Automatic gearbox driving?

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woodbloke":3nbd5x4d said:
I've only ever driven one automatic.... BL Morris Marina, circa mid 70's :shock: :shock: ....put me off automatics for life - Rob
Aww come on, Rob, that's hardly a fair test... :lol:

Paul, as apparently our designated automatic-hater :wink: , I have to ask the inevitable question - have you driven one? I mean for a decent length of time (or even at all...)

Cheers, Alf
 
In my brief Auto driving experience I tend to use N for any waiting above a normal traffic light wait. This is mainly because I find it uncomfortable to hold my foot on the brake for too long, it hurts my back. In our manual car I will hold the brake and clutch down at lights and for longer. This still hurts my back but I'm too impatient (or slow) to get back in gear and go without stalling or revving. Maybe this is inexperience, but generally I can't understand why anyone would want to drive a manual car.
 
WiZeR":2058zipp said:
...snip... I can't understand why anyone would want to drive a manual car.

I agree, I often leave home having selected "Drive" and do nothing more than apply the brake until parking up at my destination, be that 7 miles to town or 190 miles to Dover, 2 hour comfort break etc. Hills, Narrow Lanes, Heavy Town Traffic, Autobahns are all so much easier to cope with, I do not think people who have never driven a good automatic realise how much more time an automatic allows to concentrate on road conditions and positioning.

As far as wear and tear when stopped on the brake, I would consider the very low drag load on the turbine and transmission oil infinitesimal compared to the loads applied when travelling at high speed, and certainly far less than inappropriate Clutch use on a manual gearbox. On my current vehicle I note less than a needle width engine rpm difference between Drive and Neutral. Brake wear? the last 5 automatics I have owned have all exceeded 50 thousand miles before having front pads replaced, I've had manual vehicles with far worse wear problems.

The Rear brake light problem for other drivers is a regrettable if in unlit road conditions and I often pull on the manual hand brake to alleviate this if a long hold is anticipated.

As for applying unnecessary brake pressure, hydraulic systems perform best under pressure, lack of it is the biggest cause of seal leakage, and in any case stationary loads are very small compared with a a high speed or stationary traffic stop situation. The only consideration in my opinion is the fact that you could be holding brake components against a very hot disc or drum which may not be desirable for long periods, but this applies to manual gearbox vehicles also.


Getting me overall and going back to the shed before the flack descends. :)
 
Alf wrote:
woodbloke wrote:
I've only ever driven one automatic.... BL Morris Marina, circa mid 70's ....put me off automatics for life - Rob

Aww come on, Rob, that's hardly a fair test...

Alf - I assume, tho' stand to be corrected, that you've never driven a 1970's BL motor.....Marina, Allegro :shock: :shock: tho' I do have to put my hands up and admit to owning, for a very, very short time, a Maestro - Rob
 
woodbloke":11ejlsdc said:
Alf - I assume, tho' stand to be corrected, that you've never driven a 1970's BL motor.....Marina, Allegro :shock: :shock: tho' I do have to put my hands up and admit to owning, for a very, very short time, a Maestro - Rob
Dunno - does a Mini count? I spent my childhood adhering to the tacky plastic-covered back seat of a Marina, so I know how to hate one though... :lol:

Cheers, Alf
 
Alf wrote:
Dunno - does a Mini count?

Don't think so Alf, not nearly so near the bottom 'o the barrel as the Allegro.....could never find 'Hot Maestro' in WHS tho' on the car mags shelf, tho' I did, to change tack a little, meet a guy in the 60's who actually believed that if he put some stripes on the panels of his Lambretta it would go faster, no word of a fib... honest 'guv - Rob
 
Alf":2khtnhck said:
Paul, as apparently our designated automatic-hater :wink: , I have to ask the inevitable question - have you driven one? I mean for a decent length of time (or even at all...)

Yes, all the way to Dusseldorf and back several times and numerous journeys in this country. It's my sister-in-law's Peugeot 205 automatic. She's nervous of motorways so she usually asks me to drive. It's actually a very nice car - 1.6 litre engine and all that so it goes well.

I suppose my views are based on learning to drive in the days when cars still had starting handles no cars had synchromesh on first gear (blimey I am old :shock: ). Some of the people who taught me to drive really knew about gearboxes and changing gear properly - it's a joy to see it done really well. Mind you, I suppose I'm a bit of an old fogey - don't really like anything automatic :roll:

OK, I'll stop moaning about automatic gearboxes - honest :wink:

Cheers

Paul
 
woodbloke":3axtj4vs said:
Paul Chapman wrote:
don't really like anything automatic

Hi Paul - .....assume SWIMBO's still got the Hotpoint Twin Tub then :lol: :lol: :roll: - Rob

Don't get me going on washing machines and dishwashers :lol: :lol: :lol:

Cheers :wink:

Paul
 
Saw a lovely Morris minor in Lane Cove Sydney today. Metallic Indigo respray and the body looks like it has just come out of Cowley. :eek:

Manual drive of course.
 
I drive a manual car and used to drive 30 miles each way to work where I would then drive an automatic range rover most of the day

when driving home and coming off the motorway I would sometimes forget and only the shuddering of the car would bring reality into play that I had forgotten to dip the clutch,

Nigel
 
back in the day when general motors spent a lot of money training me,
we had two kinds of automatics, the (in)famous gm hydramatic which was adapted by rolls royce, and the borg warner t35, which became a famous
racing box later. then came the powerglide which was gm's 3 speed hydra, and eventually formed the basis of the transmission in the famous chaparral racers of can am and lemans fame.

the basis of an auto is the speed at which the oil is thrown between the vanes of the clutch, as the speed falls, the oil pressure lowers, and the vanes have less drive and drag. in principal one takes ones foot off the throttle at lights, thus there are no real strains on the hydro clutch.

having driven autos for 30 years, the change back to manual a couple of years ago caused a major change in my driving since i had left foot braked for all that time. kind of embarassing to have no drive when you hoped to be stopping :oops:

although historically manual boxes were more economical than auto, these days, the fact that so many auto boxes have more than 3 gears and the computer chips which check the various things like mixture and air intake etc mean that in most cases the difference is no where near the 10-15 % it used to be.

many of the manufacturers have auto switch of devices for long periods,
in particular VW, others like cadillac now have devices which reduce the number of cylinders in use, this is because it is easier now with electronics to get the engines working at their optimum for most conditions, hence the ability to run at some speeds on fewer cylinders. in the case of vw, they automatically re-start when the throttle is depressed again to move away.

whilst i understand that many auto boxes are quite expensive to repair, they have become so standardised and so common, that often the repairers just rebuild one or two and swap them into the relevant cars which come in, hence reducing costs and timescale. and in many cases
for instance certain ford mondeos in the early days, the clutch change was about 600 quid for a 90 quid item because designers had forgotten they need changing, particularly after hill creep, or speeding off from the lights :twisted: :lol:

anyway my feeling after all this time is that leaving it in drive for a short time on the flat at lights is not going to create too much wear, not least since everything should be running in oil, it will maybe cut brake life, but not dramatically unless you have your tickover set very high, certainly easier than judging the clutch throttle ratio at lights.
:?
paul :wink:
 
Holding an autobox on the brake when in 'D' shouldn't cause any mechanical wear. It may however cause the transmission oil temp to increase slightly but the oil cooler would be rated for this situation.

The residual 'drag' is the oil-oil interaction across the vanes inside the torque convertor. The mechanical clutches operate when the box shifts up and down.

So, no you don't need to worry about holding it on the brake like you might worry about holding the clutch down on a manual (when you risk reducing the life of the clutch components due to mechanical interaction).

PS. The torque drag at idle does absorb power but not a significant amount that would be noticable in reduced average gas mileage.

cheers,

Ike
 
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