Bringing goods from the EU

[Daniel2]

That 52% had no concept of what they wanted the future to look like

Each, on an individual level, probably did have their own picture of the future, in their mind's eye.
However, I still stand by my point, that I believe the vast majority (downside of a democracy), did
not fully understand the implications of their vote.
I'm incensed because Brexit has cost me €20 (inc vat).

 

[RobinBHM]

could live with such pessimistic outlook as some on here, must wake up every day with the weight of the world on your shoulders

Ah, a conflation.

It is a rather shallow argument to label people who disagree with Brexit as pessimistic.
Debating Brexit does not give any indication as to a persons level of happiness.

 

[RobinBHM]

It is better for everyone to be pleasant

Boring though

 

[doctor Bob]

Ah, a conflation.

It is a rather shallow argument to label people who disagree with Brexit as pessimistic.
Debating Brexit does not give any indication as to a persons level of happiness.

You tried this before. I find positive stuff in everything. That makes me an optimist. As an optimist I find you all very pessimistic about the future. I was asked about me, directly and gave my view. If you’re not happy with that then that’s fine. To be honest it just seems point scoring

 

[John Brown]

Or bashing the table

Sorry, Doctor, no, I was lighting the log burner, eating my dinner and watching some lightweight romantic comedy film with my wife.
Glad to hear that Brexit isn't really affecting you one way or another, but this thread was started because some people are apparently suffering the fallout. If you're not affected, then I can only guess that you join in to jeer and gloat. There's nothing wrong with that, and if if makes you happy, then there's a Brexit benefit for you! The next time someone asks you how life has improved for you post Brexit, feel free to say that it allows you to jeer and gloat. You have my blessing.

 

[RobinBHM]

Hopefully we can have some fresh analogies

The tea bag analogy

If you leave the bag in, then over time the cup of tea will get stronger. And it may appear that the bag is getting weaker but it’s now part of a stronger bag of tea.

Whereas if you take the bag out, the tea gets weaker and the bag goes directly in the bin

 

[doctor Bob]

Sorry, Doctor, no, I was lighting the log burner, eating my dinner and watching some lightweight romantic comedy film with my wife.
Glad to hear that Brexit isn't really affecting you one way or another, but this thread was started because some people are apparently suffering the fallout. If you're not affected, then I can only guess that you join in to jeer and gloat. There's nothing wrong with that, and if if makes you happy, then there's a Brexit benefit for you! The next time someone asks you how life has improved for you post Brexit, feel free to say that it allows you to jeer and gloat. You have my blessing.

Make stuff up as you wish john, if it makes you happy.
When have I gloated, you asked me a question I replied. Saying very little had changed. Again just another cheap low shot from you. I thought you wanted a serious discussion.
You must have really suffered if you think life remaining the same is a gloat.
Having said that I like to see people doing well. I certainly see no reason to frown on others doing well.
I see your point about the reason for the thread but your attitude just confirms to me that you just want your gang on here.

 

[doctor Bob]

The tea bag analogy

If you leave the bag in, then over time the cup of tea will get stronger. And it may appear that the bag is getting weaker but it’s now part of a stronger bag of tea.

Whereas if you take the bag out, the tea gets weaker and the bag goes directly in the bin

What!

 

[artie]

I was on a well known auction site about a week ago intent on purchasing a small item. £2.94 including postage.
I clicked the buy it now option and proceeded to check out.
Only to be informed that I needed to change my address before the seller would accept payment.

Now I don't know about anyone else but I don't think a £2.94 item warrants me upping sticks, so I decided to just delete it. oops no can do.

So I just shut the whole thing down and went to Amazon where a vendor obliged me albeit for a few pence more.

Tuesday past I received an email from that well known site advising that I needed to pay to avoid a no payment case opening against me.

Today I have been noticed that a case has been opened against me.

 

[sploo]

That was the big issue, people didn’t understand the working man mentality

This is absolutely true, and indeed the Leave camp did a really good job at tapping into it to secure the vote of that demographic.

Sadly, understand and empathise are two different things; as Brexit probably does the most harm to those at the bottom (not that they gave a toss about that of course).

 

[doctor Bob]

This is absolutely true, and indeed the Leave camp did a really good job at tapping into it to secure the vote of that demographic.

Sadly, understand and empathise are two different things; as Brexit probably does the most harm to those at the bottom (not that they gave a toss about that of course).

The working man was told what to do by the middle class, I was publicly told by a ceo that I didn’t know enough to deserve a vote. He may well have been right, but it would be a sad day when one man one vote is not the correct way.

 

[sploo]

The working man was told what to do by the middle class, I was publicly told by a ceo that I didn’t know enough to deserve a vote. He may well have been right, but it would be a sad day when one man one vote is not the correct way.

In this instance (the Brexit referendum) it was the working man being told to vote against "the elite"... by wealthy members of the monied elite.

Agree on one man one vote though; totally unacceptable for someone to tell another they don't deserve a vote.

 

[Jacob]

The working man was told what to do by the middle class, I was publicly told by a ceo that I didn’t know enough to deserve a vote. He may well have been right, but it would be a sad day when one man one vote is not the correct way.

It was more the media doing the telling, motivated by wealthy vested interests.
Not a "class" thing - there are plenty of intelligent people amongst "the working class".
The fact that your man was a CEO means nothing he was probably as thick as a post. "Class" has nothing to do with it - just look at some of the old Etonians running Britain today, some of them shouldn't have been released from the 5th form!

 

[Droogs]

ah but he was the man DrBob and his was the vote

 

[doctor Bob]

A

 

[doctor Bob]

A

 

[Droogs]

choo?

 

[Jelly]

That was the big issue, people didn’t understand the working man mentality

Whilst I don't agree with you on much about the EU, I would fully agree with you on this.


I don't know if this fits with your own thoughts, but is what I learned from a bunch of the operators at work who were/are keen brexiteers.

Whilst I did have a whole detailed post written about what I learned from them about their reasons for voting that way, but the bottom line I arrived at is something like:

Many brexiteers felt left behind, knew that they didn't gain all that much tangible from the EU and were keenly aware that they were already being taken for granted, treated like idiots and imposed upon by the powers that be...​

​

The leave campaign then failed to articulate any of the benefits of the EU in a way which was meaningful to them, and reinforced all of those feelings by basically telling them what to do with insufficient attempts to seriously explain or engage with them.​

Sound about right?


What I will say from the opposite side of the argument, is that in that context the choice to vote against the establishment, knowing that there wasn't much for them to loose, whilst an upset victory would bring them back to political relevance and give them more of an opportunity to influence the UK's future; now looks like a very canny decision indeed.

Not all that much to do with Europe, but definitely not stupid either.

 

[Jake]

choo?

Milne.

no, McKenzie/Breakwell

 

[Jake]

the choice to vote against the establishment

They weren't at all, the establishment is stuffed full of Brexiters.