50 edit ** I see it’s gone up £2 since yesterday to £8.50
microswitches Pack 10 £3.69
12v transformer £4.29
bell wire 100m £9.99 30m for about £4.00

12v transformer doesn’t arrive till tomorrow, I’ll then know what size enclosure to put the stuff in, that’ll be another three or four quid.

I’ve got 100m bell wire, will probably only use 30m but a 100m drum wasn’t much dearer than 50m And I’ll be an idea for further remote control.

Will do a WIP and a full schematic for the wiring.

 

[Charlie]

That has a non latching NVR, you just need to pop the switch out, measure it and find a non NVR the same dimensions. The wiring is fairly basic, there will ne two wires to discard that power the magnetic coil which will not be required with the new switch. You will need a relay like this to activate it though with micro switches, a standard solid state relay will fail real quick with that 2HP motor. Use a small 12v power supply, in a box with the relay, the relay 12v control voltage is switched at a very low amperage by the micro switches, use bell wire to connect it all together. The relay is two pole contractor type rated to handle the inductive load of a motor. Total cost to control extractor from seven blast gates is about £25, same as OP’s wireless version for a lesser powered unit. You could also use the wireless unit from OP to operate an ac/ac version of this contactor If you wanted to go remote fob controlled.

So I've opened up the DX and found a JD3 switch inside (marked B, 'A' is the mains intake). I take it that it is this that needs replacing, possibly with something like this maybe? 353069420908 from the bay

 

[Sheptonphil]

Yes, that switch would be suitable if it will physically fit and can be made to fix in the enclosure you have. It needn’t look pretty, but it has to be safe. Schematic for my wired system in its own tread so as not to hijack this one.

 

[Gazz292]

I wanted a fully automatic dust extractor switch unit that starts up when any tool is operated, and shuts off with a delay when the tools stopped, but for a semi fixed system.

Being a yorkshire man, i wasn't going to pay out for a ready made unit.

I did some re-wiring of the garage when turning the back half of it into the wood working area (split it to 2 seperate ring mains, one for dads model railway and the tumble drier in the back half, and the front half of the garage is for the woodworking machines.. which also got a type C breaker... dosen't trip when big machines are started up like a type B does... i.e. a dust extractor starting at the same time as a table saw)

i also fitted a few sockets that are just for the dust extractor to plug into.

i use a shop vac type with the 4 inch hose and move it to the machines i'm using atm, i'll add a fixed piping system later,
i didnt want to have to keep plugging the machines into the dust extractor, and my extractor didn't have the power take off facility anyway.


So, the 'heart' of the system is a 'current sensing switch' <£10>
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Current-Sw...=current+sensing+switch&qid=1603758370&sr=8-7
This i mounted in the consumer unit, and all i had to do was feed the 2 brown/live wires from the ring main that the machines plug into through the current switches centre after they exited the breaker.
This unit is a current transformer, which produces a voltage proportional to the current going through it, but it's got an adjustable triggered switch built in, and is totally self powered by the current going through it, the switch part is only good for 300mA.. hence the next bit.


I then added a 20 amp contactor <£5>, and the dust extractor's circuit breaker is powered via that,
i could have left it at that.. the dust extractor will start up whenever any tool is started that's plugged into the woodworking areas wall sockets, and will shut down when the tool is shut off (the current switch is adjustable, so it can be set to not trigger for small hand tools.. tho some modern fixed tools have motors the size of hand tools in them nowadays)

However, i wanted the dust extractor to keep running for a short time after the tools stopped, so i added a run on timer to the circuit <£7>, and adjusted that to give me a 3 second run on delay (i used another of these units for my battery tools charging station, to make it so they can't be left on overnight, just press the start button and the chargers get power for 90 minutes then shut off)
https://www.amazon.co.uk/Rockyin-10...ywords=fan+delay+timer&qid=1603756578&sr=8-97
I then made a control unit, which is a 3 position rotary switch <i already had this, but could have used a couple of rocker/toggle switches> and a couple of panel indicator lights <~£3 ea>, all mounted in a box <£4> that housed the timer module, this is mounted on the wall in a convenient place, needs 4 wires between it and the consumer unit:


Turning the switch to AUTO, the orange light 'Waiting for tool' flashes and it just sits there... waiting.
When a tool is started up, the dust extractor starts up and the green light comes on (i'll add a relay later to turn the orange flashing light off when a tool's triggered the system)
Stop the tool and 3 seconds later dust extractor turns off and the green light goes out.

Turn the switch to ON, and the green light comes on and the dust extractor starts up, this is so i can clear up the mess the mitre saw leaves chucking it's dust everywhere but up the extraction hose it seems, or for vacuuming the floor.
Turn switch back to auto or off, and the extractor turns off immediately.

Total cost for this was £35 - £40,
It is obviously in no way a plug and play solution, but it got me exactly what i wanted and i had fun making it.

 

[Sheptonphil]

Have you a wiring schematic for that setup?

 

[Gazz292]

i need to do a schematic for it asap (to print out and stick inside the box, like i did with the emergency stop system in my metal working shed)

i work all these things out in my head as i am wiring them up, but i will draw it out and post it here once i have done so.

 

[Gazz292]

Spent a while drawing the 'diagrams'
This is how i make my circuit diagrams that i put inside the control box of something i've made, so it can be figured out later (usually by me as i've forgotten how i got it to work) hence i draw the components rathe than use the proper electronic symbols.r

So, attached is the diagram of the system that i am using,
unfortunately the switch i am using is an industrial one that would cost hundreds to buy new, i bought some scrapped industrial panels years ago, and these rotary switches are nice as you can take them appart and re-configure them how you want, hence i basically have one contact block making only when the switch is turned to the On position, but 3 contact blocks making when turned to the Auto position,
this is hard to do with other types of switches, i could prolly figure something out using a relay, but all the third contact does it turn on the flashing 'waiting for tool' panel indicator only when in auto mode, and the relay before that indicator turns it off when the extractor is running.

 

[Gazz292]

And here is the most basic version,
This gives you a dust extractor that turns on when any tool plugged into the ring main is started up, andthe extractor shuts down as soon as the tool is stopped.

 

[Gazz292]

And if we add a delay module to the above circuit, you get the same extractor turning on with any tool on the ring main, but it'll keep going for a few seconds after you stop the tool,

 

[Gazz292]

And here is the full auto / manual circuit, using an easy to get and cheap 3 position switch (on-off-on, double pole)

 

[Sheptonphil]

And here is the full auto / manual circuit, using an easy to get and cheap 3 position switch (on-off-on, double pole)View attachment 95190

Excellent, thanks.
I think there may be a place for this in phase two of my systems implementation.

 

[HamsterJam]

Nice build - are there -any spare NC contacts on your contactor? If so you could use them to stop the orange light flashing when activated for nowt.

 

[Gazz292]

Ahhh, good thinking,
my contactor is a 2 pole unit, N/O only tho, but it has the ability to use clip on auxiliary contacts, so i could get one of those in a change over or N/C configuration and have that switch the flashing 'waiting for tool' light off when the extractor is running in auto mode.