Bringing goods from the EU

[doctor Bob]

Sorry near Leven, actually Lower Largo, right on the beach near a car park

Beautifully Converted Fishing Net Factory with Stunning views

 

[sploo]

I get your point but not that it’s an exact swap - we are also able to do other deals which was not the case as an EU member. I’m not claiming it’s ideal but am perhaps feeling a more cup half full about it than some.

Oh it's definitely a good thing. I mean, I think it's a good thing - it's hard to trust the morons we have in government at the moment due to their long (and regularly) displayed lack of competence, and abundance of malevolence (meaning they'll likely either bollerx it up, or they have plans to use it to line their own pockets). To reuse my analogy from a couple of pages ago; I'm just a bit cynical when someone's making a really big positive deal about the new wooden leg they claim they'll give you, when that's the same person that cut off your real one in the first place (whilst claiming that was a great idea too).

 

[doctor Bob]

Oh it's definitely a good thing. I mean, I think it's a good thing - it's hard to trust the morons we have in government at the moment due to their long (and regularly) displayed lack of competence, and abundance of malevolence (meaning they'll likely either bollerx it up, or they have plans to use it to line their own pockets). To reuse my analogy from a couple of pages ago; I'm just a bit cynical when someone's making a really big positive deal about the new wooden leg they claim they'll give you, when that's the same person that cut off your real one in the first place (whilst claiming that was a great idea too).

I'll accept your point, but it's not been cut off, at present it's a bit wobblier than it was but we don't know whether it will get tightened up. We also could have an extra leg.
My view point, very simplistically was, the EU will collapse and I think first out is best. Rather than multiple countries running for help / cover.
So I still believe we did the right thing.
I know you can chastise me for that view but I believe it will happen as you obviously beleive trade with Europe will collapse.
Also I don't accept it has to be binary, and this thread would be better served if people would give a little bit. A discussion is better than an arguement, back slapping is not helping either.

 

[sploo]

I'll accept your point, but it's not been cut off, at present it's a bit wobblier than it was but we don't know whether it will get tightened up. We also could have an extra leg.
My view point, very simplistically was, the EU will collapse and I think first out is best. Rather than multiple countries running for help / cover.
So I still believe we did the right thing.
I know you can chastise me for that view but I believe it will happen as you obviously beleive trade with Europe will collapse.

Trade with other EU nations won't collapse (and that's not something I've ever suggested or believed - indeed it would be daft for all concerned). However, we have made it harder, and more expensive. The well documented delays that have been occurring over recent weeks will eventually get resolved as everyone gets used to the new norm, but the added costs won't go away - they're permanent (at least, until we change our trading agreements at some unknown point in the future).

Will the EU as a body collapse? Nothing lasts forever; but find it hard to believe. The close proximity (and very different mindset) of many of our European neighbours means that more value does appear to be placed on interaction; whereas the UK has always seen itself as somewhat removed (both geographically, and for some who still hark back to Empire: "better").

 

[Blackswanwood]

Oh it's definitely a good thing. I mean, I think it's a good thing - it's hard to trust the morons we have in government at the moment due to their long (and regularly) displayed lack of competence, and abundance of malevolence (meaning they'll likely either bollerx it up, or they have plans to use it to line their own pockets). To reuse my analogy from a couple of pages ago; I'm just a bit cynical when someone's making a really big positive deal about the new wooden leg they claim they'll give you, when that's the same person that cut off your real one in the first place (whilst claiming that was a great idea too).

I do like that analogy but some would say that the leg was bad so needed cutting off.

Given we have a deal now with the EU that has been accepted by our elected officials and it is what it is what do you think are the best practical things for the UK Government to do?

 

[RobinBHM]

I'll accept your point, but it's not been cut off, at present it's a bit wobblier than it was but we don't know whether it will get tightened up. We also could have an extra leg.
My view point, very simplistically was, the EU will collapse and I think first out is best. Rather than multiple countries running for help / cover.
So I still believe we did the right thing.
I know you can chastise me for that view but I believe it will happen as you obviously beleive trade with Europe will collapse.
Also I don't accept it has to be binary, and this thread would be better served if people would give a little bit. A discussion is better than an arguement, back slapping is not helping either.

certainly the world economy will look very different in 2050

we will have been overtaken by: India, Bazil, Russia, Mexico, Indonesia

 

[RobinBHM]

the best practical things for the UK Government to do?

Get some adults in parliament.

people that understand data and know where Dover is, would do to start, work upwards from that

 

[Noel]

Folks, please take note. This not a C19 thread and will not turn into a C19 thread. Vaccines in the detailed context of recent EU-UK events, yes. Vaccine rollout and efficacy, no. C19 and if it's a sniffy nose or a life threatening disease or a wintery red nose, no.
If some feel it really necessary to go off piste then it'll be a simple matter of excluding you from the thread.

Just in case this was missed.

 

[sploo]

I do like that analogy but some would say that the leg was bad so needed cutting off.

Given we have a deal now with the EU that has been accepted by our elected officials and it is what it is what do you think are the best practical things for the UK Government to do?

Some would say; but generally they've been unable to give coherent reasons as to exactly why (lots of displays of a lack of understanding of the workings of the EU vs our own government, lack of understanding of how trade works, etc. etc).

What should the UK government do? Depends if we're talking about the incumbent morons or "government " in general?

 

[RobinBHM]

What should the UK government do?

Not so much the government per se, but for the UK to move forward, we need to start having some honesty and dealing in facts.

Mainly because whatever garbage comes from the government or the media, the facts of brexit in terms of the endless trade barriers are here and are starting to bite.

So I would say to the government: start talking the truth and stop gaslighting.

 

[Blackswanwood]

Get some adults in parliament.

people that understand data and know where Dover is, would do to start, work upwards from that

I agree

 

[Blackswanwood]

Not so much the government per se, but for the UK to move forward, we need to start having some honesty and dealing in facts.

I agree with that Robin. For instance the fact that Free Trade Agreement has been misconstrued as “everything will be as it was” should never have been allowed to happen.

Unfortunately I don’t know what the answer is as very few politicians (from any party) are willing to tell it as it is.

 

[billw]

certainly the world economy will look very different in 2050

we will have been overtaken by: India, Bazil, Russia, Mexico, Indonesia

1. Their growth rates are higher because they've got more room to grow due to being emerging economies. China's economy has benefited from huge infrastructure spending because they didn't have a decent road/rail/air network but you can't keep building networks forever.

2. Over time it's not really surprising that countries with much larger populations generate a larger GDP than we do. Indonesia's population is something like 5x ours.

3. At tenth in the world the UK will still have a significant amount of economic clout. Or should...... but we have no idea where our trajectory is heading over that sort of time frame.

 

[Droogs]

Still gong by that projection we are still ahead of the French, so maybe Brexits not gonna be so bad

 

[RobinBHM]

1. Their growth rates are higher because they've got more room to grow due to being emerging economies. China's economy has benefited from huge infrastructure spending because they didn't have a decent road/rail/air network but you can't keep building networks forever.

2. Over time it's not really surprising that countries with much larger populations generate a larger GDP than we do. Indonesia's population is something like 5x ours.

3. At tenth in the world the UK will still have a significant amount of economic clout. Or should...... but we have no idea where our trajectory is heading over that sort of time frame.

Yes indeed.

The Leave campaign has been arguing the EU has shrunk.....but what they neglect to point out is that EUs share of global trade has shrunk because China's has increased from $300b in the 80s to around $20trillion now.

I wasn't pointing out UK will do badly, but just making the point the global economic map is changing a great deal.

 

[Noho12C]

Still gong by that projection we are still ahead of the French, so maybe Brexits not gonna be so bad

What's the thing with the French ? Why always comparing UK to France ?

 

[Droogs]

It is a jibe at a very English trope. Seeing as the French have traditionally been the arch nemesis of the English and in light of that, if anything happens, even if it is disastrous for the UK or English people is, IF the French get it worse then it's fine. A dig at the perceved mentality of most brexiteers loosely based on around 100 years of history between the 2 peoples. Where did yo grow up Jupiter?

 

[doctor Bob]

Where did yo grow up Jupiter?

Hey my family is from Jupiter, pleasecan we try and be more considerate.
Not very PC to us Jupitarians.

 

[Blackswanwood]

It is a jibe at a very English trope. Seeing as the French have traditionally been the arch nemesis of the English and in light of that, if anything happens, even if it is disastrous for the UK or English people is, IF the French get it worse then it's fine. A dig at the perceved mentality of most brexiteers loosely based on around 100 years of history between the 2 peoples. Where did yo grow up Jupiter?

Whereas the Scots just like to see the English lose - I still have the emotional scars of watching England fail to qualify for the 2008 Euros in an Edinburgh pub. No Scotsman didn’t own a Croatia shirt that night!

 

[Droogs]

Well they say a Scotsman will always support two teams in an international tournament; Scotland and whoever is playing England