Wadkin AGS 10" vs 12"

[Lamb]

Hi guys,

As the title suggests, what is the difference between a Wadkin AGS 10" and a Wadkin AGS 12". I've read the data sheets for both which gives the size difference in the depth of cuts, table size, weight, motor, etc.
But structurally, are there any parts between both that are interchangeable?
Like, the cast iron feet, the main pressed steel body, the cast body, trunnion, hand wheels, etc... Are these parts interchangeable?

I ask as I have a 12" Wadkin AGS, and was thinking about trying to source a 10" for parts. Would this be possible?

Thanks.
Lamb

 

[MusicMan]

I have an AGS10 but don 't know anything more about the interchangeability with the 12. I believe the operational difference is just the depth of cut. it does seem to me that the AGS10 is a much more common beast secondhand than the larger one, so your question is worth asking.

 

[Trevanion]

This question has also been on my mind as well, what is the difference? Am I right in saying an AGS10 is still able to take 12" blades?

A friend of mine has an "AGS10/12" model, don't ask me what the difference is with that!

 

[Hornbeam]

My old AGS 10 took a 12 inch blade but wouldnt lower fully below the table. You had to fit a 10" blade for that
Ian

 

[Trevanion]

 

[Doug B]

If you go Facebook Lamb & search for the Wadkin appreciation group, you’ll have to join but they are a really helpful bunch & I'm sure someone on there will be able to positively answer your questions.
I used to have an ags10 & as has been said it would take a 12” blade & I also imagine most of the components are the same but can’t say for definite.

 

[SammyQ]

My old AGS 10 took a 12 inch blade but wouldn't lower fully below the table. You had to fit a 10" blade for that
Ian

Yup. Correct. I also have an AGS 10" and have tried this out. It works, but you run the risk of a shredded table insert and severely discoloured Y-fronts ("G'wan" that generic title ages me, I know!) if you get too excited and raise the blade too high while still running.
No, it's not DAMHIKT; I am far too cautious around a 3h.p. motor to have a 'war story'.

I also believe - as in faint memory - that the 12" frame and cabinet combo is a bruiser compared to the 10". We really need Scrit back from the dead to answer this properly? In his absence, Mark in Spennymoor (a.k.a. "Wallace") may know the definitive answer, as may Jack Forsberg, if he can be persuaded to emerge from 'The Wadkin Temple'.

Be safe, stay out of the axis containing the blade, Sam.

 

[Lamb]

Hi guys,

Thanks for all the replies so far.

Doug, thanks for the tip. I'm not actually on Facebook but I created an account to search, but, I can't seem to find a page titled "Wadkin Appreciation Group". Would you happen to have a link? Or is my search too specific??.. when I just search Wadkin, I get random stuff!

Hi Sammy,
Thanks for the reply. That's really the information I'm looking for. To know if the cabinet is the same dimensions on both the 10 and 12". So you think they may be different, just need to verify this.

But even if so, there could be other parts that are common across both machines.

Thanks again all!
Lamb

 

[Doug B]

Doug, thanks for the tip. I'm not actually on Facebook but I created an account to search, but, I can't seem to find a page titled "Wadkin Appreciation Group". Would you happen to have a link? Or is my search too specific??.. when I just search Wadkin, I get random stuff!

https://www.facebook.com/groups/1746238365689311/?ref=share

 

[Lamb]

Doug, thanks a million for the link. I requested to join to hopefully should hear back soon! I'll post back here with anything I find out!

 

[Lamb]

Hi guys, so I haven't heard anything back from the Wadkin Appreciation Group. So I was wondering, would owners of Wadkins AGS 10 and 12" saws be willing to take measurements of particular parts of their machines and share with us here?

 

[ScottandSargeant]

FYI...
There was a 10´´ Wadkin AGS table saw which took a 10´´ blade and a 12´´ which took a 12´´ blade(also a 14´´ version).
The bases were different... they then modified the 10´´ machine and called it a 10/12´´. It would take a 12´´ blade but it would not lower below the table. They continued to produce both. These were then face lifted and became Wadkin AGS 250/300 and a /P version of it had scoring And was the same guts as an SP12
see:
https://www.scosarg.com/media/leaflets/Wadkin/Wadkin AGS10 Table Saw Bench.pdfhttps://www.scosarg.com/media/leaflets/Wadkin/Wadkin AGS10_12_14 Table Saws.pdfhttps://www.scosarg.com/media/leaflets/Wadkin/Wadkin AGSP Table Saw Bench.pdf

 

[Lamb]

FYI...
There was a 10´´ Wadkin AGS table saw which took a 10´´ blade and a 12´´ which took a 12´´ blade(also a 14´´ version).
The bases were different... they then modified the 10´´ machine and called it a 10/12´´. It would take a 12´´ blade but it would not lower below the table. They continued to produce both. These were then face lifted and became Wadkin AGS 250/300 and a /P version of it had scoring And was the same guts as an SP12
see:
https://www.scosarg.com/media/leaflets/Wadkin/Wadkin AGS10 Table Saw Bench.pdfhttps://www.scosarg.com/media/leaflets/Wadkin/Wadkin AGS10_12_14 Table Saws.pdfhttps://www.scosarg.com/media/leaflets/Wadkin/Wadkin AGSP Table Saw Bench.pdf

That's fantastic, thanks for the reply. So even though the cabinet is bigger on the AGS 12, does that mean that all the internal parts are beefed up also? Are there any common parts between the two?
As I was thinking about trying to source a tired/clapped out AGS10 for parts. As they are far more frequently available.

Thanks again Scott and Sargeant!

 

[MusicMan]

I have a 10 but I don't know the answer. I guess that if yours was a 10/12 the answer is probably yes, but if it is a true 12 then probably no. If you want to measure any part you think is critical I could measure it on mine (as long as it is accessible!)

Some photos (including the type plate, see Trevanion's pic) would help a lot.

 

[ScottandSargeant]

some parts are différent.. here are the manuals For the old type Wadkin AGS Table Saw
hope they help!

 

[Lamb]

some parts are différent.. here are the manuals For the old type Wadkin AGS Table Saw
hope they help!

Thank you very much for the reply and manuals! Much appreciated!

MusicMan, thank you for the offer of measuring some pieces! I'm up to the neck over the next few weeks with work, but once that quietens down, I will take some measurements of my saw and maybe you would do the same and we can post here and compare?
That's great! Thank you so much!

 

[SammyQ]

Right, weighing back in, and working off my tinchy phone screen, look at the links. The 12 is 10Kg heavier. That is 23lbs in old money, SOMETHING is very different. The other dimensions seem comparable, bur at least one photo again leads me to suspect the pressed steel bases are the same 10 vs 12, but the upper, CAST, cabinet may be a size 'up' in the 12? That would chime nicely with the extra weight.
Just to be awkward, it could also be same size top, but a beefier arbour and main casting inside.
Sorry my memory of Scrit's original comments is so hazy.
Sam

 

[deema]

I’ve restored a number of AGS10’s and AGS12’s [easily distinguished by having T slots in the table rather than straight sided slots] what parts are you looking to source? It would be easier to suggest a solution if there was just the odd part. There are not a lot of common parts.

 

[Lamb]

Hi all,
Thanks again for all the replies.
So good news and bad news. As I mentioned previously, I have purchased a Wadkin AGS 12" saw - unseen in person, but the seller provided lots of images and information and I was happy I knew what I was getting for the money - we agreed on a price (not cheap, but what I think the machine was worth). I work long hours, so it has since sat covered in its shipping wrap on a pallet in a shed here. It's the earlier fore and aft rail/fence. It does need a bit of work; paint, wiring, etc. Unfortunately, it is missing a left extension table - which I was aware of. But on closer examination (while still secured on its pallet), it is also missing the canting handwheel - not a big deal, juts something I noticed today. So I haven't taken the table off yet to investigate the internal structures, but hopefully it's all good!!

So... In my quest to have my complete dream Wadkin AGS 12", I found another for sale. It was in slightly nicer condition that my original saw, but it also was missing a side extension table! (The 12" x 34" extensions), so I thought this would be ideal as a donor saw or use the original as a donor. So again, tight on time, and a good distance from the seller, I was provided with details and images of the saw. Agreed a price (dearer then the first but I was still happy as it had the later style fence) and I arranged pallet collection. So I excitedly examined it on delivery! Bad news starts here....not only was it not a 12" AGS (it's a 10"), it wasn't even an AGS! It's a 10" BRT! Contacted the seller, but isn't answering.... That's that. From what I can tell is, the AGS and BRT are similar regardless.

So, as most people here have kindly parted their wisdom regarding parts not being compatible, I took a tape to the outside of the two saws for comparison. The cabinet of the 10"BRT is approximately 18" square (both the pressed steel main frame and the cast iron fame being similar/the same). The cabinet of the 12" AGS is indeed larger at approximately 21" wide by 22 1/2" deep. To make maters worse, even the canting handwheel of the 10"saw is 6" in diameter while the missing canting handwheel of the 12" saw (if the same size as the height adjustment) is 7 1/2"!!! . So I'm not hopeful for internal components being compatible.

I'm not discouraged! I am really looking forward to restoring this saw for my workshop. But I need to source a table extension, handwheel, (and possibly something on the inside once I open them up) for it to make it complete. The other thing I have been considering is restoring the 10" saw also and keeping it, and making it part of an outfeed table as the only dimension of both saws the same, is the height at 34"!!

I'm really thinking of doing a detailed recording of the restoration for a thread here (or possibly a video for YouTube - I've never done one before) as I have gained so much from reading your threads here, I think its only right to give back.

Thoughts?
Does anyone have a spare 10" and 12" Wadkin AGS extension table under their stairs that they would part with?!
Also, to anyone who has restored their saws (@deema especially), how would you suggest about restoring it? Should I just start pulling it apart?

Thanks again for all (and apologies for the long post!
Lamb

 

[SammyQ]

There is a chap called rodders on eeBaygum who cannibalises AGS's. He had at least some of this want list, last time I saw it. Pricey though. I have a 'pelican' blade cover if you are interested and I'll undercut rodders with glee if you need it.
Farmer Giles (I think) on here had a breeding stock of AGS's too. He MIGHT be able to help, I suggest a tentative P.M. ( now called "conversation"???).
Sam