Can you lacquer over Danish oil ?

[whatknot]

I haven't used Danish oil before and thought I would give it a try on some scroll sawed items

I gave them one coat but could do with them being ready tomorrow is possible

So wanted to know if I can spray lacquer over the one coat of (dried) Danish oil ?

 

[marcros]

I don't believe so. I wanted to use an oil under melamine lacquer, but was told by a few people that lacquer needs to go directly onto the wood to get a suitable bond (so as not to flake off). Chestnut Products technical dept confirmed this.

Do you need to lacquer the item? I wanted to because it was a pen and oil pops the grain, but was not tough enough as a finish for an item which would be handled constantly. I didn't find an alternative lacquer which could be used over oil.

 

[MattRoberts]

Not sure about lacquer, but you can use water based poly over danish oil. Best to give the oil a suitable amount of time to cure fully though

 

[MikeG.]

Think of Danish Oil as a hybrid oil/ varnish. It isn't like other oils, as it leaves quite a build-up on the surface, like a conventional varnish. You'll certainly be able to sand it to get a key, so long as you've left it long enough and warm enough to have properly cured.

 

[whatknot]

Hmmm

I am beginning to regret using Danish oil

I should have just lacquered them instead

I will try a test in the morning and see what happens on one piece before proceeding

Many thanks for the replies thus far, all appreciated

 

[marcros]

do you need to lacquer it? Chippygeoff used to simply oil his scrollsawed items by dipping them. I can't remember whether it was blo or danish. you could add wax if you wanted more shine.

 

[whatknot]

Thanks for yours, do I have to? well no I don't suppose so

I will try lacquering one just as a tester, but will also try wax on another just to see

They are lucets so not terribly ornate, but do want a nice smooth finish, both for use and to be tactile

 

[ED65]

Yes you can lacquer over Danish oil, just as you can over wood treated with straight linseed oil. But you have to wait a suitable time before the lacquer goes on.

I doubt even during the summer that overnight would be enough 'drying' time even for a product like this which tends to dry much faster than BLO. Danish oil can certainly be touch-dry in under a day, a few hours in warmer conditions, but the oil component won't be even close to cured (that'll take weeks to a month or more).

I will try lacquering one just as a tester, but will also try wax on another just to see

Testing's good but your timeframe is too tight to be sure of anything; adhesion problems don't always show up immediately.

Wax is a much safer bet given the timescale, but is it a durable enough finish for a lucet which will see regular handling?

 

[whatknot]

Thanks for yours

I did wonder how long it would take to dry thoroughly, in the past using BLO it seemed to take an age to dry but in this case I used a very small amount applied by cloth

Then left them hanging over a radiator to dry

I will try wax first and if the result is okay I will go with that this time

These are small gifts for daughters & wife, who may not use them very much if at all ;-)

If I were selling them I think I would go with lacquer as I usually do

 

[CHJ]

....Then left them hanging over a radiator to dry
.

I think this is where you appear to be under a misapprehension, It is my understanding that Organic Oil Finishes don't just Dry, they chemically Cure (polymerise) when exposed to oxygen in the air.
Warm conditions will speed this up but the timescales for curing to a robust finish are normally days not hours.

The various blends some with added metallic 'dryers' such as cobalt or manganese salts have different timescales to 'cure' (used to be Lead oxide) by encouraging the cross linking of the oxygen with the organic matter.

 

[loftyhermes]

Can't you just buff them up with no finish? If the people using them are anything like bobbin lace makers the last thing they want is any wax on them because it could transfer to the cotton.

 

[custard]

So wanted to know if I can spray lacquer over the one coat of (dried) Danish oil ?

Depends what you mean by "spray lacquer" and on your definition of "dried".

Safest not to.

 

[whatknot]

A valid point well made

Good job I hadn't it yet then ;-)

Thank you

Can't you just buff them up with no finish? If the people using them are anything like bobbin lace makers the last thing they want is any wax on them because it could transfer to the cotton.

 

[whatknot]

Thanks for that, I hadn't considered how they dried/hardened or cured

I did only put the finest of coats on and will try a buff up as a first test just to see what they turn out like

Sometimes you rush in to try something without fully understanding the implications

Ah well nothing ventured nothing gained eh

I think this is where you appear to be under a misapprehension, It is my understanding that Organic Oil Finishes don't just Dry, they chemically Cure (polymerise) when exposed to oxygen in the air.
Warm conditions will speed this up but the timescales for curing to a robust finish are normally days not hours.

The various blends some with added metallic 'dryers' such as cobalt or manganese salts have different timescales to 'cure' (used to be Lead oxide) by encouraging the cross linking of the oxygen with the organic matter.

 

[whatknot]

Lesson learned (well to a point anyway ;-)

I shouldn't have rushed into using the Danish oil



Depends what you mean by "spray lacquer" and on your definition of "dried".

Safest not to.[/quote]

 

[Silly_Billy]

For a tung-based Danish oil (Liberon), could anyone advise on the curing time? Danish oil seems a very generic term, so it’s hard to tell what’s what.

you can use water based poly over danish oil.

Any recommended brands of water-based poly?

 

[MattRoberts]

Ronseal Diamond Hard has been just fine for me, sanding with 400 grit in between coats

I wipe it on with micro fibre cloth as opposed to using a brush though

 

[ED65]

For a tung-based Danish oil (Liberon), could anyone advise on the curing time?

Just an aside first, I would expect the Liberon product not to be "tung-based" in actual fact. They mention the tung oil because it's now a selling point, but because it's a blend they can use any level of tung oil they like and not be lying. There are few regulations governing this sort of thing, and the finishing industry is rather infamous for playing a little fast and loose with their naming practices!

So curing time, 2-4 weeks is the rule of thumb for oil-based products. In Blighty, especially in the cooler months, expect it to be much more around the four-week end of that spectrum than the two!

Drying and curing times are dependent on environmental conditions as well as the drying characteristics of the product. This is why some guys in the US can apply two coats of varnish in a day while we'd struggle to do one per 24 hours sometimes; it's both warmer and less humid (much less) where they are so their finishes dry, and then cure, quite a bit faster than here. Assuming your humidity is 70% or more, your working area isn't toasty warm all the time with constant airflow your drying should be fairly typical for the British Isles.

On top of temp and humidity the amount put on is a big factor too. Even with a finish like Danish oil that doesn't build a distinct surface film three coats will cure noticeably less quickly than just one coat.

Danish oil seems a very generic term...

It is indeed. Look up the history of the development of Danish oil sometime and you'll appreciate why the product could really be just about anything.

 

[Silly_Billy]

Surprisingly, I've now discovered that Liberon Danish Oil is supposed to fully cure in 24h. (According to Liberon.)

 

[Phil Pascoe]

If you want a high tung oil Danish, try Bestwood -
http://danish-oil.com/how-we-make-danish-oil/