WIP - Cogitation - Designed by Clayton Boyer

[Ian down london way]

I do love the interaction and encouragment on here - thanks guys.

I must admit, this kinetic sculpture was me taking a break from a hard(er) problem....

I have in the past made something called a marble chest, whose plans I got from Forrest Designs:
http://www.foreststreetdesigns.com/Marb ... _Plan.html

Really fun to show working, but it runs only for about 1 minute at most. The link has a video of one running, mine was made close to the plans. Apparently I have to make another similar one, as I've two kids and they are fighting over who gets it when I die. :lol:

So, having made some clocks, with varying degrees of success, I set myself the challenge of trying to combine a clock concept with the marble chest concept, so allowing a weight to be used to re-raise marbles back to the top of a marble chest type thingy - so it would keep running till the weight reached its end point - maybe 30 minutes.

I started with prototyping different ways of raising marbles, given some torque being available from a cog. I came up with 7 or so concepts - which operated in very different ways. I prototyped them all, but my second concept design was the most effective, although not the most asthetic. However it suffered from a run-away problem - it just got faster and faster, where as I wanted one marble raised every 3 to 5 seconds. I had to introduce some means of making it run at a constant speed.

Ah, that's what the escapement of a clock does - I hear you say - quite so. However, on a clock, the pendulum swings once every second or so, and gears down the hands to turn more slowly. Where as I needed to raise about 1 marble every 5 or so seconds.

So, I struggled with this for a couple of months, got rather frustrated. So, in need of envigoration, I decided to take a break in November, hence this item.

When its done, I'll either do another marble thing (there are four here: http://www.foreststreetdesigns.com/Catalog_page.html) or return envigorated to design my own beast.

So, here's a challenge, How many significantly different ways can you think of to raise a marble using the power of a falling weight.

Enter your ideas here in this new thread: raising-marbles-using-gravity-t67070.html

(NOT IN THIS ONE !!!)

 

[Graham Orm]

Not sure about raising marbles....but could you slow down your runaway problem using a fan? Not a conventional 'cool me down' type. Imagine a windmill with the sails turned through 90 degrees. I'm sure I've seen something like that somewhere to regulate the speed of a spinning object.

Been for a look....here ya go. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bJhIGWiMwwg

 

[stevenw1963]

Cracking stuff this

 

[Ian down london way]

The Escapement - Part 2

Firstly, apologies for the very long delay. A combination of several issues, partly, making stuff for Christmas (some butterflies on flexible dowels - you can see some in pic 701 - more cogs on earlier), plus my workshop was pretty damn cold for quite a while.

Anyway, I'm back out here, the temperature is much better, and I've completed the next tranche of bits.

So, the next set of parts are all about the escapement and the parts holding the weights.

Its at times like this that you just have to make the bits, without necessarily understanding how its all going to work. Having said that, I was following some of the instructions and they really didn't make sense. An error in the plans, I have concluded. We shall see.

So, the next set of parts comprise:

• 
  The escapement mechanisms (* 2)
  two sets of wheels to allow weights to hang down from two threads
  Thread redirection cogs

So, here are the first few parts sitting there waiting for the off:

Had some problems with the sizes of the small wheels. They are used as part of the structure which supports the smaller counter-weights. It turned out that there was very little wood in the structure holding the wheel, and I kept finding the support snapping. After three attempts I gave up, and amended the length of the wheel holders, which game me more wood to hold it all together - job done (they must have really strong wood in USA, is all I can say).

So, first job, is to try to install the weights. There are two sets, one for the top escapement and one for the bottom. Each set comprise a pair of weights, one heavy, one light. This is a common arrangement in clocks and the like, where you don't have a winder. Instead, you lift up the heavy weight (by hand) and the light wright then draws up the slackened supporting 'string'.

Now, to make that work, the weights have to work against each other, but the plans show them pulling onto their respective large wheels, in the same direction. That can't be right. Not helped by the instructions also talking about winding the 'thread' (well, I used fishing line) anti-clockwise, but that's really ambiguous (is it the thread's direction, or the direction you rotate the wheel to wind on the thread, which is the opposite direction.

Oh well, two threads, two directions, at least there is a one in four chance of getting it right first time. We shall just have to weight (haha) and see.

So, this is what it looks like with the weights mounted, with a close up of the weights:

You may see that the weights themselves are not the most attractive items. They are scraps / blocks of wood laying around in my workshop, but will do for now. They do have the benefit of easily being fitted with hooks, and I just need them to hold everything taught. Mind you, I did find I had to wedge the cogs so they didn't accelerate to a truly impressive speed (took a good 20 minutes to find the end cap which flew off one of them as one reached supersonic speed).

Next is the escapement, and with that, lots more brass rods to be fitted.

The two sets of escapements are doing the same job, but gravity is working in opposite directions. They each comprise two parts, one which catches on the brass pins and one which catch on the outside wedges. They pass control of the release of the escapement wheel back and forward.

Here are the parts (with the wheels):

And here they are fitted, well almost.

Now the reason they aren't working just yet, is that the 'pendulum' isn't fitted.

That will be in the next posting - I hope not too far in the future, as I'm back in the swing now.

bye for now. Looking forward to the sun they are predicting for next week !

 

[devonwoody]

You are a better man than me. (hammer)

 

[AES]

I second that - you're a better man than me too Sir. Really interesting posts, good clear pix and excellent precise workmanship.

Congratulations and please keep it coming (or the "clock" going if you prefer).

Thanks
AES

 

[Hermit]

Just found this thread yesterday, thanks to a friend. A great build and a very descriptive WIP. Superb work.
I'm along for the remainder of the ride.

... Steve

 

[Gary Morris]

Wow, just read the thread. Fantastic, please carry on. I like the marble threads too, clear tubing, very clever, you'll all ways know where the blockage is.

Gary

 

[Ian down london way]

Wow - Switzerland and Australia !!

Cool !!

 

[spinks]

keep the pics coming, cant wait to see it finished!!

 

[Ian down london way]

9th Report : The big Wheels

Nearly there ! (I hope).

And so, the light at the end of the tunnel starts to appear.

Time for the large wheels, which actually are the pendulums - although exactly how it works in that role, is still a little unclear.

I find large pieces like this rather satisfying. I'm using ply, but as its non-structural, I could probably get away with any wood, but the consistency of the pale wood, I think, is quite nice.

The plans show two different styles of wheels - I've gone for the simpler, symmetric ones, rather than the highly asymmetric design which required aluminium strengthening. I can always change it later.

So, the pic below shows the simple design of wheel.

However the fates are against me. First I get a call from my niece who is giving some acting courses and wants some props for 'that play' (wooden swords). So that kept me busy for the weekend (made 7 in the end):

Then my daughter (doing architecture at Uni) wanted to use my workshop for her context model. She did a really good job - really nice small holdings (and buildings) - which you can't see:

So, two weeks later, I'm back with my big wheels. Slightly unsatisfyingly, the plans call for the use of ball bearing races. And the use of "phenolic tubing" of various sizes. Well, I've never come across that, and google's not helping much (at least in the UK), so i'm adapting the plans to avoid its use. Cross fingers.

Ball races (imperial size) are available over the web, but not cheap. After wondering if I can get away with brass tubes rotating around polished brass rods, I commit to spending £17 on 5 little ball races (1/2 inch across, with a 1/4 inch hole in the middle).

Anyway, decided to cut two wheels at a time on my hegner. needs lots of careful use of masking tape to keep it all aligned. I'm very conscious that the wheel needs to balance, and I'm expecting to have to either add weights, or slice out some wood at the back. But the more accurately I can cut a symmetric wheel, the better.

So here are the two of them, together with some stuff which are to be glued to the back of the wheels, that will hold 'thread' to attach these big wheels to the escapement mechanism - spinning the big wheels back and forward.

So, here is a close up of the wheels mounted on the central brass rod. Through the ball races, with the pulley type wheels glued to their backs, and a decorative item in the front.

All ready to start adding weights and threads to make it work !

Major crossing of fingers time !

I must admit, that the ball bearing race does give a really smooth action to the way the wheels move. If they were frictiony (?) It could kill the movement entirely. So we shall see.

Do vote with a thumbs up if you are still enjoying this posting.

I'm looking for what is my next project, and if I get lots of votes, I'll do a WIP for that too.

Bye for now !

 

[devonwoody]

Superb work and workmanship going on here. (hammer)

 

[AES]

@Ian down London way:

For small ball races of various sizes & types at good prices n with excellent service, I suggest you try Model Fixings:

www.modelfixings.co.uk

Usual disclaimers.

I have little idea about phenolic tubing, sorry, but any decent model shop should be able to supply brass tubing (in sizes which "nest" one inside the next) and which match to the standard sizes (SWG) of piano wire (music wire if you're of the US persuasion). Look for a K&S Metals display in the shops.

Hope that helps.

Lovely work as usual Ian.

Krgds
AES

 

[Hermit]

Good stuff, Ian. I've been looking forward to this latest installment.
The pics of the big wheels being cut on the Hegner really show the scale of this clock.
Looking great, mate. Keep up the good work.

 

[paultnl]

Just found this WIP, when is the next instalment?

 

[hanser]

Looking forward to an update.

Some info on 'phenolic tubing' - http://www.tufnol.com/tufnol/default.asp?id=109

 

[Ian down london way]

Thanks for that Hanser. Looks like that is an heavy weight engineering company. Probably not going to want to sell me a 20cm rod.

Anyway, my WIP is complete. I'm just going to take some videos and pop them on youtube, so the final installment can have stills, and a link to the beast working. Should be in the next day or so.

 

[Ian down london way]

Last Update - The completion

And so it comes to pass that at last the WIP is no longer a WIP. Its a WC (work completed?).

And so this is the last update to this forum.

The final jobs on this project were to get the weights to look nice, any last bits of tweaking, and then move it to its final resting place (?), the kitchen.

So, first the main weights.

The plan called for 1lb 13 oz weights. Well, apart from the pain of having to convert everything into a sane unit of measurement (praise be to SI units), I decided not to use brass tubes (such as is used in grand father clocks - very expensive), nor copper tubes, as suggested by the plans (tricky to source of the right size). So, I tried turning some attractive spalded wood that I had around, and was rather pleased with the results. To get enough weight, I had to turn cylinders that were 11cm across. They looked great. Spend time time polishing them up, and on my test set up in my workshop they worked a treat.

Unfortunately, and as spotted by my wife (even more unfortunate that!), the distance that the supporting line was from the wall where it was going to have hang, was only 3cm (the perils of a non-representative workshop set up), so the weighs would be rubbing against the wall - bad news. So much for the use of that nice wood.

After some maths (I knew my O'levels would come in useful one day) I worked out that even with the most dense wood I had - Oak - it would take 66cm long cylinders to make the main weights clear the wall - well that wasn't good!

Plan B.

I tried drilling some 10mm holes into a 6cm diameter cylinder of wood, as deep as my (now perpendicular) pillar drill could go, and fill the holes with lead shot. I used 10mm as I had a set of plug cutters, the largest of which is 10mm, so allowing me to plug the holes neatly. Unfortunately, I couldn't get enough lead into the cylinder to shorten it enough.

Plan C.

Sliced my original cylinder in half, creating semi-circular weighs. They were only half the weight they needed to be, but as they were much wider, I could drill out lots of 10mm holes.

I figured I could let the flat side of the semi-cylinders (?) run up and down the wall, and they would still look fine. I was quite pleased with the result.

I turned one of the smaller weights, with a nice aesthetic curve to them. However, after my wife burst out laughing when she saw them, I threw the phallic shaped weight out and stuck to simply cylinders for the others too.

After some discussion, and negotiation, the precise resting place for this WIP was chosen, replacing a slightly defective wooden clock (what woodn't go). However, problem - its above a radiator. Now I could have tried to move it to one side, but that would mean mounting it above an electric point (hum - when I hung the woodn't go clock, I did manage to fuse the entire utility room, but that's another story!) so I thought I'd stick to a slot above the radiator, but now the main weights would foul on the radiator - best laid plans and all that.

So, Plan C2 was hatched.

I needed a stand off, to redirect the weight 12 cm away from the wall, so it would clear the radiator.

Mark 1, neat and compact. Brass rods to run the thread around (which by now was 20lb fishing line).

I used oak for the cheeks, which was good and strong (and reclaimed from my previous kitchen cupboard doors, I like reusing wood with history I know). Needed some dowels to give good grip for the mounting screws, but that was straight forward.

Only trouble is, with the fishing line having to turn around two right angles, even when the line was waxed, I had to add another 6 ounces to the weights to make it work!

And so, on to plan C3.

Less redirecting of the fishing line (and extending it another 2 cm out, as I hadn't allowed on the Mk1 for having to move to the middle of the weight where they are supported - Doh!), by turning through 45 degrees only.

I still needed to add a little more weight, but I managed to squeeze in a couple of more 10mm holes, plug them, and all was well.

So, Done !!!

Time to move it to its final resting place.

Here, the frame is mounted, but with the escapements removed.

And here it is with everything in place !!!

And just in case you would like to see, I've taken a simple video, and popped it on youtube - which is here:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XMtHK1rYoP8. You can see how the escapement works, which is very cool.

By the way, the dog's called Barnaby - 3 years old

And if you are curious about the item to the left, you can see that working here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ivE3fkDbXHs.

Well, its been a long journey - started November 2012, finished late June 2013. A few delays along the way - what with xmas, and out of action with some health stuff in May, but its all done.

I've chosen the next project, which is to be another marble chest (I have done this one already : http://www.foreststreetdesigns.com/Marble_Chest_Plan.html.

These are the plans I've bought. http://www.foreststreetdesigns.com/Bell_Tower_Marble_Machine_Plan.html. Whilst its large (100+ pieces), its not as complex, I think, as a clock. So, something more relaxing to make.

Worth another WIP here? What do you think?

 

[Graham Orm]

Brilliant! well done, wish I had the patience for something like that.

 

[Harbo]

Fascinating - well done!

Rod