Can I use a CNC cutter in my router?

[Deadeye]

Specifically, there's a good value 10mm upcut carbide spiral that I'd like to use (10mm shank and diameter). Any reason not to?

 

[Yojevol]

No, the cutter is not aware of what or who is controlling it.
Brian

 

[ChaiLatte]

Any reason not to?

You will have to learn to speak G-code.

 

[Deadeye]

You will have to learn to speak G-code.

Lol

 

[poshpaws]

Provided you have a 10mm collet , should be fine

 

[sploo]

Specifically, there's a good value 10mm upcut carbide spiral that I'd like to use (10mm shank and diameter). Any reason not to?

Reasons not to would be if your spindle is very underpowered, and/or the CNC machine itself is too light/flimsy to take the loads of using a 10mm diameter bit. Finally, upcut bits can tear out the top face on some materials (e.g. plywood). But other than that, if the speeds, feeds, and Depth of Cut is appropriate, it'll be good.

 

[Deadeye]

Reasons not to would be if your spindle is very underpowered, and/or the CNC machine itself is too light/flimsy to take the loads of using a 10mm diameter bit. Finally, upcut bits can tear out the top face on some materials (e.g. plywood). But other than that, if the speeds, feeds, and Depth of Cut is appropriate, it'll be good.

Thanks - it's going in a meaty router so I think should be ok

 

[sploo]

Thanks - it's going in a meaty router so I think should be ok

You'll be fine then.

My "goto" has always been a 1/4" upcut carbide spiral bit in a 2.2kW spindle (mostly for 1/4" DoC in MDF).

 

[meccarroll]

CNC Bits are designed for use in a CNC and can be very difficult to control if used freehand or with a none fixed router. I have a CNC and tried to use a 10mm bit in my router to test some holes and I could not control the bit or router. It's up to you but you could be wasting your time and money.

 

[Deadeye]

CNC Bits are designed for use in a CNC and can be very difficult to control if used freehand or with a none fixed router. I have a CNC and tried to use a 10mm bit in my router to test some holes and I could not control the bit or router. It's up to you but you could be wasting your time and money.

Thanks. It's going into a jig-based router so I think should be ok. Guess I'll find out!

 

[Distinterior]

I regularly use 8mm solid carbide compression cutters in a hand held router without any issues.
As mentioned by others,.....One thing to be aware of is feed rate.....If your feed rate is too slow, it will wear the cutter out rather quickly. I mainly use mine on man made material, rather than real wood!

 

[meccarroll]

I regularly use 8mm solid carbide compression cutters in a hand held router without any issues.
As mentioned by others,.....One thing to be aware of is feed rate.....If your feed rate is too slow, it will wear the cutter out rather quickly. I mainly use mine on man made material, rather than real wood!

Why do you not use a normal router bit in a router?

 

[Distinterior]

A compression spiral cutter gives a far superior cut on man made, pre finished boards, such as MFC and MFMDF.
A normal straight bladed, twin flute tungsten carbide tipped cutter does a reasonable job, but not as good as the spiral compression cutter.

 

[meccarroll]

A compression spiral cutter gives a far superior cut on man made, pre finished boards, such as MFC and MFMDF.
A normal straight bladed, twin flute tungsten carbide tipped cutter does a reasonable job, but not as good as the spiral compression cutter.

I know know people use compression bits for sheet material in a CNC but when I looked into the best cutters for melamine I came up with the below:

They work well for melamine faced chipboard but maybe a spiral compression bit would be better for MDF and plywood etc

They are a solid carbide three flute chip breaker bit and produce a exceptionally clean cut in MFC. I run 8mm bits at 14000 rpm with a feed speed of 3000mm min with a depth of cut each pass of 6mm and had really good results. My panel saw is quicker because it cuts through an 18mm sheet of MFC in one pass but the CNC with the below cutter produces better results.

My experience with CNC bits in a hand held router did not go well but It sounds, from what you have said, that I just had a bad experience and it is possible to use certain CNC bits in a router, maybe I should experiment more!

 

[Distinterior]

For additional longevity, a friend of mine who owns a CNC business, started looking at PCD cutters for his spindle about 18 months ago.
He was cutting a lot of MFC/ MRMDF material for me at the time and was getting through a lot of solid carbide compression cutters.

He decided to order a PCD cutter, as this was recommended by his tooling supplier as an alternative, but at no small cost, and tried it on a couple of different materials he was working on at that time and was not impressed with the finish he was achieving.....Feed rate was all set up according to the spec supplied by the cutter supplier but it was nowhere near as good as the solid carbide compression cutters he had been using up until now.....
So, he promptly sent it back for a refund.

He still uses solid carbide compression cutters to this day.....

Is that cutter in your picture a PCD cutter?......It certainly looks similar to what I remember of the returned one we tried.

 

[meccarroll]

For additional longevity, a friend of mine who owns a CNC business, started looking at PCD cutters for his spindle about 18 months ago.
He was cutting a lot of MFC/ MRMDF material for me at the time and was getting through a lot of solid carbide compression cutters.

He decided to order a PCD cutter, as this was recommended by his tooling supplier as an alternative, but at no small cost, and tried it on a couple of different materials he was working on at that time and was not impressed with the finish he was achieving.....Feed rate was all set up according to the spec supplied by the cutter supplier but it was nowhere near as good as the solid carbide compression cutters he had been using up until now.....
So, he promptly sent it back for a refund.

He still uses solid carbide compression cutters to this day.....

Is that cutter in your picture a PCD cutter?......It certainly looks similar to what I remember of the returned one we tried.

No it is a solid carbide bit and specially made for the purpose. The resulting finish is excellent on Melamine faced chipboard but I can't say too much about other materials.

I have a PCD cutter which are supposed to last a lot longer than solid carbide cutters but the quality of cut may depend on the number of teeth and if you buy a cutter with not enough teeth the cutter may last but the quality of cut might not be what you expect.

The below is what I suspect your friend should have used for a decent finish. But in a size his machine can handle.

 

[Distinterior]

If I remember correctly, his machine has a 2500mm x 1300mm cutting capacity and it has a large water cooled spindle, that I think can take up to 20mm dia shank (ER 20 seems to spring to mind....?). It has a 3 phase supply feed with a dedicated 3 phase cyclone dust extractor and has a vacuum bed that can be isolated in a number of different ways to give optimum vacuum clamping.....I'm afraid I dont recollect the manufacturer off the top of my head......but its Black & green in colour..........and not a Festool!

 

[meccarroll]

If I remember correctly, his machine has a 2500mm x 1300mm cutting capacity and it has a large water cooled spindle, that I think can take up to 20mm dia shank (ER 20 seems to spring to mind....?). It has a 3 phase supply feed with a dedicated 3 phase cyclone dust extractor and has a vacuum bed that can be isolated in a number of different ways to give optimum vacuum clamping.....I'm afraid I dont recollect the manufacturer off the top of my head......but its Black & green in colour..........and not a Festool!

Sounds like the machine bed your friend has is capable but if the collett size is limited to ER 20 (same as my 2.2Kw spindle has) it might not be a high powered spindle but who knows. The picture above is a PCD bit but they can look a lot different, select a bit for a specific purpose not for the material used to manufacture it, if that sounds of any real use.

It's a bit like expecting a rip saw made of premium steel to do same fine work as a tenon saw made of premium steel. They both last a long time but produce very different finishes.

Mark

 

[Distinterior]

I cant remember whether I heard him use the term " ER20" or not, so dont hold me to that.

Coincidentally, I was edge routing some large woodgrain MFC panels today using an 8mm carbide compression cutter.....very happy with the quality of the finish!

 

[meccarroll]

I cant remember whether I heard him use the term " ER20" or not, so dont hold me to that.

Coincidentally, I was edge routing some large woodgrain MFC panels today using an 8mm carbide compression cutter.....very happy with the quality of the finish!

I have seen utube videos of large machine shops using compression cutters for MFC so I know they can produce very good results (I have some) but when I did a lot of digging the below cutter came up as giving excellent results in MFC.

I ordered one and I obtined absolute perfect results, you could not fault the finish. I have very similar looking compression bits and would expect them to do a similar job too. I just know I can trust the three flute chip breaker bits I use so carry on using them.

A line up of some of the bits I have:

left to right: 10mm PCD bit one teeth, 8mm Three flute solid carbide straight bit with chip breaker, 8mm Two flute Carbide compression bit with chip breaker, 8mm Two flute solid carbide compression bit.

The PCD bit is a one teet bit which will cut and clear material but for a clean cut in melamine I should have probably gone for a two or three teeth bit. My bit cost £60 but a three teeth bit would have cost about £145. If I get a decent job in I would try a three teeth bit but for now I use the one second from left and at around £16 a time is not too bad on the pocket.