wadkin JTA restoration

[wallace]

Here we go again folks. You don't realise how big these machines are until your next to one. This is in pretty bad condition.



Everything is heavy so a block and tackle is needed







The electrics were 'modernised' maybe 30 years ago presumably when it got its lovely coat of green paint.



The hinges snapped when I opened the electric panel, that's the first time I've had that happen so I think this has stood outside for quite a while.

 

[wallace]

Can anyone remember the name of that rust remover that you add to water, I think Jimi was an advocate of the stuff for restoring hand tools.
Theres a couple of really rusty parts that I wont be able to use electrolysis because brass and ali on them

 

[memzey]

I think it's restore rust remover by Shield technology Mark. I've got some and it works a treat. Lovely machine by the way. I'd love one but don't have the room!

 

[memzey]

Have you seen Jack's one by the way? Awesome, awesome machine. Watching his vid of it on YouTube made me want one even more!

 

[murdoch]

Great to see another machine being restored, always great to follow your threads Wallace. Out of curiosity, what to you do with the machines you restore, keep to use or sell? Also, would you consider being payed to restore for others?

 

[wallace]

Thanks for that. I haven't got room for it either. Jacks machine is in fantastic condition.

 

[n0legs]

I'll be glued to this, like usual.
Good work Wallace =D>

 

[AndyT]

Jimi used Corro Dip, because he bought some for 50p at a boot fair.
This first post about it includes a link to the seller.

post492579.html

 

[wallace]

Thanks Andy I ordered enough to make 10 ltrs of solution.



The bobbin has a neat way of lubrication the ways, it has a little resovoir that holds oil with wicks that take it slidy parts. This one was full of water.



The sanding bobbin is well and truly rusted on, I tried levering it off and nothing, I heated it up and nothing, I left it swimming in plus gas overnight and it still wont budge



This machine must of had a proper wack to break all of these castings.





It took me a while to work out how to get the motor and mechanism out.



This machine must of been maintained pretty well before its accident. The bobbing mechanism is well greased and the ways are in good shape.

 

[TFrench]

You've got a challenge this time! You can weld cast with stainless mig wire if you have a welder? Have you got bobbin properly hot - like oxy-acetylene hot? I find it works on most things, might need a couple of heat cycles though. We've just got a induction heater at work, I've only tried it once in anger and it's incredible. 20-25 seconds and it had nuts glowing red.
http://www.bolt-buster.co.uk/#1

 

[heimlaga]

That looks to be a very useful machine. I wish I had one.

Anyway I think you are fortunate that the broken cast iron paerts are that small and simple. If they turn out to be beyond repair you could always make new ones either fabricated or cast.

 

[wallace]

I've only been using a blow torch no oxy gear. I got some of that de rusting solution so I might submerge it in a bucket for a while.
I think if things don't weld up strong enough I think I could fabricate the hinges reasonably easy enough, there the main loads bits.

I got everything stripped from the main casting and lifted of the pallet that was starting to succumb to the machines weight.



Luckily lots of grease

 

[wallace]

A bit more done



The oil ways were packed solid with crud





I thought I'd try that magic de rusting stuff and I'm not impressed, this part has been in the solution for 6 hrs and nothing.



Mmm bronze caged double row bearings

 

[wallace]

Theres one thing I really like when doing these machines is the finishing touches done by hand by a guy in 1956. The angle pointer is made from cast brass and you can see that its been hand filed to get the point in the right place.



I bought some shield technology rust remedy from workshop heaven thinking it would help clean bits. Its not cheap at £27 and I was really disappointed by the results. It says it removes rust after a couple of hours. I left a piece in for 24 and it did diddly squat. I contacted them and they said did you degrease it, and with what. I had used gunk which apparently is no good. They don't tell you on the instructions that you even need to degrease. Then I was advised I should buy there degreaser at another £25. I asked if its possible I got a duff batch.

I had to do it the old fashioned way with a wire wheel, and then used cold blackening solution.



And heres my second rant, I bought some Boeshield again not cheap at £20 a tin, used it a few times and then it wouldn't spray. Contacted the company and they said its cold weather stick it in some warm water. Still doesn't work. I have a tin from two years ago which still works.

I've got loose balls



I found a bearing but it came and I've cocked up, its single row and not self aligning.



This little lot is the tilt for the table, everything came apart reasonably easy apart from one little pinned collar which wouldn't play nice and took 2 hrs to get off.



I was hoping to use the magic deruster on this but I might set up electrolysis tub.

 

[furnman]

Mark, really enjoying your thread as always. You really are a restoration pro!!. I have also been very disappointed with these rust remover chemicals and really never seem to work very well. I think the best way is to get the rust off by mechanical methods then just fine coats of fine oil to stop it coming back. I really liked your blackened bits which have come up really well. Have you found that these blacken parts stay rust free in the past ???

 

[wallace]

I cant be sure of the blackened longevity because I sold the machines I used it on. I find the blackening works best straight from the wire wheel after being degreased.
I was hoping to use the de rusting solution on the bobbin that's stuck on the spindle, I cant use electrolysis because the bobbin has aluminium on it. I still don't get why its so stuck, it only touches the shaft at the top and bottom. It would be a shame to have to cut it off, these bobbins are like rocky horse poo to find.

 

[Jake]

Bi-metallic corrosion innit.

Have you tried repeated heat cycles?

 

[Bm101]

I feel like I'm possibly about to attempt not only trying to teach Gran how to suck eggs but probably tell her that hens lay eggs as well and that not only that but nearly all 9000 species of birds lay eggs. (I actually wrote a long and convoluted Joke here about 'the Tragic Flightless Emo', realised I was on the wrong part of the internet for that sort of humour and deleted it. You'll have to imagine it.)
Being a self confessed rank amateur and a bit of a duffer to boot it's not like I have any semblance of being an expert to lose anyway and possibly it might help.

I used a bit of that shield gear Wallace. Again without degreaser. I was also a bit disappointed. I got most of a couple of bottles, deruster and degreaser , from a joblot on here and looked forward to the dream results I had read about. Picked up a couple of really badly rusted Preston spokeshaves a while back and like you chucked em in. No degreaser because lets face it, how greasy is a rusty spokeshave likely to be? :| Nuffink. Zilch. Nada. Took em out the next day and there was little to no difference.
Sod that. Citric acid and water it is then. Less aggressive than vinegar/salt and less faff (Caveat! unless you already have it set up! :shock: ) than electrolysis which I still haven't got round to trying. Maybe we're missing a trick. Should affect metal that is rusty though. I can understand degreasing for lightly rusted stuff where oils and so on have been in contact but on heavy rust it seems strange to me there seemed no effect. Going to save my stuff for specific applications, minimal derusting, careful, no aggresive removal etc. Maybe it's better for that?

Loving the work as always. Following closely.
Cheers
Chris.

It's taken me so long to type that Jake has answered and now I'm going to have to look up bi-metallic rusting. :|

 

[wallace]

Jake I've heard of rust caused by dissimilar metals is that the same thing. I've driven land rovers for 27 years so you get to see it quite often in all its glory. The strange bit is the parts that are touching are both steel. I only have a blow torch but I might get some oxy gear to try brazing.
Chris I consider myself an amateur also, I generally just make it up as I go along. I think I will just get my money back for the magic water, I've been sending messages all week explaining what I've done and asking maybe I got a duff bottle.
I'm all excited I'm making another trip to the wadkin factory tomorrow, the wifes under strict instructions not to get ill again

 

[TFrench]

If it's a proper bottled propane torch you're using it should be generating enough heat to get things moving. A plumbers torch isn't man enough. Oxygen and propane are a good substitute for oxy acetylene and its easier to get hold of and store. And its cheaper. Acetylene can get things a bit melty...

Edit
is there anything any good left at wadkin? I could nip down tomorrow afternoon maybe if its worthwhile!