What's the general view of scraper planes?

[Andy Kev.]

I was wondering about scraper planes because given that smoothers and hand scrapers exist, one could almost think that they would be superfluous to requirements.

Has anybody bought one and regretted it or is there anybody who simply wouldn't be without one? Are they actually better than scrapers and do they really add much to the surface produced by a smoother?

 

[rafezetter]

I was wondering this too to be honest, do they live up to the "hype" and worth the cost (unless you buy a cheaper knockoff) but having recently used a #80 scraper plane I really liked it - Here's a link to a recent project and I have to say the scraper did a really good job, and my thumbs were grateful for it.

http://s982.photobucket.com/user/Rafezetter/Woodworking experiments/Woodworking Restorations/story

The larger bed helped knock off any residual high spots, plus stopped me from gouging as well and the handles meant more pressure could be applied without strain. The finish was also really good, but you need to make sure the edge is properly prepared to acheive this.

The ease I used it to remove old paint from some reclaimed boards was also a breeze, and cleaner than a hot air gun. I can definitely say I'm a convert and will be using this method more often.

Edit: In case you were talking about the actual planes like a #4 but with a scraper, last year I saw Richard Macguire use one on some particularly gnarly grained wood at Richard A's charity do last year and it cleaned up that wood with ease. I was only the other day looking at a toothed scraper coffin plane on ebay for some indian rosewood I have aquired that's giving me tearout issues.

 

[Paddy Roxburgh]

I use a stanley No.80 on difficult timbers all the time, I don't know if that counts as a "plane". It's great on boards with reversing grain and loads easier on your hands than a card scraper. It also leaves the wood somewhat flatter than a card scraper. As far as finish goes it probably is not as good as straight off the smoother, however I only use it in situations where the smoother is tearing the surface and it's good enough for me. If you don;t have one get one, they're dirt cheap (£10-£20) on ebay. The only downside is the edge doesn't last that long if your doing a lot of wood.
I too have seen the premium scraper planes on the internet but never in the real. Not quite sure what they could do that a no.80 can't. I would be interested to hear from any owners.
Paddy

 

[Paddy Roxburgh]

just to add, I ticket the edge and turn the burr with a carbide burnisher from WH. They only cost about £20 and are dead fast, same for card scrapers. As with most sharpening jobs it is a bit tricky at first but after you've done it a few times it's dead fast.

 

[David C]

Great tools.

I found that a Hock blade more or less doubled the performance of my 80. (Workshop Heaven)

The nasty short blades supplied today are horrible.

When doing large table tops, the 112 scraper plane comes into its own.

David Charlesworth

 

[Beau]

I fall into the wouldn't be without camp. Got the Lie Nielsen 112 and it has changed the way I work. Clean faces with a light scrape to clear planer ripple and final light sand. Once you get the hang of sharpening you can get the most perfect silky finish. No hand planing then sanding out little patches of tear out with various grits. Used to use the Stanley that was good but it's harder to control when working across the end of a board.

 

[custard]

I've used an 80 for many years, but as I scrape a fair amount of veneers I thought it would be worth trying one of the fancy Lie Nielsen scraping planes to see if that gave any performance benefits, or even just re-assurance benefits in that the larger sole is that bit less likely to dig in and ruin a veneered top at the beginning or end of a cut.

If you're new to veneering then there might be a case for owning one, but if you've clocked up the hours using an 80 you'll find very little extra advantage in one of the more expensive Lie Nielsen scraper planes, plus I really don't agree with LN's sharpening advice for this tool, IMO just set it up the same way as you set up your 80 for best results.

The other thing to remember is that scraping just isn't that effective until you get to the harder hardwoods. So if you build things from softwoods or softer hardwoods like Poplar or Elm then scraping probably won't work as well as a really sharp, finely set plane.

 

[Beau]

I really don't agree with LN's sharpening advice for this tool, IMO just set it up the same way as you set up your 80 for best results.

Yep don't mess around with their suggested angles far better results when sharpened like the Stanley ie sharpen at 45 degrees and turn the burr at 15

 

[David C]

I demonstrate the usual, 80 type sharpening method in my 6th DVD "Five Topics."

It works best for me too.

David

 

[Racers]

I like my scraper plane its much nicer on your thumbs than a card scraper.



The one Richard Macguire was using.

Pete

 

[D_W]

I like the small one that LN makes above all others. I don't use it, but I like it. It's excellent for scraping the bottom of a japanese plane.

I've had other large ones (a 112 stanley, a LV version of the same thing), they always seem to be a more difficult way to finish a surface than a smoothing plane, especially if the wood has had a chance to move at all between when you last touched it and when you want to scrape it.

When I did use a scraper, I had much better results following David C's (which is probably what LN trumpets) advice about polishing the bevel and fixing the burr to a specific angle each time. Surface finish is nice on very hard woods that way.

 

[David C]

L-N used to suggest 60 degree with no hook. Don't know if this is still the case.

My DVD shows 45 degree with a hook. The only trouble with this method in a large 112 type is that there are many things the beginner may get wrong !

Sharpness, blade angle, bevel angle, force on burnisher, angle hook turned to, size of hook and finally blade setting........... Some of the reasons I was keen to demonstrate on the DVD.

The 112 really comes into its own for veneered table tops.

David

 

[mouppe]

I had the LN large scraper plane and liked it for a while, but then sold it after it fell out of use. I prefer the simple card scraper for most work, or the Veritas card scraper plane sometimes if I have a lot of scraping to do and I know the hand scraper will get too hot to hold.

You can't really compare to them to smoothing planes as you tend to reach for the scraper when the smoothing plane can't do its job. Put another way, you're not adding to the smoothing plane's finished surface but using the scraper to tackle areas where the smoother can't perform.

 

[Bluekingfisher]

I have both the Veritas large and small scraper planes, I find them useful in certain circumstances.

I am currently working on a small project at the minutes with acacia with particularly nasty gnarly grain, which I managed to tear chunks out of in a couple of spots (even with a high angle frog). Between the two scraper planes they saved my bacon, and although not a perfect surface it has redeemed somewhat my initial rash attack of the boards.

I don't think however you will need one unless you work with difficult grained woods. That said, on the odd ocassion you may need one it could pay for itself on that one job.

In addition, I consider them to be good value for money, I believe they are now around £125 for the large plane. I would go for the Veritas over the LN on this particular plane as it has a little more versatility and more simple to set up. IMHO

David

 

[Gerard Scanlan]

I have the Stanley double-handed scraper plane. I am very happy with it. I also use card scrapers, but this plane is a lot less strenuous to use than a card scraper can be, especially on large surfaces.

 

[rxh]

I have a LN cabinet maker’s scraper plane. The instructions that came with it recommended an angle of 45 degrees and no burr, at least until some experience has been gained. I found this worked well and I have prepared the irons of the scraper planes I have made in the same way, also with good results.

 

[Andy Kev.]

Thank you all for the replies.

David C: I have your 5 topics DVD as it happens and I had a look at the bit on scraper planes again last night and it answered a lot of questions (I'd forgotten that bit as scraper planes weren't even on my horizon at the time of buying the DVD).

I've done a bit of further research and come to the conclusion that if I were in the market for one, I'd probably go for the Veritas large scraper because it allows one to put a slight bow into the blade where that is thought necessary. I suspect I won't need one though until confronted with a bit of wood that can't be finished off with a well adjusted smoother plane.

 

[David C]

Glad you found it useful.

There are quite a few issues with good scraper sharpening!

David

 

[matthewwh]

Great tools.

I found that a Hock blade more or less doubled the performance of my 80. (Workshop Heaven)

The nasty short blades supplied today are horrible.

When doing large table tops, the 112 scraper plane comes into its own.

David Charlesworth

Twernt me, honest guv.

We don't sell a No. 80, but we do have a rather nice 112.

https://youtu.be/t5ufCEF8duU

 

[Beau]

Great tools.

I found that a Hock blade more or less doubled the performance of my 80. (Workshop Heaven)

The nasty short blades supplied today are horrible.

When doing large table tops, the 112 scraper plane comes into its own.

David Charlesworth

Twernt me, honest guv.

We don't sell a No. 80, but we do have a rather nice 112.

https://youtu.be/t5ufCEF8duU

Love the sound of a nice sharp scraper blade

Do you sharpen yours with a slightly convex blade?