Advice for sheet goods - MDF or ply?

[EdK]

Hi there,
I'm trying to design a kitchen and am strongly leaning towards 18mm birch ply for the cabinets.

Probably with 6mm birch ply backs.

I also have some bedroom cupboards to plan and was wondering if birch ply would be a good choice or overkill?

I thought about 19mm MDF (MR) for the cabinets with 6mm backs.

So far for the bedroom cupboards I'm thinking face frame with a bead on the frame and inset doors / drawers.
I have a stack of 'brown tropical hardwood' from a joiner mate who closed shop and was going to use this for the frames and then paint it all.

So I could probably work out all the sheet material and get a decent price on birch ply and do the kitchen and bedroom cupboards in birch ply ... this would take time to come as I don't think they have it locally.
Or...
I could get the MDF MR locally and then wait for the birch ply (and make some mistakes on the bedroom cupboards first before attempting the kitchen...)

Any thoughts?
Cheers,
Ed

 

[RogerM]

I used 18mm melamine faced chipboard (MFC) for the main carcase sides and bases, and 9mm MFC for the back panels on my kitchen build. If you're building a kitchen from scratch you'll have better ways of spending your time without having to finish the inside of the units. Also MFC is easy to wipe clean. Use a decent brand like Kronospan or Egger which also offer a wide range of colours and finishes. Do not confuse these with the vastly inferior Contiboard "weetabix" from the DIY sheds which should be avoided like the plague.

 

[andersonec]

I would stay away from ordinary MDF purely because your screws will pull out very easily unless you use Water-proof MDF which is a bit more dense and is,,,'waterproof'..!!! then there is HDF (high density fibreboard) and given a coat of sealer (PVA) would be pretty good, you would have to get it priced up to find the best option.

Have a look at Wisa ply, Travis Perkins and Jewsons do it, don't know who else but it should be spreading round now.

Andy

 

[RobinBHM]

Mdf, whilst fine for making carcases, is a pain when it comes to finishing.

Kitchen cupboards add up to a large surface area and painted shelves scratch quite easily.

As Roger mentions, mfc is the ideal option for carcases, although having just noticed your location, sourcing may be tricky.

Birch ply will make very solid carcases and a nice pale timber colour if clear lacquered or even waxed.

There are a few kitchen makers that only like working in solid timber and so use pine board, but given the choice I would prefer birch ply.

Bedroom cupboards only get light use compared to kitchens, so you may opt for mr mdf and use a roller to paint. I dont like mdf shelves due its tendency to sag so would tend to opt for ply or timber.

 

[Mar_mite]

I would stay away from ordinary MDF purely because your screws will pull out very easily unless you use Water-proof MDF which is a bit more dense and is,,,'waterproof'..!!! then there is HDF (high density fibreboard) and given a coat of sealer (PVA) would be pretty good, you would have to get it priced up to find the best option.

Have a look at Wisa ply, Travis Perkins and Jewsons do it, don't know who else but it should be spreading round now.

Andy

Not true. Screws will still hold in ordinary mdf. And will be ok for a wardrobe. If you budget will stretch, mr mdf is better and the edges are easier to get a good finish on. And mr mdf isn't waterproof, you couldn't build a boat out of it. It's moisture resistant.

 

[EdK]

Many thanks for the advice and input - much appreciated.

So here are some options:

MFC : 18mm cabinets with 9mm backs (@RogerM : What thickness of MFC did you use for the drawer bottoms?)
advantages : robust finish / can screw together / can take dominos for the face frame
disadvantages : any good around moisture? ie is it ok for the sink cabinet or do I need to use another material?

Birch ply : 18mm cabinets with 6mm backs (6mm / 9mm or 12mm drawer bottoms?)
advantages : solid material / can screw togther / can take dominos for the face frame
disadvantages : will have to finish (floor grade varnish?) / won't be as resilient as MFC in terms of scratches etc / ok for sink area?

MDF MR : probably not going to go for this as the fixing strength of MFC / birch ply is better?
Also not keen on painting / scratching....

Just need to work out how many sheets I need at the various thicknesses now and then get prices for MFC and for birch ply.

Any more advice, feel free to let me know!

 

[RogerM]

MFC : 18mm cabinets with 9mm backs (@RogerM : What thickness of MFC did you use for the drawer bottoms?)

Ed - I used Blum Tandembox drawers throughout - Stainless steel in the kitchen, and grey painted in the utility room. These come as a kit for all the runners/sides/fittings, leaving you to cut your own drawer bottoms and backs from your chosen material, so drawers can be made custom width to suit rather than just the standard sizes. The instructions specify 16mm material, and certainly Egger MFC is available in a few colours in that thickness. I had a lot of drawers to do so it was worth buying a couple of sheets of 16mm. However, if you only have a few, many people use 18mm (the same as they have for the carcases) and just rabbet off 2mm from the underside on the router table/spindle/table saw - whatever you have available, and that gives a perfectly acceptable result. Having built a kitchen from scratch, do not under estimate the amount of work involved, or the storage space needed for carcases, doors and drawers etc during construction and whilst waiting to be installed. If you use dominoes you will be able to flat packet each carcase to save space until you are ready to install. You will quickly find that anything you can do to speed up the process should be seized upon!

advantages : robust finish / can screw together / can take dominos for the face frame

disadvantages : any good around moisture? ie is it ok for the sink cabinet or do I need to use another material?

Dominos are great for fixing face frames. They hold the frame precisely in position whilst you fit doors and drawer fronts, and then they can just be eased off for final finishing and painting etc. You will find a pocket hole jig invaluable for final fixing of faceframes.

MFC can be wiped clean with a damp cloth, but as with any form of timber, avoid getting the exposed ends wet. No problem in making the sink cabinet from MFC - you're not going to be flooding it I hope. Just make sure that you get a good seal along the back of the work tops and around the sink.

For cutting sheet materials I would strongly recommend that you use a simple cutting programme to get the most out of your sheet materials. I used Smart 2D Cutting and found it absolutely invaluable. Very intuitive to use. You get 30 days unlimited use, and after that you are limited to 30 components at a time unless you buy the full version. I was too tight to do that and found that 30 was OK, but if starting again i think I would buy it as it will pay for itself in no time at all. I was cutting full sheets of MFC with only 3 or 4% wastage using the programme.


If you don't already have one, get a track saw. I got a Festool TS55 specifically for the job, and it has been brilliant for cutting up panels and also for fine tuning doors and drawer fronts to size. The ability to be able to trim a precise 1mm off a door/drawer with accuracy to get a good fit was a real joy.

HTH