A request for advice on saw purchase..... Again....

[Kalimna]

Greetings all,
Many apologies for yet another thread about bandsaws/tablesaws. The poblem is, I will be receiving a new piece of shiny workshop toolery in the form of a bandsaw or a tablesaw, and I think I could do with some impartial advice.
I currently have a 4 year old Perform CCBB (I think that was it's name) bandsaw which I don't feel has enough grunt to saw 4-6 inch hardwoods (native and 'exotics'). I find it very difficult to saw a straight line (even with the fence) with it, though poor blade may be part of the problem there.
So, I thought I may go for an upgrade to something like the SIP 01444 or Record 350.
Therefore my first question is - can anyone shed any comparison on these two models? Reliability? Ability to cut thickish wood? Accuracy of fence and ease of blade setting up?

My second question is - would I be better off sticking with the CCBB (buying decent blades) and instead purchase a table saw?

My main reason for the new purchase (apart from Chrimbo approaching!) is that my (recently) pregnant wife would like a rocking chair made for her (I was thinking of following the Hal Taylor plans. Eeek!) and a few items of baby-furniture. So a fair amount of ripping of planks into strips would be called for.
So, if a table saw more useful, then what would you recommend in the £400-£500ish price bracket?

Thanks for reading through my ramble, I look forward to any advice given.

Cheers,
Adam

 

[matthewwh]

Hi Adam,

First off - Congratulations!

A lot of unhappy bandsaw experiences are down to the blade, which is relatively inexpensive to remedy. Most machines come with a 4tpi blade and when people fit a sharp 3tpi blade they are amazed at how deep, fast and predictably it can cut - I certainly was the first time I tried one, it was like a whole new machine.

3 is fine for anything down to about an inch in thickness and although you do get a slightly rougher surface you can account for that as long as the cut is true. If you are looking to use the full depth of the machine often then you may even want to go a bit coarser.

Hope this helps!

 

[TrimTheKing]

Matthew is right (as always )

Don't even think about spending money on a new bandsaw until you have put a decent blade in the one you have. I can almost guarantee that it will seem like a completely different machine with a quality blade in it!

Matthew does some good ones, as do Axminster.

 

[Kalimna]

Ok, thanks for the advice so far. Given that I bought the machine from Axminster, that is where I also bought the blades from - am I likely to find any improvement by trying more axminster blades?
I realise, too, that my technique may play a part here also!

I am quite happy to try further blades, and in that case, do you think it may be sensible to purchase a table saw? I point this question particularly in the direction of those of you having already completed a Taylor rocking chair ....

Thanks,
Adam

 

[TrimTheKing]

Ok, thanks for the advice so far. Given that I bought the machine from Axminster, that is where I also bought the blades from - am I likely to find any improvement by trying more axminster blades?
I realise, too, that my technique may play a part here also!

I am quite happy to try further blades, and in that case, do you think it may be sensible to purchase a table saw? I point this question particularly in the direction of those of you having already completed a Taylor rocking chair (Mathew for instance)....

Thanks,
Adam

Hi Adam

Firstly, did you buy a new blade from Axy or use the one that came with the saw?

On the tablesaw, I have one and it is very handy, but it really does depend on what you think you will need to do. You can do almost everything you can do on a tablesaw with a handsaw and bandsaw (albeit with a little more thought and cleanup work). But if you get the bandsaw tuned up and working fine, and still want a tablesaw, then it will be a very nice luxury to have.

HTH

 

[Kalimna]

Hi Mark,
The answer to your question is 'both', I have bought extra blades from Axminster, the original one, and a couple from a local ironmongery/toolshop (now out of business). And whilst I did notice a difference with a fresh blade, it never seemed to be 'comfortable' (sorry, cant think of a better way of putting it!) cutting anything thicker than about 2-3".

I think my reasoning for a table saw is that I expect to be doing a fair amount of turning rough sawn planks into slats for laminating up and for cutting into strips, and general dimensioning.
I realise that handsaws can do (with some practice) all the angled cutting that a table saw might be useful for, but if I need to true up 3-4 mm of wavy cut each time I am ripping a slat, then I imagine I would be tearing my hair out simply flattening timber, and not getting on with the enjoyment of building something.

And given, as you say, that a bandsaw can do most of what a table saw can (if set up properly), but can also cut curves, I felt that getting an accurate bandsaw might be a better use of 500 notes.

Does that make sense?

Thanks again,
Adam

 

[TrimTheKing]

Hi Mark,
The answer to your question is 'both', I have bought extra blades from Axminster, the original one, and a couple from a local ironmongery/toolshop (now out of business). And whilst I did notice a difference with a fresh blade, it never seemed to be 'comfortable' (sorry, cant think of a better way of putting it!) cutting anything thicker than about 2-3".

I think my reasoning for a table saw is that I expect to be doing a fair amount of turning rough sawn planks into slats for laminating up and for cutting into strips, and general dimensioning.
I realise that handsaws can do (with some practice) all the angled cutting that a table saw might be useful for, but if I need to true up 3-4 mm of wavy cut each time I am ripping a slat, then I imagine I would be tearing my hair out simply flattening timber, and not getting on with the enjoyment of building something.

And given, as you say, that a bandsaw can do most of what a table saw can (if set up properly), but can also cut curves, I felt that getting an accurate bandsaw might be a better use of 500 notes.

Does that make sense?

Thanks again,
Adam

Yep, makes sense. Firstly, have you spent time setting up/tuning the bandsaw (compensating for blade drift, setting up guide bearings etc)? That can make a massive difference. And what TPI blades have you tried?

If the answer to that is yes then it may just be that it isn't man enough as you say.

If you do all that first (plenty of threads on the subject on here, and plenty of people can help if you want...) and it still doesn;t perform then I would go for a better bandsaw. But if you can get the bandsaw doing what you want then the tablesaw would be a very nice luxury.

I would suggest speaking to Matthew at Workshop Heaven and get hold of a decent BS blade, then spend time properly tuning the BS (assuming you haven't already) and make your decision after doing that.

If you need any help with the tuning just shout.

 

[woodbloke]

As Mark and Matthew have rightly said, a new blade will make a vast difference to the performance of your machine. I always use Axminster blades and have found them very good. The very best advice though is to ring Ax and speak to one of their technogeeks to order their blades over the 'phone. They used to do blades that were made from 14 thou stock which could only be ordered that way, and they now do 'meat and fish' blades as well (got one on my machine at the moment) which are again excellent but slightly thicker. Axminster have also taken delivery of a 'state of the art' blade welder and whilst the old welds were good, the new ones are absolutely seamless - Rob

 

[gidon]

You can't beat a table saw for reptitive cuts like that.

I have the Record BS350 and use it with decent blades - but the finish from a bandsaw is not great. For me the single most useful feature of a bandsaw is the depth of cut - resawing for example is very difficult any other way (6" Maple):



If you already have a bandsaw - I'd get a decent blade as advised and spend the money on a table saw for what you have in mind. If you find you're limited by the cutting capacity - then perhaps think about upgrading at a later stage.

Congrats by the way!

Cheers

Gidon

 

[TrimTheKing]

My main reason for the new purchase (apart from Chrimbo approaching!) is that my (recently) pregnant wife

I forgot the main part, Congratulations

 

[Kalimna]

Thank you all for the advice so far - and thanks also for the congrats
Not sure whether to be excited, scared, petrified or merely concerned that mucky pawprints will soon be found over my shiny guitars! Tis an experience waiting to happen indeed. We nly got married in september, so it was a minor shock for the inlaws
But onto woodier things.......

To sum up the advice so far - try a better blade to start with (by far the cheapest option as far as bandsaw concerned), and maybe think about a table saw....

So, can any of you enlightened folks suggest a table saw in the £400-£500 bracket? I was thinking of the Makita MTL100 perhaps? Unfortunately I don't think I could stretch to Record. What about the axminster? I realise that many posts have been written on the subject in separate threads, but sometimes it can be difficult sorting the wheat from the chaff, if you know what I mean?
It can't be too large, as the workshop (sorry, garage) doesnt have space for a floorstanding cabinet type.

The only other reason I had been thinking bandsaw was that Rutlands seem to have the SIP 14" heavy duty one at a considerable discount to anywhere else, to the tune of £100-£120 depending on website...

Thank you again for your experience and helpful advice. And thanks for the happy congrats on imminent sprogg

Adam

 

[woodbloke]

I've got the Kity 419 with aluminium tables but it's a bit more than your price range. I've had it now for the last 10 years or so and it's never let me down. The Axminster clone is much cheaper with cast iron tables...but they may not be flat, so it's worth checking - Rob

 

[Kalimna]

Thanks for the suggestion. Having a quick look online, the Kity comes in just under budget for the base machine, without sliding tables etc. I imagine that these could be added at a later date?
My problem is that Ive no experience at all with table saws, so have very little knowledge to use in comparing various brands and models. Hence the plethora of questions.
The Axminster one still looks attractive on price if nothing else, however it's always good to have other opinions and experience.

Ta,
Adam