Buying and using Ash.

[skipdiver]

I've been a jobbing and site joiner my whole working life and have worked with wood ever since a can remember, but it's been 95% pine/deal/redwood, whatever you want to call it, with the odd foray using oak, beech and ash, mainly skirting, architraves and worktops, that sort of thing.

I'm on my third home and third workshop, which ended up being mainly used for storage and accumulated stuff to do with my work. I now have the time and the workshop set up to do more interesting stuff and would like to start by making a simple bookcase (books are still in the loft, 4 years after moving in) and initially i was thinking painted MDF or pine. Then i thought about veneered MDF of some sort but it dawned on me that i now have the time and resources to work with some 'proper' wood. Was looking at some Ash furniture in a local store last week and decided that it was what i wanted to use but apart from Architraves and skirtings, i have no experience of working with it, so would appreciate some pointers.

There is a decent timber yard about 12 miles out of town, from what i have been told anyway, as i have never visited it, which is criminal really given the range of timber they sell, but i've never had the need. I have the facility to dimension stuff myself, bandsaw, P/T etc.

What should i be looking at buying? Obviously, i could just buy finished boards and glue them together but that would be too easy. Any pointers about what to look for would be appreciated. I also want to make a dining table eventually and maybe a set of chairs but i'll start with something straightforward. It's only a bookcase, what could possibly go wrong? :roll:

 

[Bod]

1st tip.
Measure the books.

Nothing worse, books 1/4 inch too tall for shelf spacing.

Bod

 

[Cretin]

Ash veneer MDF is a good option, and unlike some timber the veneer gives a good realistic look, you will never have any movement twisting or warping.. I use ash in All my painted furniture as the grain is deep it showers up lovely through the paint. I would drill the gables of your unit for adjustable shelving which gives you the option of having a change around every now and again.

 

[RogerP]

... better yet, make the shelving adjustable.

EDIT (it seems we posted almost simultaneously!)

 

[Cretin]

Great minds and all that!

 

[RogerP]

....indeed!

 

[RobinBHM]

Or cut the books down to size

Topic covered here on workshop forum recently!

I would make your bookcase carcase with ash mdf, shelves in solid for anti sag and then focus on using the solid ash for the details like cornice, plinth, face frame, drawers etc.

Making cabinets of solid is a lot of timber prep so could turn into a bit of a slog.

5mm holes and adjustable shelf pegs is def the way to go, either 5mm chrome rods or those with little plastic grips for glass shelves work well.

Tonk strip if you want to go oldy worldy

 

[kevinlightfoot]

Be sure and keep the dust to a minimum if at ll possible I had to work a lot of ash a few years ago and the dust bought me out in a nasty rash.I then became allergic to the dust and cannot work it any longer don't wish to scare you off the stuff but just be careful.

 

[Fitzroy]

I worked a bunch of ash into shelves (alcove ones so I basically made some thick boards) and it really does smell when planing, sanding etc but I found it a nice wood to work with. It was one of the first things I made and it really taught me you have to look at the wood, and work out which grain works with which other, and where to cut to maximise usable timber. Two skills that I'm still terrible at but improving.

 

[skipdiver]

Thanks for all the suggestions so far and i was planning on using adjustable shelving. Seems that ash MDF is a good option as it is stable but it's the solid stuff i'm unsure on. Do i just buy machined stock or is it better to buy rough boards and machine myself, from a cost versus time equation. I have more time than money and machinery that isn't getting a lot of use apart from cutting birch ply at the moment. Is kiln dried best or air dried, American or European, in the rough or prepared stock? That's the main questions i have or is it just best to visit the timber yard and see what they have?

Any pointers toward bookcase plans would be helpful too. It will be low and wide as opposed to tall and narrow.

 

[PAC1]

Even with adjustable shelves measure the books. Don't forget to allow for the thickness of the shelf and allow room to get a finger in to remove the book. Also allow for plinth and any moulding at the top. Then lay it all out and double check. It is easy to think that just because you have adjustable shelves all will be fine. Nope.

 

[custard]

It's always a good idea to visit the timber yard in person. Even though Ash is a fairly homogeneous timber there's still variation, for example brownish staining, what's called "Olive Ash", is pretty common, you may want this or you may want to avoid it. You might also want a variety of cuts, quarter sawn for stability, rift sawn so that all four faces of a leg have similar grain patterns, or flat sawn to maximise the more dramatic "cathedral grain" on a show face. And even if you use Ash veneered MDF you'll still want fairly thick solid wood Ash lippings to resist the sagging that MDF suffers from, especially with bookshelves! So by taking an off cut of the veneered MDF with you, you'll have a better chance of getting a good colour match.

Given your experience and equipment I wouldn't hesitate, get sawn boards rather than PAR. Fact is you'll be able to dimension the timber more cheaply and accurately than any purchased PAR timber.

There isn't a huge difference between American and European Ash, I'm happy using either, but kilned is definitely the way to go if you want stability and dimensional accuracy.

When it comes to designing bookshelves you want too ensure the maximum shelf sag or deflection is 3mm, that's a commonly used standard but personally I find even 3mm unpleasant to look at and therefore I aim for 1mm maximum shelf deflection. Here's a useful resource for deciding on the dimensions needed to hit this standard,

http://www.woodbin.com/calcs/sagulator/

Good luck!

 

[custard]

Incidentally, here's a small bookcase that I made that might give you some design ideas, it's spray painted Tulip Wood.

I tried to avoid the square, blocky look that most bookcases have by incorporating corbels, which together with the panelled sides gives it an Arts & Crafts twist. Incidentally, even with a tongue and groove panelled back it still came in at under two days work. You could add further interest to the design with some subtle curves to the front edge of the top and to the rails.

 

[cowfoot]

I've recently made the move into working with "real" timber and Ash was the first wood I bought (cheap and attractive, it's a winning combo).
Bit of a pain getting it to the right dimensions at first, particularly resawing - I might be teaching a Granny to suck eggs but make sure you plane a couple of faces square before putting it through the bandsaw, otherwise it ends up all over the shop. Once you're there though you'll hopefully find that it's actually easier to work with than cheap pine in a funny way, my joints were all way more accurate for a start. Perhaps spending a few more quid on timber makes you concentrate a bit more, for a start.
Anyway, good luck and hope you enjoy working with it as much as I have.

 

[skipdiver]

Thanks for the further pointers chaps and you answered a question before i asked custard. Was going to ask if i should buy the MDF first and see what finish it is before venturing forth to the timber yard, so that's one thing sorted. Thanks also for the other info.

I'm obviously not green with woodworking matters, just the materials i've used, which i plan to change now i have more time on my hands. I've never really had the chance to work with more interesting timber over the years, more's the pity, but i'm au fait with quantities, lay out and working out what works from an end user point of view and have built many a bookcase, CD rack, LP rack etc.

 

[skipdiver]

That's exactly the sort of thing i'm looking to make custard, so thanks again, it looks great.

Thanks for the tips Cowfoot but i'm not concerned with the technical side of prep and lay out. I'm just a bit lacking in buying and using wood other than the bog standard. Sourcing, working and finishing is the unknown element.

 

[cowfoot]

Custard - nice bookcase! Where do you stand on adjustable shelving? I've got hundreds of books and have built a fair few shelves to put them on over the years (and worked for Waterstones both as a bookseller and shopfitter!). Seems to me that the vast majority of books are standard sizes, there's a few oddities particularly art books. I'd tend to go with fixed shelves based on standard sizes, which I think's the case at one of my favourite bookshops (Daunt in Marylebone) -

 

[custard]

Where do you stand on adjustable shelving?

Nothing wrong with adjustable shelving, just as long as it doesn't use Tonk Strip, which is the ugliest furniture hardware ever invented!

 

[cowfoot]

True, looks even worse with thirty year's worth of cheap white gloss toshed over the top of it...

 

[skipdiver]

No tonk strip here, honest.