Bringing goods from the EU

[sploo]

Not so much the government per se, but for the UK to move forward, we need to start having some honesty and dealing in facts.

Mainly because whatever garbage comes from the government or the media, the facts of brexit in terms of the endless trade barriers are here and are starting to bite.

So I would say to the government: start talking the truth and stop gaslighting.

Agreed.

I don't know if the original question was in general, or specifically about Brexit, but in general I'd say evidence and data driven policy, rather than policy driven by dogma and personal beliefs.

More in the way of fact checking (such that lying politicians and tabloid media get called out loudly and quickly) would be critical to decent government too. If it's easy to lie to get what you want, there will always be those willing to do it.

 

[Jelly]

I've recently discovered David Wilks YouTube channel, and was pleasantly surprised to see he's fair local to me and doing really interesting stuff, sharing his knowledge of deep-hole boring and trepanning, which is something of a black art in the machining world.

Well worth watching!



Edit:

After reading @RobinBHM's comments, I feel like this should be titled "What Brexit can tell us about UK Government's attitude to supporting British industry" because the Brexit and Europe angles are both irrelevant to the core issue...​

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Whenever the government is faced with a need to do something meaningful to support UK industry they dither for a bit, then do nothing of substance, whenever they talk about UK PLC or the Leveling Up agenda, there's no coherent policy behind the words which will drive that. Both of which I find deeply frustrating.​

However, going through his back catalogue, I found he's been slowly selling off his equipment, and dissolving his business.

I've linked to the relevant bit, but to quote the video:

"The Brexit was the start of it.​

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Brexit absolutely destroyed the engineering business, in, I don't know about the rest of England, but Sheffield took a massive beating."​

​

Which just re-ignited my fury from 4 years ago.

Now don't get me wrong I was firmly in the remain camp during the referendum; but my nose was not unduly bent out of shape by that decision, it happened and the world had to keep moving; I was willing to be convinced that Brexit could be a good thing.

It's what came next (or didn't, to be precise) which got my blood boiling...

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In the weeks after the referendum, once the pound devalued, I could see that there was an opportunity, and if played right the decision to exit the EU, and the associated rebalancing of the pound on a more logical footing with the dollar and euro offered massive potential for the UK to revitalise it's manufacturing industry and body the economy with national export growth.​

​

We announced a new element of "industrial strategy" within government, and I thought "Great, they're really going to do it, this could be the UK's chance to emulate the success of Korea in the 70 & 80's!"​

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But as time wore on within a month or two, I could see nothing was happening, the political optics and the need to win on an ideological level was trumping the practical steps which needed to be taken immediately in order to lay the groundwork to make the most of what opportunities Brexit could offer, and the capacity within the civil service which should have been moving heaven and earth to prepare that, was being wasted on endless to-ing and fro-ing due to constant government changes of direction (and leadership).​

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• No-one in power was making a positive case for how we could re-make Britain and it's place within the world.
• The planning for and investment in infrastructure and capacity building which needed to be happening "rIght now!" was nowhere to be seen, and
• No short to medium term support for otherwise strong businesses which were being hit by the investment uncertainty and currency fluctuations was forthcoming.

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By four months in, I was sick of being told that Brexit was "the will of the people", whilst seeing previously profitable businesses (including customers and suppliers of mine who I had excellent working relationships with) restructuring or dissolving entirely because of adverse trading conditions, and talking to friends who were losing their jobs directly as a result of the lack of clarity about the future.​

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I'd forgotten all that with time, become ennured to the medium term damage, come to let the BS from our elected representatives & the newspapers wash over me, and accepted that this was our lot as a nation.

But watching that video brought it all back, and I'm still irked by how things have played out, in the end pragmatically having a foot in both camps was more torture than just picking a side and sticking to it.

Rant Over.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

J.C. ................ here we go again.

 

[RobinBHM]

I'm not sure devaluing the pound actually helps exports much....UK manufacturing uses a lot of imported components.

Brexit was an opportunity for change in this country, however I would suggest that opportunity existed whilst being an EU member. Germany is a world leader in technology and engineering.

I actually think Brexit is a red herring, the decline in engineering in the UK has been a direct result of domestic politics.

I remember a few years ago a business owner who runs an engineering company said his company had suffered in the past because the Single Market meant huge competition and European companies who had invested more in technology were able to produce better quality at lower prices. That spurred his company to invest and his company was beating the European competition. He also said that the leading UK manufacturers were becoming more competitive than Chinese engineering....obv at the higher end.

 

[Jelly]

Brexit was an opportunity for change in this country, however I would suggest that opportunity existed whilst being an EU member. Germany is a world leader in technology and engineering.

...

I actually think Brexit is a red herring, the decline in engineering in the UK has been a direct result of domestic politics.

I would fully agree with the latter point, I suppose that's the Gist of my Post, when push comes to shove, the UK government doesn't want to (or isn't able to) support those sectors in a meaningful way.

Too much value appears to have been placed on non-productive and abstract financial services at the detriment of almost every other area of the economy; which combined with the lack of infrastructure investment which would have supported increased manufacturing growth, put us where we are today.



And yes, there wasn't necessarily any need to leave the EU to make a positive change; But it was a moment which presented both some unique opportunities to think differently and be radical in our approach, gave the government a really strong impetus to make change and highlighted a national appetite for it.

However, if the government was willing to go all in with that kind of approach (similar to the controversial but highly effective Heavy Chemical Initiative, which South Korea persued in the 70's) being free of EU state aid rules would give them a lot more room to manoeuvre (state aid rules wouldn't necessarily prevent it, but would make it slow and unable to be responsive), in terms of providing direct and targeted support or investment funding to business in order to drive the change they really want to see.

 

[paulrbarnard]

 

[Jelly]

It's highly unusual for Boris to be personally announcing his government's policy towards UK manufacturing in a musical number...

But I'll credit him this, if the whole prime minister thing doesn't work out he's got a much more promising career as a drag artist than I would have thought!

 

[Noel]

Folks, please take note. This not a C19 thread and will not turn into a C19 thread. Vaccines in the detailed context of recent EU-UK events, yes. Vaccine rollout and efficacy, no. C19 and if it's a sniffy nose or a life threatening disease or a wintery red nose, no.
If some feel it really necessary to go off piste then it'll be a simple matter of excluding you from the thread.

This not a C19 thread and will not turn into a C19 thread
Vaccine rollout and efficacy, no.
If some feel it really necessary to go off piste, posts will be removed, then it'll be a simple matter of excluding you from the thread.

 

[D_W]

It's highly unusual for Boris to be personally announcing his government's policy towards UK manufacturing in a musical number...

But I'll credit him this, if the whole prime minister thing doesn't work out he's got a much more promising career as a drag artist than I would have thought!

Bright blonde hair and maybe a "woo" and he could do some pro wrestling over here.

Or host an outdoors show. The hair is unusual.

boris doppelganger

 

[D_W]

Does he tell fish stories?

 

[Jelly]

Bright blonde hair and maybe a "woo" and he could do some pro wrestling over here.

Or host an outdoors show. The hair is unusual.

boris doppelganger

Honestly I would pay to see former and politicians face off in pro wrestling matches...

Maybe someone should suggest it as a charity fundraiser?

Alternatively, maybe I just need to follow more Taiwanese politics.

It's certainly very... spirited, you might say.

 

[billw]

I don't know about the exact implementation of these new rules because all my stuff from Banggood is arriving from China with no problem, no duty or VAT paperwork. Admittedly the last thing I bought cost me £30 and the customs declaration said £3.18.

 

[D_W]

Their fighting style is very unusual!! They look really calm while fighting, but at least their legislators are young enough to do it, unlike ours.

 

[Jelly]

Their fighting style is very unusual!! They look really calm while fighting, but at least their legislators are young enough to do it, unlike ours.

It is rather unsettling isn't it.

For contrast, see the Ugandans who seem to go for a cross between pro-wrestling (chairs and all) and a brawl at a shriner convention!

 

[D_W]

That's a little more like it. At least they have expressions on their faces. Makes them look a little less serial killer to me.

 

[sploo]

I don't know about the exact implementation of these new rules because all my stuff from Banggood is arriving from China with no problem, no duty or VAT paperwork. Admittedly the last thing I bought cost me £30 and the customs declaration said £3.18.

For the moment at least, the large volume (and "creatively valued on the paperwork") mail coming from China does appear to be slipping under the radar. I do wonder if there will be a crackdown on it at some point (and if that would even be feasible).

 

[marcros]

I would say that most Chinese stuff does seem to slip through. It is strange because I can almost guarantee that not a single US thing ever gets to me without a charge, and often they have been inspected too. Same with Australian items. They used to be a bit hit and miss, but the last couple came with a bill.

 

[Terry - Somerset]

I've always felt that wars and conflicts should be settled by each side sending its champion to fight for the cause.

Cheaper, only one person ends up dead or seriously wounded, much quicker than normal wars.

The added benefit is that normal political behaviours - half truths, selective statistics, sometimes just simple lies have no part in such a conflict.

 

[doctor Bob]

OK, go on then, I'll wrestle Jacob to settle it.
Having said that I bet he's a wirey one and got some strength, maybe in a few years would be better.

Definately not Noel, you know what the Irish are like, he's probably been in more bare knuckle fights than I've had hot dinners.

 

[selectortone]

I don't know about the exact implementation of these new rules because all my stuff from Banggood is arriving from China with no problem, no duty or VAT paperwork. Admittedly the last thing I bought cost me £30 and the customs declaration said £3.18.

Shhhhhhhhhhh!!!